Everyone has something of value to say in the massive conversation we call 'ART' that has been taking place since humans began. Sometimes though, our perceived flaws, prevent us from finding our voice to express what is inside us, stopping us from participating in this conversation. Being different/flawed is an asset. This is a powerful conversation about how to find our way to seeing our flaws for what they really are, our superpowers, so that we can bust out and be a part of this universal conversation.
We all have the right to call ourselves artists even without degrees - but with that comes a responsibility and Susan tells us what she feels those responsibilities are - this was one of the deepest and most significant explanations of this I have ever heard and I cant wait to hear how it landed for you.
Please find the post about her episode on Instagram @kateshepherdcreative or @thecreativegeniuspodcast and leave a comment sharing what came up for you when she said this!
Susan speaks directly to the listener who is yearning to take the next step into a life as a full time artist. Practical thoughtful mentoring type things, that are enormously helpful.
There is some in depth homework including two weeks worth of FREE WORKSHEETS you can do at home to help you find out what "flaws" are holding you back and what your superpowers actually are so that you can begin to say what you came here to say in this life. Powerful stuff.
ABOUT SUSAN LOGORECI
Susan Logoreci, a wildly successful commercial and public artist, has an eye condition (Strabismus) that almost prevented her from being able to make art at all. And paradoxically, as we'll hear, was the very thing that has led her to be the artist she has become.
Her drawings have been seen in Art in America, the Los Angeles Times, Harper’s Magazine, as well as many other periodicals. She has drawings in several collections including the U.S. State Department, City National Bank, Creative Artist’s Agency, Marriott and Hilton Hotels, Los Angeles Metro, Los Angeles County Arts Commission and in several law and urban design firms. Her work has been exhibited nationally and internationally.
She has also completed several public projects in hospitals, light rail stations and airports. She currently lives and works in Los Angeles.
Her art comes down to this: she wants the viewer to feel the delight and wonder of places and at the same time be inspired to take care of them and always be making them better.
WHAT WE TALK ABOUT
-Where creative impulses come from
-The conflict between realism and abstraction in art
-Intentionally looking for new ways to see things
-The eye condition she has (Strabismus) causes her to not see three dimensionally this “failure” to interpret every day life the way the rest of us do led her to not only see the world but also create art in a way that is completely unique to her. The things we think are our impediments, are pointing us to our superpowers
-Accessing your ‘inner delinquent’ to unleash creativity
-seeing differently as an artist is an asset - how can you use it
-The way you are different is an asset - and how you can use it.
-Accessible tips and suggestions for getting grants and finding your path to becoming a public artist - her absolutely brilliant idea for the person who wants to get into making public art-How she designed her largest public art project a staggering 10,000 square foot with 28 wall pieces in Phoenix airport!
Challenge to all listeners! If you felt a little something inside you perk up when Susan was talking about getting grants to do public art like on the utility boxes - challenge - go Find out how public art is governed in your area and apply! And join the creative genius family on facebook and share your experience, learnings and journey with it
RESOURCES USED IN THIS EPISODE
-Southwest Terminal at Phoenix
Have you listened to the previous Episode with Willow Wolfe?
Susan Logoreci 0:02
It's like almost like if I could say it, I wouldn't have to do it. And as a kid, you just know it. Everybody knows it. I think most people do as a child. And then there's this sort of amnesia that happens, you know, and it's just so hard to get back to it. But it's such a vital part of being alive.
Kate Shepherd 0:33
Hello, my beautiful friends. I'm so happy to be here with you. And I just wanted to say that start off today's show, I've just I think about you all the time imagining who could be a great guest who's going to reach into your heart and ignite. And I walk around my world thinking about you and that more often than probably anything else. So thank you for bringing me that joy. I wanted to tell you, you know, one thing that has happened to me over the course of the last year in making this podcast is I've kind of lost my way from my own artwork. I've had a couple of friends and listeners say to me, Hey, be careful about that. Because you know, you can't let your work take away from your creativity. And I've thought about that I knew I wasn't painting as much and I wasn't making as much jewelry as I had before. But I'm creating this beautiful podcast, which is another form of creativity. And so I'm kind of off the hook a little bit with that. That being said, I have been back in the studio a lot more lately. I've done some painting, late at night when the kids are asleep. And most recently, I've started to make again, Pebble bellies. Pebble bellies are a little smooth, dark stones that I gather by hand, one at a precious time, from this gorgeous beach, about eight hours north from where I live here in British Columbia, where the orcas rub their bellies on the beach. And it's one of only two beaches in the world that we know of where they do this particular behavior. It's a social behavior, and they do it together in groups frolicking, and socializing, having fun, and it's amazing to witness I've sat on the beach, 12 feet from orcas who are rubbing their bellies on the beach there. It's absolutely magical. And I make these necklaces called pebble bellies, and I started to make them again recently, there is a waiting list for these and it is worth the weight, I promise you. And I also want to make sure you know about the guided meditations and journal prompts and worksheets and other kind of homework II style stuff that I've been offering you. At the end of each episode, I am starting to make sure that there's some sort of activity for you to bring to life, the lesson and the learning and the juiciness from each episode. And above and beyond that, I'm also recording some guided meditations for my Patreon members. So you'll get access to those when you become a patreon, you can have the whole library of everything I've ever created. And I've also made some available for individual purchase for people who want to have access to some of that content, but who aren't maybe ready to make the commitment of becoming a monthly Patreon supporter. If you're not part of the creative genius family yet, it's a private Facebook group. It's a beautiful little community that's sprouting up and it's a safe space to share about your creative struggles and joys and what you're working on and what you're excited about. And I wanted you to know how much we would love for you to be there with us. Everything I've just mentioned can all be found on Kate Shepherd creative.com. That's sh E P H E rd creative.com. Just search for the thing that you're looking for, whether it's pebble or family. If you can't easily find the thing you're looking for just drop me a DM at Kate Shepherd creative and I'm happy to get back to you. And I'm pretty quick about those things. We got lots of gorgeous reviews this week. Thank you for continuing to send those in, I truly feel that they're gifts from you to me. They really fill my heart. This one was from D cars came via Apple podcasts, D wrote, Kate radiates warmth and sincerity in this podcast. Her guests are interesting and informative. And the questions she asks go much deeper than art supplies. They speak to the heart of the creative, they inspire you to ask yourself some of these same questions and to dig deep into the mindset of your own creative soul. Truly a gift. Thank you, Kate Dee, thank you for saying that. You articulated exactly what my intent is with this show. You know, I want this to be something that inspires the listener to look into themselves and find out the answers to the things that they're looking for. Because all of these answers are ultimately inside of us. When we hear something out in the world. You know, whether it's between me and a guest or something that you heard on the radio or read in a book somewhere. When it resonates really deeply it's not because it's a new thing. It's because this is something that already lived in your heart and it's a remembering and I really want people to remember how creativity lives in each and every one of us. So Dee, thank you for that gorgeous review. And if you haven't left a review yet, please take a minute to do that today. It really does bring me so much joy keeps me going on the days when I'm feeling like maybe I can't. And there are days like that, you know, this is a lot of work. And also a really helps people who haven't maybe listened to the show yet who are deciding whether or not to listen to the podcast for the first time helps them decide whether or not it's a click worth making. So it really does have a nice ripple effect when you take a minute to leave a review. And you can just do that by going to Apple podcasts and scrolling down to the bottom and leaving a review. I'm really excited to share with you today's guest there are so many wonderful moments in this episode and practical useful things that you can take with you into your art practice that will not only deepen your acceptance and love of your flaws and how your flaws actually make you better. But also practical advice on how to get started in your own art career if you haven't done that yet. Susan Lago Betsy is a special human being. She's got that amazing rebel energy, but it's kind of hidden in this quiet, almost demure personality. But she does reference her own inner delinquent a few times, which I love. How do we find our inner delinquent that just wants to break the rules. So important for creativity. Susan has an eye condition called strabismus which causes her to not see in three dimensions. And as you can imagine, as an artist, that might be a little bit of an impediment, right. Obviously, that was difficult for her. But really, this flaw. And I put that in quotes was ultimately the thing that allowed her to create art in a way that nobody else can. She sees the world in an absolutely unique way. And her work is stunning. Suzanne has done some incredible large scale public art projects, and her largest one is a staggering 10,000 square foot installation with 28 wall pieces at the Phoenix Airport. She gives some really accessible, useful suggestions and pointers for how to get grants locally in your region. I'm very excited for you to hear this episode, and I can't wait to hear what you think. Here's my conversation with Susan blogger Betsy. Susan, thank you for coming to talk to us today.
Susan Logoreci 7:18
Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm
Kate Shepherd 7:19
very excited to be here. You're coming to us from Los Angeles where you live, right? Correct. Yes, I like to give people an image of like, where I'm in Vancouver, and you're in Los Angeles, I think people like to sort of have an idea of where's everybody? And on that note for for our listeners who don't yet know You, I wondered if you would start us off by telling us a little bit about your career as an artist and some of the inspiration behind your amazing work.
Susan Logoreci 7:43
Sure. Yeah. I'll give you the real the brief life story, I guess. Sure. I was born and raised in Monterey, California, the Central Coast. And my parents were not artists. Actually. My mom had an English degree and my dad was from Albania. He came here as a refugee after World War Two. They were older parents, and so they weren't artists, but their value system was arts driven. I guess you can say like we had a lot of books in our house. We had a lot of paintings like original paintings. You know, art, the arts, very important. We were creative family. We're not allowed to watch television too much. So I grew up kind of like writing plays with my brother and sister and just doing creative things. My dad passed away when I was in high school. And after that, I was sort of I wouldn't say I was a juvenile delinquent, but I was like juvenile delinquent adjacent. You could say, Ben ended up flunking out of high school and going to junior college, I got to take my GED. My mom told me I could either get a job or go to college. So I went to college. And I started studying art there. And that really kind of awakened the artist in me, I would say that's when my kind of art life started. So I did that for a couple of years. And I got a scholarship to go to art school in San Francisco. And I ended up at the San Francisco Art Institute where I received my Bachelor's of Fine Arts degree. I met my husband there. And that was a really interesting school. It just closed actually, this last year, they just had their last graduating class. It's was the only art. So I think maybe even in the world that didn't give design degrees. It was just a fine art school. When you walked in the door. It was like you were treated like an artist, you were to start your life's work. You know, there wasn't there were classes, but it wasn't really driven towards assignments. So that was very powerful. And then after that, I ended up moving to Austin, Texas with my husband. And we lived there for a couple years and just had terrible jobs and lived and made art and showed it wherever we could. And that was really fun and freeing and then decided we wanted to go to graduate school. So we moved back to California, to Los Angeles and I ended up getting my MFA at Cal State Long Beach. And then when I was in graduate school, I also worked at the Getty Museum. And I continued to work there after graduate school. And that was really an important part of my artistic path as well just to sort of see that legacy building the other side of things. And then I was also showing in galleries.
Kate Shepherd 9:58
What was the job there?
Susan Logoreci 9:59
I was like An administrative assistant, I worked in the service department within the museum's the department would actually get objects from all of the museum photograph them. And they would end up in books. And unlike the banners, you'd see around town advertising shows and brochures and things like that. So I would coordinate the how the objects would move in and out of the photography studios. So it's really interesting because I got to see a lot of things like Gauguin's cane and like weird stuff that like, you know, that was came for conservation that was never displayed. It was really interesting education that I got paid for, which was great. And I was also showing in galleries and making my art at night, because it was like a 40 hour week job, I had to kind of squeeze in my art making around that. But I was showing in galleries, and I started selling out shows and getting commissioned work. And I quit that job in 2005, and started just making a living off of arts ever since then.
Kate Shepherd 10:49
And what was your art at that time, I'm imagining you've, you've sort of discovered yourself as an artist by going to school and you had this amazing experience where you were just like, seen and treated as though you already are an artist like that is like you said, powerful, right? When we see something and then that person gets to step into that. So you've had that experience, now you're making art? And what kind of work were you making them? Is it similar to what you're doing now, or
Susan Logoreci 11:15
when I was in graduate school, that's when I started making the work that I'm making now sort of this type of work, where it's aerial views of cities, and kind of very kind of chaotic, some oftentimes, and very detail oriented. I've always done landscape based work, when I lived, I was in junior college and an undergrad, it was more imagined, I would say, add a lot of interesting exercises, I would just do that I still implement now in different ways. Like I would I did a lot of on site drawing and painting. So I would just go to a location and make sketches. Or even I would just ride the bus a lot. So I would draw when I was on the bus. And then I would take all this stuff home and and and oftentimes I'd flip the drawings over and cut them up or tear them up, and then try to reassemble them, and then make another piece from that just doing kind of played Where did you
Kate Shepherd 12:04
get that? Where did that come from? Like, where did that
Susan Logoreci 12:07
that involves? Yeah, just sort of like trying different ways to kind of put abstraction into the work. I've always liked that kind of conflict between realism and abstraction. That's always been interesting to me, you know, where those boundaries are? And, and sort of playing with that. So I had a lot of exercises I would do to push that as far as I could.
Kate Shepherd 12:27
And did those come from you? Or were they did they come from school? Like, were they given to you? Or did you come up with the modality
Susan Logoreci 12:34
a lot of them I came up with my own, some of them were inspired by assignments, you know, but you know, just looking for new ways all the time to kind of reinvigorate this idea of abstraction and realism, you know, and a lot of that came to from I should talk about this a little bit that I actually have an eye condition where I don't see three dimensionally, this quote unquote, failure to be able to interpret everyday life of using that as a tool as a jumping off point to talk about other things.
Kate Shepherd 13:01
We have something in common I see three dimensionally but I don't see with my eyes closed. I can't I have no yes. ability to visualize. Yeah,
Susan Logoreci 13:10
I didn't know that was a thing until until that episode actually went down a deep dive into Google about and there's Reddit threads about it. Well, I'm
Kate Shepherd 13:19
we're just start. It's one of those things where if you don't ever check in with somebody about it, there's it would never come up, you just assume that everybody sees the world. Yes. Similarly to you do so. What is that condition? What is your condition called?
Susan Logoreci 13:33
It's called strabismus, about three to 5% of the population has it? A lazy eye is what people know it as, but it's a lot more complicated than that, as, as I've learned, I was born with my eyes totally crossed. And I had four surgeries when I was a kid to uncross them. But I never saw with binocular vision, I never, you know, most people, their eyes kind of come together to appoint mine ice individually. And usually, I have a dominant, I actually just had my fifth surgery about six weeks ago. So I'm still kind of recovering from that process. You know, when I first started making art, I was not the best student because I really I couldn't, the Skill and Drill assignments that you know, you do in the beginning, which are incredibly important, even if you don't do them while you learn to see and that is so important. She's, you know, I remember the teacher sort of saying, I don't know, what's the object and what's the space around the object? You know, and I remember thinking, I don't always know either in life. And so just thinking about how, you know, how can you use that as a tool, you know, seeing differently as an artist and as an asset on like, day to day life,
Kate Shepherd 14:42
when I discovered that I had this thing that made me see differently. There was a and I probably talked about this in the episode that you listened to I don't remember. I there was a brief period where I felt like how can I be an artist and see the world so differently, and also be missing this ability to imagine it and like You know, see this, it felt like I was missing something because of my nature. It didn't take me long to go. Okay, Kate, like, snap out of it. Yes. Stop feeling sorry for yourself, Where's where's the gift? What's the gift in this? It sounds like you're saying that you also, I mean, it's an asset. But would you even go as far as to say that it's been a gift for you? And in what way?
Susan Logoreci 15:19
I know, that's tough. Because there, you know, there are like online support groups on Facebook and Reddit, where people, you know, share their experiences and support each other. And actually, I probably wouldn't even have had this last surgery, which has been incredibly helpful to me without those people. But a lot of people, you know, wouldn't do anything not to have this. And I can't say that I'm in that group, because I really have benefited from it, my life would be totally different. And if I didn't have it, you know, I wouldn't have gotten to do the things I've done. I wouldn't know my husband, like all of it would be I don't think I'd be an artist. I doubt why I had questions I think I wouldn't have had otherwise. I yeah, I have to say I it's weird that I am I do feel blessed by it. And oh, in a strange way, even though you know, especially during this time, I've had surgeries, a lot of pain after surgery, I felt like I had glass in my eye for a couple of weeks. You know, it's hard to say everyday is there's definitely moments I had, right that why me, you know, but why not? Me too.
Kate Shepherd 16:17
There's this sort of idea that runs through our culture that we should all sort of be a little bit homogenous, right? Like, there's normal, and everybody should kind of fall within that. Oh, sure. And, and actually, the things that make us different, really are what make us so special. You know, and I've said before, you know, it's a variation of a quote that I read one time, the thing that you hate so much about your art is actually the thing that makes it so special, you know, when you're having a hard day and you don't love your art, and you're being hard on yourself, that that thing that you're trying to not be is actually the magic that other people are drawn to. And so it is important, I think that we look at these ways that we're different. And because a lot of the Fantasia support groups that I've seen, are like, super victime. Everybody's like, I don't have this thing. Like it means, like, that's all they're looking at. That's all they're looking at it for me. I'm like, Oh, those that's true. I don't have those things. But like, My intuition is off the charts. I know things that there's no way most people would ever know. Because I feel incense and know from a different part of my brain. Yeah, it's just the way a blind person would have to navigate different, you know, your senses would change. Yeah. Yeah. To compensate for, you know, I think it is important that we start to really look at ourselves and say, I'm different in this way. And how is that a gift? Yeah,
Susan Logoreci 17:31
I value that, you know, I think the discussion is really changing, you know, the last couple of years is that this idea of a facial difference, you know, just those words together, that those are words, I grew up, knowing that that's nothing I can say to someone who maybe bullied me or ridiculed me, like, definitely, that happened to me growing up, you know, it's, we look for symmetrical faces. So if you have an eye that's going off in one direction, you know, people notice and they are always nice about it. So you know, I can see where people do go down that kind of wormhole of victimhood, but yeah, and the other day, that's not a helpful way to move forward, you know, but the conversation has changed so quickly around these issues to that, it's, it's really amazing. I love that for culture right now that we can actually put words to these things and and call it out, you know, what was that song that came out was gonna Lizzo song where she talks about being spastic. And people complained and said, actually have that, and it's really terrible. And she actually rewrote the song and we released it. And it's just like, Yeah, that's amazing. You know, that's so great. And rather than, you know, people feel having to just feel bad whenever they you know, it's like these conversations, actually, you know, there's a downside to social media and everybody having an opinion, but also, there are benefits to it as well. I think that there's conversations coming up, that wouldn't have happened otherwise. So I'm grateful.
Kate Shepherd 18:52
Absolutely. Okay, so I want to go back to so you're out of school, you're showing your work, and you have your first gallery show in LA and it sold out? What was going through your mind?
Susan Logoreci 19:04
Yeah, that was amazing. I waited until the second one sold out before I needed that health insurance and other things. But then I started getting commissioned work to and that was actually really cool because I started doing bigger things and those bigger things ended up in public spaces. And like in boardrooms and and lobbies and places like that, and then I started to say, Okay, I could do public art, you know, and so I started researching on how to get into that because I now that you can actually get a degree in public art. I mean, you get a master's in in it, but there was not a lot of information on how to get started, you know, how do you go from being a gallery artist to to working on a big project out of you know, and fabricating something and using someone else's money?
Kate Shepherd 19:55
Well, I've always wondered about that. What, what is that path like if there's something Listen to this right now going well, actually, I would love to create public art and like, do they need to go get a degree? Are there? How can you do it? Are there other ways?
Susan Logoreci 20:07
Yeah, I mean, you definitely don't need one, start small, I would say my first project I made, I didn't make money off of it. And I've heard the first two or three, sometimes you don't make money. So the first one I did was a temporary project at LAX, they have an amazing program there, where they hire contemporary artists to, and they give them anywhere for like six to $12,000 to create art for a space and you can hang artwork you already have, you know, and then just pocket the money or the smarter move probably is to fabricate something, and then you get the experience doing that and, and pictures of it. And you can use that to catapult yourself into the next thing. But even I don't know, if they do this in Vancouver, but the utility boxes around town in LA, they have a lot of other cities, do you know where people paint those, I mean, that's a great way to get started, go approach a store in your neighborhood and paint a mural, you know, go to your neighborhood council, your city council and try to get money for that. So at least you don't have to put out from materials, you know, start small like that. And then you take those images, and you can start applying for bigger things. Because it is a very democratic process. Actually, you know, unlike the art world, which can be very inside every the public art world is governed by laws. And so you actually apply and you interview and you have to have a whole proposal written with a budget and everything like that. And anybody can apply, really, you just have to be over 18 There's websites where you can go and find different cities that have calls out. And then you know, if you're lucky, you get an interview. And then out of that interview four or five people that pick one. And so you may get to that final, I get to that final place a lot of the time, and you put a lot of work into those proposals, they pay you a little, sometimes you don't get it isn't that can be frustrating. But you know, it's part of the ride. So
Kate Shepherd 21:46
that's life, though, right? This are such great ideas. I hope I can actually kind of my spidey senses are telling me that there's all kinds of people listening to this right now going, Oh, my goodness, I need to look up my local utility people to find the boxes. And yeah, it's a very exciting, accessible, doable thing.
Susan Logoreci 22:03
Google your city's Arts Commission, I would say every state, every city has an Arts Commission, or you know, contact your city council Mayor's office and ask who's in charge of the art because somebody is, you know, there's usually a budget for that. In California, they actually have a percent of new construction costs that often go towards art, that's by law that has to happen. Not every state has that. So we're fortunate in that way
Kate Shepherd 22:26
people can look for what's going on in their in their region.
Susan Logoreci 22:29
Yeah. Because I mean, I've worked with materials I've never worked with and you learn as you go to right. You know, they they guide you
Kate Shepherd 22:36
tell us about the floor and wall pieces you designed for the Phoenix Airport, how did that whole thing come up?
Susan Logoreci 22:41
Yeah, that was probably the largest project I mean, I might ever do was 10,000 square foot floor, and 28 wall pieces. amazingly large canvas very intimidating to cover a space that large. Yeah, I applied that again, you know, I just I applied I had a couple of large projects under my belt at that point. And that helps. Oftentimes, you have to manage the budget yourself. So when you get into these larger projects, they want someone who has experience but I didn't manage the budget, they actually picked a fabricator for me, and they paid them directly. So I didn't have to do that part, I just had to focus on designing the artwork, which was enough work in and of itself. So terrazzo floor, and terrazzo is for people that aren't familiar with that is a mixture of rocks and different aggregates, like you know, like be quartz granite, mixed in with things like a broken mirror mother of pearl, also mixed in with some type of epoxy and paint. And so what I ended up doing was creating this kind of concept of a glass bottom plane and as you it's a long hallway, it's a conductor bridge that connects security to the gates in the Phoenix Airport. As you walk through the piece, you go from these sort of images of city night lights on the floor, through daytime houses and these kind of irrigation fields that surround my irrigation fields like hay fields, things like that, that surround Phoenix and then ends up in the sort of mountain area and then there's wall pieces that are shaped by airplane windows where you see the similar views out of so you really have kind of it's just kind of our defied idea of a blast bottom plane.
Kate Shepherd 24:15
Wow. I would love to see it well so and have you seen people interacting with it and in what was that like?
Susan Logoreci 24:21
I have? Yeah, it was so exciting. I mean, I wait for the opening which was great. And you know, they had a mayor and they had you know politicians there and CEO of Southwest Airlines and because it's southwest terminal, and that was exciting and everything but really it was so fun to go back and actually photograph it with just regular people walking on and dragging their luggage kids kids get it I mean they just plugged right in jumping from it because of there's aerial views of houses jumping from house to house to Bush to Bush and there's like a lot of sage, Sage Bush elements in there as well and anyway they they just sort of dance to the whole floor all the all the kids just like really plugged in and then people doing selfies in front of the wall piece. says and it was great. really gave me a lot of joy to see that can't
Kate Shepherd 25:03
even imagine. I'm curious as you're describing that to me. And then also just knowing what your other work is like, how landscapes speak to you like, Why? Why, like, I love flowers, that's all Yeah, I want to paint is I can't imagine trying to paint anything other than flowers, as I'm looking at you like, you're probably like, I can't imagine ever making anything other than these. So what is it the draw for you unlocked? Is that Yeah. So what's that about? What is the one?
Susan Logoreci 25:30
Yeah, it's interesting. Yeah, it's always been landscapes. I mean, I think, you know, growing up on the Central Coast, definitely, there's a long history there of landscape art. That was definitely a lot of the first artwork that I really saw and connected to as well, I think was landscape based work. You know, from a psychological standpoint, I guess I would say, you know, I mentioned like, my father came here, as a refugee, he never went home, my mom came from military family, she moved around a lot, it was really important for them, to have us grow up in the in the same house, like we came home from the hospital in, you know, this idea of place as stable and fixed versus ever changing and unstable. I think I, I thought a lot about that, you know, at a young age. And also, you know, as I got older, I really, especially with cities, you know, it's a place where we work issues out in culture, manufacturing spaces are the places where, you know, our hopes and dreams and also sort of the not so great elements of our consciousness gets activated. I really enjoy that. And I'm always finding new places within it. That's very exciting. For me, I think I would have stopped a long time ago if I felt like I was done. And I'm sure you feel that way too. You know, it's like, there's always more there, you know, resume and I have no problem finding it. Yeah. And also, you know, one thing I remember when I was younger, too, when I was in art school, I went to the art of the painter Richard Diebenkorn to his retrospective and he was there in a wheelchair is very old. I think he died like six months later. And like, all his art was there. You know, you could really see this person's vision and their, their, their lives work just spread out, you know, in front of him and us. And just really remember thinking yeah, that's that's something you know, to just see this, there's a voice.
Kate Shepherd 27:17
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Susan Logoreci 28:16
Yeah, it's just that lifeforce. You know that that chi it's, I mean, it's interesting. It's like almost like if I could say it, I wouldn't have to do it. And as a kid, you just know it. Everybody knows it. I think most people do as a child, and then there's this sort of amnesia that happens, you know, and it's just so hard to get back to it. But it's such a vital part of being alive.
Kate Shepherd 28:40
So what is that amnesia?
Susan Logoreci 28:42
Yeah, that's, I mean, you can say it's, you know, capitalism. I mean, part of me thinks this, you know, I was listening to other podcasts where that woman was talking about which one to Guatemala. And it's like, that it's just a culture to serve. They're intertwined. And there's a lot of cultures like that, and ours isn't one of them. But you know, that can change, we can change that. I think this podcast is definitely adding to that change. You know, yeah, what happens, I mean, we get, you just get distracted. You know, there's a lot of distractions. I think, one thing that I learned as an art student, as the center of a hard truth is if you really want to make art, you just need to put your butt in the seat and do it, you know, and consistently do it. You know, and that's not an easy, it's very simple, but it's also very difficult and challenging to especially if people have families, I don't have children. You know, I think people that have kids made hats off to you if you're also have a creative life, because that's really time consuming. And it can be very challenging, I think, you know, give everything the time that they need. It's also
Kate Shepherd 29:46
really difficult to put your button the seat when there's this mountain of limiting beliefs that you're sort of raised in, in the fabric of the culture that you're in, you know, like only certain people are artists and they're very select few and you're probably not one of them and you know, Art good art has to look like this and or sound like this or whatever it tastes feel, look, whatever it is, like a certain way. And so it's really hard to actually get yourself into your seat to do the art, did you find that you had to come face to face with any of those limiting beliefs in your own trajectory?
Susan Logoreci 30:19
I mean, I feel pretty lucky because as I was saying, my parents were pretty supportive. They didn't like take me to classes or, you know, invest in me in that way. But they just let me do whatever I wanted. And and basically, let you know, the idea of serious play was in big in our house. You know, I think a lot of people have to like kind of bad teachers that have sent negative messages. Sometimes you're not doing this, right, you know, there's a right way and a wrong way. That type of thing that can really stop people from wanting to pursue it. I think I didn't have too much of that. I did. I did when I was first starting out, my good friend who would sit next to me in our classes in college, she was amazing, so talented. I mean, could, you know, I remember, she made a painting of a pool table look like you could pick the cue ball right off the table. I mean, she was incredible. And sitting next to her was often love it. Me with my lack of 3d vision, and like, oh, boy, never gonna be her. You know, and it was hard not to, to silence those messages and say, you don't want to be her. She's her, she gets to be her. And that's great. You know, you know, I definitely think the art world really benefits from a lot of that negative messaging of this is art. And that's not because, you know, it's an investment for people now, and they need a certain style to be more of an investment of certain times, and other times. And so this idea that, you know, it's not, there's not just an array, and, and all of the array is good and matters, you know, that you can't plug dollars and cents into that idea. So,
Kate Shepherd 31:56
yeah, what was the thing when you were sitting next to her? I'm just trying to imagine you in the classroom with her hyper realistic art. I mean, I would be super intimidated by that, too. But what was the thing in you that it almost seems like something whispered to you like, Don't worry, that's just not your thing. Like, because you kept going, that stop you, you kept doing anything, and look and look what you've created. So what was that? Do you remember? If you look back, can you can you think of what that was?
Susan Logoreci 32:23
Yeah, I think I did have this kind of already this kind of how would you call it was almost like a wildness to my line. And, and this really, like, I already kind of had my voice a little back then. And I and people recognize that too. So I got some positive feedback. Not that that should matter. But, but that doesn't hurt for what it didn't hurt for what I was doing, you know, even though it was different than what she was doing. And I thought, you know, yeah, it's okay to not be able to do that. And I love doing it so much. I mean, that's another thing. I am definitely a compulsive maker. You know, I couldn't stop if I wanted to, you know, I mean, it's just not possible unless I physically had to.
Kate Shepherd 33:07
What does that look like in your daily practice? Like your daily creative practice? Like, what are the things that you do to get your butt in the seat to nurture and grow? And what are your what's your rhythm and your and your routine? When it comes to
Susan Logoreci 33:20
Yeah, it's been so interesting listening to your podcasts and how other people do it to other people have like, really rigid studio time for like, a few months, and then they don't do it at all for a few months. And then it's all about outreach. You know, I've structured my life where I want to maximize studio time, because as I said, I'm a compulsive maker. And it's like, I feel like I'm just most, I'm just happier when I'm making stuff every day for as much as I have, which maybe isn't always healthy. I definitely have workaholic tendencies. But then there is this reality of I run a business and I have to spend time doing that as well. And I like doing that too. So I structure my day, I since I get work for myself, I don't like getting up super early. So I definitely have a slow morning. That's the gift to myself. And then I do kind of Office admin stuff during the more nine to five part of the day in case there's people I'm emailing back and forth with people because the bulk of my business is like municipalities or people who are usually contacting me nine to five, and then late afternoon, I'll get in the studio until about midnight. I would say three Midnight is ideal. But these days I just had surgery six weeks ago, I'm not back at full full capacity yet. So it's a little bit of a shorter day, but but actually like day six after surgery I was already drawing again.
Kate Shepherd 34:40
Can't stop you can't stop won't stop. That's amazing. So that's it. That's an interesting thing too about creative flow. You know a lot of people talk about or creative blockages. I mean, they're kind of two sides of the same coin. It seems like you have like this current, this big current of energy, creative energy that just coming through, it's almost hard to stop. Do you ever come up against these blockages?
Susan Logoreci 35:04
I do. It looks different for me, I think in some ways, because I, I mean, I could always make something but I often feel that's not the best way to spend my creative time. Sometimes it's best to just stop and plan for a while. Design Research, let things simmer, and then go back rather than work, work, work, work work, which is what I want to do. It's not always the best move for me, in terms of actually creating something that where I feel like it's, it's new and vibrant and exciting for me, too. Because I can get stuck in a routine.
Kate Shepherd 35:41
Well, yeah, that's the that's the row now. I'm just doing this kind of formulaic thing of Yeah, yeah. Would you say that you had to create some discipline for yourself around knowing when to pull back and knowing when to do different things as Yes.
Susan Logoreci 35:54
And I would say public arts really helped me with that even more, because, and this is why a lot of artists I think hate doing public art is because it is you do have to work with a committee. It's collaborative with the community sometimes, and you're on their schedule, you get to do your design work, you know, you bring it to the powers that be whoever that is, sometimes, yeah, it's the community who is actually going to be living with it. And then they give their feedback. And then I let that simmer for a while I usually don't ever go right back to work, I need to think about that and, and focus on it, and then go back and revisit and see what their remarks like where that fits and where it doesn't, you know, I get to decide that. But it's really made me slow down. Because it's not all on my schedule. And I prefer that sometimes, actually, although most artists don't like it, I think because they just want to be in control all the time. And I get that impulse to you. No.
Kate Shepherd 36:52
No, that's a human thing.
Susan Logoreci 36:54
Yeah. Oh, yeah. I think a lot of us got into this too. So you can create this world that you have total control over.
Kate Shepherd 37:01
I wanted to ask you about how you feel about your pieces when they're done. But also along the way, what is the journey of a piece from start to finish? And is there a point where you're like, I don't know where this is going? I don't like this? Or is it all really planned out? And you know, like, what is the journey of
Susan Logoreci 37:19
what's the process? Yeah, well, mostly I work in color pencil, I do paint as well, when I have to work faster, especially with the Phoenix floor, I had to work so big to I couldn't do and you actually cannot fabricate really detailed work. So I had to pay. And that was great, because it really did free me up to, but mostly work in colored pencils. So there's not a lot of going back in and fixing once you're in the coloring portion of making the piece. But when I'm actually drawing it, I love to be totally out of control. And I will draw it upside down and turn it all every which way I don't I want, I want it to be at a point where I don't really know what's going on. You know, that's ideal, but it's also really hard to let my mind go to that and not want to say this is wrong, you know? So there's this, how do you do that? It's this sort of fish push ball where it's like, I do it for a while, then there's this kind of the fear builds up. And then you have to have a little self talk in there and say, you know, this is actually going to be great. And if it's not just throw it away, you know, that's an option. You know, I don't love spending a lot of time on something and never using it. But a lot of times, I'll just roll it up and put it away and then revisit in a year or something, even cut it up and send it out as postcards or just kind of reimagined if things don't work out. But that's not the end of the world. But you need to I need to kind of remind myself of that too. Especially when it is a business, you know, this idea of process and products are always going to be at odds somewhat, you know, I don't think that ever gets easier. You just for me, I'd get more comfortable with the Unnies
Kate Shepherd 38:57
think that's the that's the secret of it is just I mean knowing knowing that nothing's ever wasted. Usually, at the end of the day, that was thrilling when you were saying that you don't know how it's like you're working on it upside down and sideways, and you're turning it in, because I think so many of us are really kind of laced up to be like, this has to look pretty at the end and I want it to look good. And and so I'm going to try to control that control, again, control along the way. But it's almost like you're delighting yourself. Surprising yourself. Yeah. So is that so when you're done a piece doesn't usually look the way you thought it would
Susan Logoreci 39:29
or I don't have a huge set intention. I have hopes but I don't usually have a huge set intention when I start and the drawing part goes really fast. I try not to raise too much. I don't think about it too much. I go I try to find that delinquent adjacent adjacent mind window when I was 15. You know how to access to that person and say, you know, eff this, who cares, you know, and let it sort of be wild, you know, because I do think I'd want that energy in the work you know, Otherwise, it gets a little complacent
Kate Shepherd 40:01
for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Is there like one piece that you've made? That was really hard for you to let go of? Is there one that stands out the one that got away? Yeah,
Susan Logoreci 40:09
yeah, there was one I just sold recently. And it's in a great home and went to a screenwriter, actually. And I love that she has in her living room. It's a big three by five foot piece of houses with swimming pools, and it has these sort of undulating patterns in it, which, before my surgery, I was actually having a really hard time seeing straight. And so I kind of use that as to kind of create these kind of art illusions in the work. And I had that hanging in my house for a while now, usually hanging up my own work. I mean, this, when I finish something, I hang it right away, and then I put everything away, usually, but I would have liked to look to that one a little longer. I'm really happy where it is. Yeah, to
Kate Shepherd 40:49
a good home. Can we see a picture of that? I'm able to put picture of that piano show? Yes. Yeah. Okay, what's it called?
Susan Logoreci 40:56
Neighborhood pools, let's call,
Kate Shepherd 40:57
okay, we're gonna put a picture of that in the show notes, because I think everyone's gonna want to see that. And you
Susan Logoreci 41:01
know, I work from photos a lot. But lately, I've been doing this more and more, well, I'll take photographic imagery, and then I'll sort of take something like about an alternate, so the image in that piece doesn't actually exist, it's just sort of a collage of a bunch of different ones. And I don't Photoshop that I actually just have a bunch of images in my hand when I'm working. And I pick one up one down and kind of just, you know, mind shop at rather than Photoshop it. So I'm very analog and my technical abilities.
Kate Shepherd 41:31
Love that. I love that. Okay, so now I'm thinking about people who are listening to this, who are excited to stop caring so much, and just get their hands going and get them back in the seat and do all the things that we've been talking about. For the person who's listening to this, who's like, I really do want to step into being an artist full time, I really want to give myself an opportunity to pursue this. I love it. I'm also a compulsive maker, but I don't have room to keep all these things in my own life, I do need to sell them and let them go. What do you think the most practical advice? You would give that person? That's
Susan Logoreci 42:03
a great question. Yeah, Hmm. Well, I would say it's probably going to be helpful if you're working within a genre, that's well known, and that people like to purchase imagery of and hanging around their home, you know, landscape, portraits, things like that, it's always going to help if there's a genre that you can hook into, you know, with me, it's, you know, landscape cityscape, that's going to be most important. I wish somebody had talked to me about that, when I was starting out. And also, you know, what type of artists are you? What's your skill set in terms of just your personality, you know, are you a people person, I do love going out and meeting people, well, then sales, probably gonna be pretty easy for you, is your work, ephemeral, you know, well, then you need to get good at writing grants, and access, institutional support. You know, just think about where your skill set is, as well as why your arts doing, it's kind of both things are important. I love spending a lot of time in a room alone. So I've had to learn, like public speaking, you know, I have to go to get public art projects, we have to stand in a room full of people. That's like, not why I had to do this at all. But it's like, so you are gonna have to learn things to, you know, to support the work. I remember when I graduated from undergrad, the diploma reading the department said, This degree is conferred by this person with all the rights and responsibilities. And I always remember that really stuck and stuck with me, you know that you do have the right to call yourself an artist and to say I even if you don't have a degree, but if you really in it, you know, and but you also have a responsibility to your work, and also to art to this large conversation that's been going on since humans organize themselves, you're part of it. Take that seriously.
Kate Shepherd 43:53
What is that responsibility to you? What is that entail?
Susan Logoreci 43:58
Yeah, I mean, it's definitely beyond ego. So getting out of your comfort zone is a big thing part of getting beyond your ego. Right? Yeah, someone told me was the ego hates change, and it's not it, it doesn't want you to be happy. And I thought, Oh, that's interesting. So whenever you can do get past that, I think is good. In terms of art, you know, I think yeah, your part, how are you going to add to the conversation? You know, what is it that you have to say, that hasn't been said? Or are you adding to something else, something someone else has said, you know, you have a responsibility to that. And so think about that, you know, it's serious thing. It's not about just creating content that, you know, you're adding to all this information and content that's out there. It's like, you know, you really want to think deeply about what specifically you can add, you know, we all have something absolutely like, oh, well, you know, I didn't have a difficult childhood or I don't have life experience. I don't have anything to say absolutely. Everybody has something to say you know, you just have to have to figure out within all that's been said, you know how you're going to add to that. And it's a big responsibility.
Kate Shepherd 45:05
If you had to distill it down to a sentence or two, what would you say? You're trying to say through your work, I really
Susan Logoreci 45:14
want people to feel the delight and wonder that we deal in cities and in built spaces. But also think about what can be improved that duality of that conflict of how we can do things better, and inspire people to want to want better things, to see the fun and beauty and to want more.
Kate Shepherd 45:36
I love that, that it's like the gratitude, being grateful for what you have, but also not letting that let you become complacent. It's like, and let's continue to build something. Oh, I love that. That's so cool.
Susan Logoreci 45:48
It was hard for me to get to that when school it was definitely like that, be careful. Because to be too delightful or happy or to want that other people to get that is, you know, it's it's not art, or it's you know, you need to need go to show dystopias, and but I disagree the older I get, I'm like people need delight and wonder more than anything?
Kate Shepherd 46:09
Well, I think that's one of the other limiting beliefs about creativity is that you have to be a starving artist, you have to be in pain. It has to be anguish and agony and hurt. And I don't think that's true about art at all. But yeah, we believe that in so many different ways. Yeah. So I love that you actually came right out and said that I think that's really important. I cannot believe that we're at the end of our time. It's crazy, literally crazy to me like like that today. Is my clock wrong. Just like that. So a couple of things. I want to tell you, I want to tell you about the word that I pulled for the show fro today. Yes, please. I pull a card for for every show. And it's the word for us was simplicity.
Susan Logoreci 46:45
Oh, that's great. That's great. Why does that give you back your goal? Because my work so complicated, it's like the exact opposite of what I do. But in some ways, it is very simple. You know, the content of it, I think is very direct. You know what I'm trying to communicate, even though the work itself is very complicated. That's a great one.
Kate Shepherd 47:07
I love that little fractal right there. Like the truth inside the truth. Yeah. So I have one more question for you. Is this at the end of every show? It's the billboard question if you could have a billboard that magically everybody in the world who longed to be an artist, or long to be able to express this stuff that was inside of them, but for whatever reason, and for all the reasons we've talked about, didn't believe that they could or didn't believe they had it in them or didn't believe it would be possible. But they were going to read this billboard, what would you what would you put on the Billboard?
Susan Logoreci 47:38
So one thing that I'm trying to do is stay off my phone more, because I'm addicted to my phone, like a lot of people. So I made this, I made a cover for it that I rubber band around my phone, and it says this on it serious play every day. It's the only way.
Kate Shepherd 47:54
Oh my god, I love that. I love that. That's so great. Oh, thank you so much for coming. So thank you. Tell us where we can go. And we'll put it on the show notes. But also just for people listening right now who want to pop over and just visit you. Where can they find you on social media? Where can they find you on the internet? What's the best place?
Susan Logoreci 48:13
Yeah, I'm on all the things except Tiktok. I'm on Instagram at Susan lager Etsy. I'm on Twitter at SU boo sob Oh, I'm on Facebook. Mostly I'm on Twitter and Instagram. And then if you want to see my work in person, if you are heading through lax, I have four original paintings and a large mural that's in the southwest baggage claim terminal at LAX. And then of course, the piece in Phoenix as well. And that'll be there forever. And that's permanent. Well, thank you so much. This has been so enjoyable. And I really feel very honored to be here speaking with you. I love what you're doing. And I just been so excited to be a part of it. I'll keep listening. I love it. Thank you.
Kate Shepherd 48:50
Good. Well, thank you and I was a joy to talk to you. I really I really enjoyed our conversation. Thank you. Isn't Susan amazing? Didn't she just make you want to go and find your inner delinquent and break some rules when it came to creativity? I loved when she talked about putting all this time into these sketches and drawings and then ripping them up and reassembling them and weird different ways because that's how she sees the world. She wanted to have a visual representation of that, that she could share in her art. And I just thought that was so amazing. The word for today's show is simplicity. I wanted to offer that to you in a way that maybe is a little bit different than we normally think of this word. Normally we think of this word as like stripping down or taking away bare bones, you know, simplifying things. But what came up for me when I picked this word for us, and it became apparent for me throughout this conversation, what this word was trying to say to us today is about the simplicity of being who we really our, you know, here we are with our flaws and our strengths and our weirdnesses and when we try to fit ourselves into This little box that the world has created for us, it gets really complicated because that's not easy to do. But when we can, with simplicity, own, who we are flaws and all, and just bust out into the world and be that we get to share our gifts in a way that have a profound impact. When we can embrace the sense of simply being who and what we are, we're able to express ourselves in our truest way. And when we do that, we finally have something of value to add to this gorgeous conversation that's been going on since the beginning. If you take one thing from this episode today, I hope it's to ask yourself, what is the thing you came here to add to that conversation, and I want to guarantee you that it needs to be heard and seen and felt, and I want you to go do it. So on that note, the homework for today's episode is so important that I've made you a worksheet to help you with it. And if you want to access that, it's free, all you have to do is sign up for my newsletter, and you'll automatically have access to it, you can do that at Kate Shepherd creative.com que te SHEPHE rd creative.com. And you don't have to have the worksheet, I just find that it can be really useful to have a container for this mind exploration that we're going to do. So it's free, sign up for the newsletter, you'll get a copy of it, I hope it's really helpful for you. Okay, so here's the assignment, let's say twice a week between now and the next time you sit down and listen to an episode, which I hope is in about two weeks, you carve out 10 minutes to sit down and think about your flaws. This is one of those things where our protective parts can flare up, they get really defensive, they don't want us to look at our flaws, or when they do they want us to be really hard on them. So this is a very gentle, curious exploration of what of your what's your story been about what your flaws are, up to now. And that could be anything physical from, you know, you have a weird bent finger that doesn't let you hold a pencil the same way as all the other kids did in school, or you see things differently, or you're colorblind, or you don't hear the same way as people around you, or you have dyslexia and writing has been challenging. Reading has been whatever it is, we'll list all of them out. Just with curiosity, we're not trying to be hard on ourselves. So I want you to sit down and do that twice, to data, make two lists like that in the first week. And then in the second week, make yourself two more appointments for 10 minutes each, where you sit down, and you look at those lists. And you start to see how those things have made you different, and what those differences have facilitated for you. So in Susan's case, you know, she can't see things in three dimensions. And when you look at her work, they're this wonky Angular, you kind of can't tell where the object begins and the space around them ends. And that's what's magical about them. And so how has your flaw, quote, unquote, all these flaws that you've come up with in this list? How have they made you different? And how have they made your contribution unlike anything else that anybody else could have created. And if you feel brave enough to share those with us, make sure you're signed up for the creative genius family on Facebook. It's a private Facebook group, and pop in there and just start to share. That's exactly the kind of conversation we're having in there. Oh my goodness, I thought this was my flaw this whole time. And look, lo and behold, this is what makes me so special. This is my superpower. I had no idea. And now I'm off. So share those things with us. And let me know how that goes. Let me know how that homework goes. I really do love to hear from you. You got this. Make sure you're signed up for my newsletter. I pick a random person from my email list once every month and send them an original piece of my artwork. It's one of my favorite things to do. It takes a lot to put together the show. Please consider supporting me to do it. You can visit patreon.com/creative Genius podcast to find out more. And please keep my jewelry or paintings and especially gratitude birds which keep selling out in mind. Next time you're looking for a treat for yourself or for a loved one. You can find everything I've mentioned on Kate Shepherd creative.com Thank you for being here, for opening your heart and for listening. My wish and intention for this show is that it reach into your heart and stir the beautiful thing that lives in there. May you find and unleash it Your creative genius