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In this episode, we dive deep into the transformative power of sound and creativity with the renowned musician and healing sound artist, Ashana. Ashana shares her personal journey from being a classically trained singer to pioneering her unique genre of healing music with crystal singing bowls. Through her music, Ashana creates a space for listeners to connect with their inner selves, tap into their creativity, and unlock their full potential. From discussing the importance of sound frequency in personal growth to the role of intuition in the creative process, Ashana provides invaluable insights and practical techniques for incorporating sound healing into daily life. Ashana performs a live healing sound meditation for us at the end of this episode!
A storyteller of the heart, Ashana has lived, and loved, and learned, and today she generously shares the bits of her life that have been the most transformative with us. Ashana performs a live healing sound meditation for us at the end of this episode!
Ashana is a true pioneer in the world of healing music. With her celestial vocals and the enchanting resonance of crystal singing bowls, Ashana has crafted a luminous sonic tapestry that transports listeners to realms of deep peace and inner harmony. Hailed as one of the premiere healing music artists of our time, Ashana's music has been described as "breathtaking" and "a Gift from Heaven" by listeners worldwide.
Ashana is a classically trained musician who grew up in the Bronx. After a lifetime of being a professional musician and teacher, she unexpectedly found herself trailblazing an entirely new genre of music that has since garnered international acclaim.
With renowned producer Thomas Barquee by her side, Ashana has pioneered a sound that resonates with listeners worldwide. Her albums, from "All Is Forgiven" to "Celestial Sleep," are more than just music—they're gateways to spiritual awakening and vibrational healing.
And she isn't just a musician; she's a storyteller of the heart, she's lived and loved and learned and today, she generously shares the bits of her life that have been the most transformative with us.
So grab your earbuds head out on that walk, or curl up on the sofa with your favourite beverage and tune in to this week's episode of The Creative Genius Podcast as we unravel the captivating story of Ashana.
Ashana's journey to becoming a renowned musician and sound healer was not a conventional one. Growing up in the vibrant streets of the Bronx, New York City, Ashana discovered her musical calling at a young age. From singing in churches to exploring a wide variety of musical genres, Ashana's eclectic style evolved over time and finding her way to the music she creates today involved a lot of ups and downs and surrender.
Pioneering Healing Music:
Driven by her passion for yoga, chanting, and mantra, Ashana embarked on a deeply personal journey of self-exploration and sound healing. It was during this transformative period that Ashana pioneered an entirely new genre of healing music with crystal singing bowls. Blending Western and ethnic instruments with the unique drone of the crystal bowls, Ashana's music creates the ultimate transcendent experience for healing, relaxation, and meditation.
A Beacon of Light:
Today, Ashana travels the world, offering concerts, workshops, retreats, and crystalline activation ceremonies that have been hailed as "powerful" and "deeply transformative" by attendees. With her intuitive vocal improvisations and crystal bowl playing, Ashana continues to inspire and uplift audiences, guiding them on a journey of self-discovery and inner healing.
The Power of Sound Frequency: Ashana explains how sound frequency works and directs listeners through an exercise to raise their vibration, highlighting the profound impact of sound on our emotional and spiritual well-being.
Reclaiming Your Voice: Through her healing music and vocal improvisations, Ashana emphasizes the importance of reclaiming our voices as a means of self-expression and healing, particularly for women who may feel pressured to suppress their voices.
Navigating Creativity: Ashana shares her journey of navigating creativity and the importance of inner child work in unlocking creative potential. She emphasizes the need to create space for authenticity and self-expression to allow creativity to flow freely.
Healing Through Expression: The voice is identified as a powerful instrument for healing, allowing individuals to express their emotions and release suppressed energy. Ashana encourages listeners to embrace the full range of their emotions and give voice to their innermost feelings.
Connection to Higher Vibrations: By connecting with higher vibrational frequencies through sound, individuals can experience profound shifts in consciousness and tap into their innate creativity and inner wisdom.
Listening to this episode offers listeners a transformative journey towards reclaiming their voices, unlocking their creativity, and connecting with their inner selves. Through Ashana's guidance and insights, listeners are inspired to explore the healing power of sound, embrace their authenticity, and embark on a journey of self-discovery and personal growth.
By tuning in to this episode, listeners will discover how to harness the power of sound to elevate their vibration, reclaim their voice, and unleash their creative potential, ultimately leading to a deeper connection with themselves and the world around them. Get ready to embark on a journey of self-exploration and transformation through the healing sounds of Ashana's music.
So, grab your headphones, find a cozy spot, and join Kate and Ashana as they unlock the secrets of creativity and healing through the power of sound.
Hello, welcome back to the creative genius podcast. I'm your host, Kate Shepherd.
Ashana Is a renowned musician and healing sound artist. Her music has been listened to by millions of people around the world and today she sits down to talk to us about her personal journey from being a classically trained singer. To pioneering her own unique genre of healing music , with her beautiful crystal singing bowls. Through her music.
Ashana creates a space for listeners to connect with their inner selves. Tap into their creativity and unlock their full potential. The conversation you're about to hear today was particularly powerful for me.
Because there are actually quite a few ways in my life that I've been feeling a little bit blocked and stuck for quite a while. And some of the things that Ashana shared about her experiences with this really, really hit home for me. In particular, we talk about the tendency. We can have to misinterpret what it can mean when we keep hitting dead ends in our life.
And another way to look at it. When doors seem to be closing in our faces more often than we're comfortable with.
We also have a really beautiful conversation on how to cultivate a relationship with unseen beings. This is something that I've yearned for for a long time
to believe in something beyond my senses, Ashana has an incredible connection to angels and what you refers to lovingly as her team. And that's something I've really yearned for in my own life. And haven't been able to genuinely cultivate in a way that has had a lasting presence in my life. Her musings on that we're powerful for me. .
I often Marvel at how so much of what my guests share with me inside our conversations on this podcast. And up being medicine, my own soul deeply needed. My hope. Is that in listening to these conversations, The same is true for you.
-1: For a lot of my life I didn't let myself believe that I might have a purpose. And as soon as I started doing the creative genius podcast, I realized this is what I'm born to do. To have these conversations to give voice to this wisdom and this intelligence that is bursting at the seams to try to find its way back to us. It is an honor for me to do , this work.
And it's my gift to you. It takes me. I realized the other day sometimes 30 hours. To create one episode, , finding a guest reading their book pouring over the questions and having the time on the phone with them and then editing it and then mastering the sound and creating show notes and social media posts and newsletter articles, and sitting down and recording these intros and the outros for this. I mean, it's just a huge job and I love doing it.
And like I said, it's what I'm born to do. part of what I'm learning, how to do is how to lean into support from my community to support me, to create the thing that supports you. So I'm asking you, if you listen to this show and it touches you and it feeds you and you receive something from it. Please consider signing up for my Patrion.
There are multiple different levels that you can join. , there's the $5 Patrion, which would be brilliant. You get all of the episodes a week early.
You'll get a bonus episode. You'll get extra bit of content here and there. And it is a wonderful way of supporting me to keep creating this show for you. And there are other levels too, there's the colorful community where once a month I do, uh, in depth hour long live workshop on how to activate our intuition and creativity. There are other ways to, you can help. You could buy my artwork or jewelry on Kate Sheppard, creative.com or on love.
Morning, moon.com. Those are fantastic ways of supporting me and there might be other ways that I haven't even thought of yet that you might think of to support me, to keep growing the show.
So if there's a way that you want to plug in and help, please know that. I'm open to receiving that support from you now, so if you want to get in touch to discuss any of those things, you can email me@katesheppardcreativeatgmail.com or you can send me a direct message on any of the social media platforms. And wherever you are in that, please know that I'm so grateful to be in this relationship with you. And I really actually can't do it without you.
Uh, Shyla explains to us how the power of sound frequency works. What its role can be in personal growth and in developing our -intuition and in freeing up our creative processes. , there's a lot of talk in new age circles about raising our vibration, but I didn't really understand what that meant really until this conversation with Shauna.
We talk about reclaiming our voices. And she shares her thoughts around how she believes the voice. Is one of the most powerful bridges to the soul. And a way of not only self expression, but also really understanding who we are and what our purpose is and how to let all that out.
I feel like this episode is one of those episodes that has real. Potential for transformational impact in our lives.
Ashana is generously gifting. Every creative genius listener with a free copy of one of her Seminoles singing bowl meditations.
It's a beautiful meditation. Make sure you're signed up for my newsletter on Kate Sheppard, creative.com. And we'll send you the link for that.
And I want you to stick around to the end, because Ashana. Plays us out. With her beautiful crystal balls and sings to us to close out the episode.
I'll also share with you the big epiphany that I had as a result of this conversation.
And.As always at the end of the show, I'll leave you with something to ponder. And this one could be truly life altering. So I hope you stick around right to the very end.
Track 1: Your music is so incredibly beautiful. it also feels, it feels like more than, than just music. And when I say just music, I'm not diminishing what music is. Music is magical, but there's something specific about the music that you create that I feel like somehow, Transports us to a place inside of ourselves that feels somehow it's inside, but it feels somehow expanded at the same time.
And it can feel like a spiritual experience. what is your intent with creating this beautiful music that you make?
Ashana: know, there's always the intent of my human self And the connection to the team, right? The team in the etheric. And my human =self= is going, Oh, I want this to be an experience. I want to convey the authenticity of my heart and my soul. And I want to, um, create this environment, this spacious place where the listener can go to connect with that which is inside of themselves, which is the essence of love. And so there is that that's in place and what happens is in the recording studio or in the live performance or whatever, there's a greater thing that ultimately takes over and, and I, I feel this deep connection to presence and inside that presence. I am listening. And inside the listening, there is a, oh, what I, what I'm seeing when I say this is like, there's a, there's a soundscape.
There's a landscape. There's a landscape of color and light. And there are, there is the feeling of the presence of Of beings of light that literally are, are vibrating, riding and co creating these frequencies. That's what it feels like to me. And there's a, there's this place where I, I go through this process of just stepping away and stepping away and stepping away.
So there's less and less. of my mind engaged, there's, there's always a part of my mind that's engaged. You know, you gotta, where's my mallets and, you know, is,
you know, all that kind of stuff but you know, there, there's like the, the technical piece that you gotta be mindful of. And then there's. The, the place of just stepping away really from, Oh, you know, am I breathing deeply enough? Am I, you know, where's this, where am I coming from inside of myself? And so there is this going deeper and deeper and deeper into the interior, into the womb, into the heart, into the earth and opening up and in an, in to the expansion and, and then we ride, you know, together. Me and the angels, you know, or the beings, right? There's this like ride and it feels like this, you know, and, and there's, you know, they send me little messages like, you know, joy and light and, um, and sweetness and power and, and, And it comes through, you know, it comes through the arms, it comes through the hands, it comes through the intention without intending. I know that sounds really weird, but it's like, I'm not consciously thinking about, Oh, I want the sound to be really healing. I, it's extraordinary because I never think about this. should heal. I'm simply, if I'm doing anything, I'm loving on the sound. And inside that love, there is this expression that comes as a gift to my, to me and to the listener. It's like the gift that, that we all get. Because it's, it's, um, it's uninhibited giving. It's unconditional
giving that's coming in through, those multidimensional realms. did,
Track 1: Do that. Like, I
so you.
hear a lot in the sort of personal growth circles, new age circles about frequency and sound and energy and raising your vibration and, and to me, everything that you just said, like, I don't know if you saw my face the whole time you were talking. I was just like, I felt like I was glowing in the, like in the just.
The, I could feel what you were saying as true, even though I don't have those experiences.
And I, also know that it's true, like I can feel it, but I don't understand how frequency does that. How does it draw us into that? What does it do to our. physical being to be in the presence of these frequencies and the sounds that you create in your music? What, what's actually happening?
Ashana: First we have to start at a foundation point, and the foundation point is that everything is vibrating. And everything is vibration. Now, for some people that are kind of just walking into this world, you know, they're going to say, well, the microphone's not vibrating and my carpet's not vibrating. And my, you know, my table isn't vibrating. It's made of wood. It's made of metal. But when you get down to that That scale of, you know, particle and wave physics, quantum physics, we know science knows now that everything is energy and all energy is in motion and the motion of all energy creates a vibration and everything. Everything in the world is vibrating at its own innate rate of frequency. That's how fast or slow the vibration is. And then what happens for us when we move into states of expansion, states of joy, states of contentment and peace, is we are shifting our vibration to experience. That particular vibration.
Now, so here's a real simple way of doing this. So if we ask everybody in the audience right now to close your eyes and just bring to mind something that makes you incredibly happy . . could be your puppy dog greeting you when you first walk in the door and they're jumping all over you and their tail is wagging. It could be sitting by the ocean. And the waves are just, humming this soothing rhythmic pulse. It could be your face in the wind. It could be the sight of a dear beloved in your life. A friend, someone who is an inspiration to you. A spouse, a partner, a parent. And you see? Now just notice that feeling. Now you've changed your vibration in less than 60 seconds. You've gone from a vibration that was maybe a listening vibration or a thinking vibration of, you know, concentrating on, what I'm saying or what Kate is saying. And we're, we're in this, in a more mind place. But now just in the space of 60 seconds, we shifted our vibration completely to happiness, pleasure. to a delight, to quiet joy. And it was a matter of our attention going towards that vibration. Now what happens in sound that we become entrained to the sounds that we are listening to that become dominant. In our environment, at any given point. And so, let's say if I start playing a crystal bowl. And I began to sing.
I'm not going to do that right in a second. But if I did, then I would become the dominant vibration. In that moment. Or you change and you start listening to other kinds of music. Or you put the television on and there's a, a disturbing. Show. Honor. Notice the moment I said that, could you feel inside of yourself? how your vibration shifted, right? It literally took a nanosecond for me to redirect your attention to a lower vibration. all the cells in our body on the molecular level, they have these little receptors on the outside of the cells. And our cells are constantly taking in information and our cells, interestingly enough, communicate through frequency. So you could say our cells are constantly communicating through a certain level of sound and vibrational frequency. So as we introduce, A sound of joy, a sound of hope, a mantra of peace, a, a prayer of love, a spoken, spoken language that, that, that speaks encouraging, inspiring, um, hopeful positivity. And we, and we speak that with a, with truth into ourselves, ourselves are just like. Oh, okay. I'll take that. And, and our mitochondria actually responds to light and our, and when we're, when we're encouraging, we're bringing more and more higher, higher, faster vibrational frequency in there. Our mitochondria literally on a certain physical level are becoming brighter and brighter and brighter. And then one cell gets it. And then because the cells are all connected in our human organism, it's just like this whole wide, interconnected communi organism. Well, the cells start talking to other and they go, Ooh, you like light. Hey, I like light too. Okay. Pass it along. Pass along. It's going all over.
And before you know it, your whole body starts vibrating at a higher vibrational frequency. Now this happens really, really quickly. Right? Because as we just saw in our little example there, you know, I could say one thing or we can have an experience and you go right to the other direction. The beauty of sound is that we begin to entrain to these higher vibrational frequencies. We begin to teach our body, mind, and spirit what this feels like. And we recognize it. So now we have a bigger contrast. Oh, wow. This makes me feel amazing. This helps me feel peaceful. This helped me feel quiet. This gives me hope. This, this is like a promise of goodness. And then we go back to that other frequencies and we look at that and we go, wow. So now we have beautiful contrast. How do I want to feel? Let me think about this. And the interesting thing is because I believe we're, we're entrained and then conditioned to these, especially now these lower, lower vibrational frequencies. And these are the vibrational frequencies of fear, doubt, suspicion of divisiveness.
We've seen a lot of that these days, right? sound healing is right now. I think so important because people are under such extreme levels of stress right now. It's chronic, epidemic stress throughout the world right now. And so we're seeing this
contrast more and more and more.
So, you know, I believe the, the, the beings of light and our inner beings, you know, our, our, our divine selves are offering us ways where we can remind our souls and remind ourselves and as humans in this life experience, what this higher vibrational plane feels like. So we establish it more and more and more and more as the baseline for our being. So now when you get to that place where, oh my goodness, you know, we've dropped. Or we've responded to circumstances or reacted to circumstances in such a way where our energy has dropped. We know what the contrast is and we can raise it back
Track 1: When you look back and reflect on your life, was there a time when you were younger when you were living in a lower place where, like, was it a journey for you to get to this place? It seems to me like you're probably kind of vibrating at a higher level just as your baseline now.
But I'm imagining that many, many of us have, we're operating on a lower kind of baseline and we can bring ourselves up, but, but it just, our set point see intuitively, this is just what I'm sensing is that the set point is a little bit lower. Was that, is that true? And was that the case for you? And did you, what did you do to, to raise your own vibration in your own lifetime?
Ashana: Well, I, I have to agree with you that the set point was definitely very, very different for me growing up and through probably, you know, most of my adult and young adult life. And so it was this really, in some ways up and down and up and down, but up and down with like a steady incline.
Okay.
and now it's still up and down and up and down, but my set points higher. Right. So, whereas I might have stayed down like 30 years ago when I got lost in, in challenging emotions and I got stuck there, that stuck could last for days and days and days, sometimes weeks. Right. And where I am now, that stuck place might last. 20 minutes. It
might
Track 1: a cell, there's a cellular memory, right? Your cells are like, yeah, okay, that, it's not like things stop happening to you. Till our dying breath, things are going to keep happening to us, but it's our reaction and our set point to them. What was your journey like do you remember the hard parts of, of, of, it feels like we have to make a choice at some point.
Ashana: I think we make lots and lots and lots and lots of choices. And the choices that we make, on a daily basis, influence how long we're going to stay in that place. my experience is that we don't move and shift until we've learned the lesson.
Whatever is being presented and sometimes the arc of those lessons are years
Track 1: Yeah.
Ashana: and, and, and that's the tough place, I think, because especially when we're in the middle of it. I mean, I, I could, I like everybody else. I could tell you stories about choices that I made. That, you know, when I look back at them, they were grueling. They were, um, they were so void of love. They, they left me in, um, in places where literally, you know, I'm thinking of one particular period in my life where I did everything I could to erase myself.
Track 1: Hmm.
Ashana: And, and I was so full of pain and I saw so little and I was so hungry to be loved and accepted that I literally, I mean, if I just took an eraser and erased myself. And the interesting thing was I had people in my life around me at that time that were going, can you see what you are doing? And I, I would go, yeah. But right, and then I would keep repeating it and I repeated that cycle for about 5, 6 years. Couldn't even been longer until I absolutely got to a point where I said. That's it. No more. I'm done. And literally in the space of like 24 hours. I was like Finished I'm out of here and I and and it shifted and I've done that several times in my life where I've looked at a talk I you know reached a toleration point and said I cannot do this anymore and I shifted and at the same time what happened over the course of my lifetime is That shifting has, has less to do with blaming somebody else than saying in a very empowered way, I love myself so much. I respect and care about myself so much that I need to not be in this situation anymore. And then I will shift. And that's when you're free. You go, I made the decision based on, you know, caring on authenticity on what's true and real and right for me. And so these are. You know, these are like these, you know, up, down, up, down, up, down, up, down. But I love to see it as a, as us going up, down, up, down, up, continuously up, growing, continuously, expanding, continuously opening to new, to new ways of being and thinking, and sometimes it's most times it's just hard.
Track 1: Yeah. I, I see it as a, almost a spiral that's going upwards. Like sometimes I'll, I'll feel like I've, I've gone through great periods of personal growth and I'm like, Oh my goodness, I've tried, I finally transcended that pattern. And then I find it here it is again, what, but I realized I'm here it is again, but I, but I'm older and I'm wiser and I know this now and I no longer react that way now.
the point is never to not. To get to a place where nothing ever happens to you anymore. But the point is to just sort of be wiser about how we react to those things when they happen, right, by getting the lesson
Ashana: Yeah, and , that's what I've come to is
not wanting to, stay in a place that is constricted
and contracted. You know,
one of my dear, dear mentors, has this saying, which is like a mantra inside of me now. And that is contraction is no longer an option.
And it was, you know, she said it for years and years to me. And I was like, okay, okay, okay. And still, when the times come when I would feel my energy contract, I knew it was contracting. I knew that it wasn't a good thing that it was contracting and I was unhappy with the contracting, but I was so committed to the contraction that I wasn't gonna let it go. And then what's happening now after just these, you know, years of, of layering, layering goodness into my. Layering thinking, layering, um, kindness into my thinking, layering, understanding, layering, that it's way more fun and delicious to feel good than it is to feel judgmental and divisive and jealous and greedy and it's like, you know, and I know the contrast in this and I look at that
when it shows up in my life and of course it shows up in my life and I go, I really don't want to be there.
I really don't want to do this. This just doesn't feel good anymore. You know, the sensation of this simply doesn't feel good.
Track 1: I used to think there was something wrong with me because I forgive very easily. And I used to think it was because I also don't have a very good short term memory and I used to think they were connected like, and I'm a little bit lazy. Like I have a lot of projects and I'm always doing lots of things and it's too much energy for me to remember why I'm mad at you or upset with you or annoyed with you.
Like honestly, it's not, I'm. And I used to think, oh, there's, I better work on holding grudges better. And I'd like, I just can't because I'm, I'm too lazy to, but I think it is a choice, you know,
like you do get to, you do get to decide you, had, what you call a musical calling at a really early age.
Will you tell us a little bit about that?
Ashana: Well, when I, when I call it a calling, you know, it's the, um, at the stirrings for being very young, we're always directed towards music. And it's interesting for me, the stirrings were directed towards music and towards healing. So I loved them both and I could have gone either way and I ended up going to music and it really, really was 50 50.
Could it
Track 1: When you say, when you say healing, do you mean like medicine?
Like, like
Ashana: wanted, yeah, I wanted to be a bio, I mean, there was a point in time where I was just absolutely, utterly fascinated with cell biology. And, uh, and I was a candy striper for quite a while. And I was really planning on, I was going to go into nursing and my father was like, why doesn't, why don't you want to be a doctor?
You know, I mean, my dad, you know, back in like 1967 was like, why don't you want to be a doctor? And I was like, My mother's like, she can be whatever she wants, you know, and then there was this You know, go to music and, and I started playing guitar. I was playing piano. I was, I couldn't, I wanted to sing, and I just kept following that trajectory because it was a trajectory of, of fun and immense joy and pleasure. I loved singing. I loved the theater. I loved acting. I loved dancing. And I just kept going in that, in that direction and I stayed pretty solid there. Um, I ended up going to, uh, a conservatory of music in New York City and got a degree. classical singing and voice. And then I sang all kinds of different stuff, you know, pop and jazz and opera and operetta and early music.
I was more or less a specialist in early music and that influences what I do today. Um, but there was just, I loved singing standards. I loved being in shows. I mean, it was just part of my happy place, you know, and, uh, and I just kept going with that.
Track 1: And then how did you transition from that being classically in that classically trained kind of world of mainstream, for lack of a better term, music to the work that you're doing now?
Ashana: it was an interesting thing that came a certain point in time in the classical music training where I absolutely had had it, I'd had enough. It felt too constricting for me. And I discovered the, joy of, of improvising. And once I, stuck my nose into, um, jazz and pop improvisational singing and music.
And I, I approached that just the same as I was, you know, when I would learn an aria, you know, I mean, it's like people thought I was crazy, but I would like take. Whitney Houston licks and I would write them out. , and I would learn it You know note for note wrote for out until I could sing it Absolutely the way that the artist that I was, you know, interested in was singing it and and I was doing that for a while and then I left New York City and moved to Santa Fe, New Mexico, and I started getting into children's music.
I became a teacher for early childhood music and that was. Absolutely freeing. That was like, I had the opportunity to deconstruct everything I had learned as a classical artist to its bare bone components when you first start learning. And I had some amazing experiences doing that . I did that for about, and 11 years. And then there was this place inside of me that said, Okay, you're done. Now, make your, make your first album. And I, I didn't even know what I was going to do. I had the bowls by that point in time. I'd been playing them for several years. and I, I knew it was time. I knew it was time to stop teaching. And, um, and I did. I sold my business. I literally had one buyer. And all, and I keep telling people, listen, hey, all you need is one, you know, you only need one person. I put it up for sale. I sold my business, , my music teaching business, and I took all the money. And I said, great. Now I can make my first album.
Track 1: Were you scared at that point?
Ashana: yeah,
Track 1: Well, you sound so confident when you like, you just knew that that was all going to unfold, but that sounds terrifying. What was going on for you in those days?
Ashana: you know, it was just that is that place inside that's just like a clarity,
You know, It's
like, It's
time. Yeah. And it, and it, and it's, it's actually happening to me now on another level. Um, but it's that same place that goes, this is over. And I don't really know exactly what this is going to turn into. I just know that I need to walk in this direction.
Track 1: How did you navigate the fear and all the things that were coming up for you in, in, in those days when, when you were, when you sold it all and you sold the business and you were going to make your first album, can you, can you take yourself back to those days for a minute?
Ashana: You know, I, I knew I, because I told the business, I knew I had enough money. To, live on for a certain number of months, I had every confidence in myself that no matter what happened, I could always put a roof over my head and food on the table. And I also knew that, well, because the music di industry was very different at that time.
You know, this is like 2005,
so in terms of the, you know, the, the music industry as we have it today. So, you know, at that time we were still, we were still playing CDs. It was hard copy everything, you know, we were not in the digital world. At all, uh, except for digital recording.
That was the extent of it. So I knew that there was a certain process that I was going to have to go through as an artist. There was no guarantee that if I made this album and I didn't even know what was going to be on the album, basically, I just thought I was going to go in there and well, I had two directions I could have gone in.
I was a songwriter and I was going to like, just do a whole bunch of songs and sing songs and write. And, or. You know, yeah, I was kind of doing this a little bit, you know, with the bowls, and I thought that would be cool, right? And I met my producer, Thomas Barkey. And he said, if I was going to be your producer, I would put you in healing music.
And I was like, okay, you know, why not? Let's go. And it was, I mean, I'm being flippant. It wasn't flippant. I was very much, um, at that time kind of going, all right. You know, and, and there was this, I can't explain it to you. Really. There was a place of, I trusted, but I, I, I had this vibration inside of my being that just said, this is the next step.
This is what you're going to do. And thing. And, you know. Batten down the hatches. We're going and, and that's exactly what I did. I mean, I met my producer the same day I closed at the bank on my business. I literally met him the same day and I heard his music in a, in a yoga class. That I was, I was attending and I said to the yoga teacher, I kept thinking, well, everybody's in Shavasana. They're supposed to be quiet and you're relaxed and you're not thinking about anything. I'm listening to the music and I'm going, that's the guy, , he'll totally get the crystal balls . Right. And I went home and I called up my yoga teacher and I said. Who's the producer on that album? She grabs the album and she goes, Oh, Thomas Barkley, she goes. That's it. I looked up his name on the internet and I'm like, oh my god, he's going to be in Santa Fe in two weeks. That was the last time he ever went to Santa Fe. Two weeks in green Santa Fe and he's doing a big concert. So, I, I, I ordered the tickets. It was two weeks, and it happened to be the day that I was closing on the bank. So, I, what I'm, you know, long story, and it was a beautiful story, the whole unfolding of him and me, and then, you know, literally three months later, I was in the studio with him. And six days later, we'd written and recorded Ave Maria, which is like, Become
iconic and millions and
millions and millions and millions of people were in the world and listen to that song. And
It's still like, you know, 23 years, 24 years later, that song is a fricking classic in the field now. Oh, everywhere in the world. And, and, but you don't know. Right. And that was the first song we ever wrote together. I mean, if you can imagine that, it's like Okay, open your mouth Lashana, what do you want to do? I said, ah, I was thinking about it, I don't have any more in my mouth. Okay, try this, start singing.
. It just fell out of my mouth. It fell out of Thomas's. Right? And it just, you just go, you, you do this process, and I know your show is all about creativity and creative genius. And I think what I want to really say to people here who are listening, you follow the breadcrumbs. You go one tiny foot in front of the other. You take one toenail and you put it in front of the other. You just trust. It's like, wow, where's the impulse taking me? Where's the idea taking me? You know, and, and we have, we're creative people. I mean, oh my God, we're so creative. You might have 60 ideas that never amount to anything. But the process of creation is the allowing everything to come up, to be tried, to be tasted. You, you, you give it some wings. You go, no, this really isn't the direction I'm going to, but those wings over there, take you to the wings over here, take it to the step here and here and here and here. And before you know it, you look back and you go, oh my God, I just wrote a book. And, and that's how I, I, I wrote a book last year and, and it's best selling for the crystal singing bowl community world globally. Right. And it started out because, oh, you know, my students could use like. a little ebook, you know, and then how to play a crystal ball. Well, that's a good idea. I think I'll write something on that. And, and I had my, one of my business mentors going, you're going to write a book of Shauna. And I'm like, you're out of your mind. I'm not, I mean, I'm a musician. I'm not a writer. And she's like, you're going to write a book. So I started with a little ebook. And then before, and I do the outline of it and I go, Oh my God, I have 29 chapters. How can that possibly be?
Track 1: Have you, have you ever felt lost? Have you ever had parts of your pathway where you just felt lost and you didn't have breadcrumbs for a long time
in
Ashana: yeah. Oh, absolutely. I mean, that, that period of time I told you about , that was like five years. And I was doing stuff and I was doing music, but I had abandoned myself, , I'm 67 now and I can look back at, , 50 years of being a professional musician and I have had plenty of times where I felt empty where I wasn't sure and see, this is the other piece of it. When the joy empties out and you're not certain and it goes on and on and on and on and on and on and on, that's an indication for me that something is out of balance and it doesn't necessarily mean that, Oh. Maybe this is a sign from the universe that I shouldn't be singing. Maybe it's a sign that I shouldn't be writing my book. it may not have anything to do with that. It may have to do with, maybe I need to clean up my relationship with so and so. Maybe I need to. I need to stop giving away parts of myself to , X, Y, and Z. Maybe I need to change my diet. Maybe I need to get more exercise. Maybe I need to be mindful of what I'm watching on television. . Maybe I need to start looking at things in a new way. Maybe I need to, fill in the blank we get stuck sometimes on our journey because. It's a journey. It's not about the end point. It's the journey. And art, and creative art, is a spiritual practice . is incredibly demanding, that we look and sense and move into deeper, the deepest states, I believe, of authenticity that we can be. And we have to be willing to allow that to come up. And when you do that, as we do that, and I've experienced this so many times in my life, that the more I extricate the things that are pulling on my energy, the more I can empty that out, clean that up. Make amends, , with myself, with others, then the energy now is free to come back into the creative process. And you have space now and inside that space, you know, cause the universe of pours a vacuum inside that space. And now you open it up because you're lighter. You can breathe more. You have, you can love yourself more.
You can love others more. That's like optimum space for the creative to flow.
Track 1: I've had for about a year now,
I kept having this voice that was saying, you're creating some really big things.
we need you, but you have to clean up your house, your house, like literally, literally my house. Like literally my house and I'm like, yeah, yeah, I know I'm an artist, right? Like I have like baskets of, I love baskets. I love bowls. I love rocks and I love driftwood and I live near the ocean and the forest.
I love collecting things all the time. My house is this, people come over and it's like, You know, oh, you get lost in all the little piles of amazing, beautiful things, but it's, it can be a little bit too much. There's a lot of stuff here. And I kept hearing this voice saying, sweetheart, like clean up your house.
Like you want to know why you're stuck. Clean up your house. Cause I kept saying, I'm stuck. I don't understand why the next breadcrumb isn't coming. Like why isn't the next breadcrumb coming? Clean your house. And I was like, no, there's gotta be like a bigger. More cosmic answer to the clean your house.
Like it really just keeps coming back to me So I'm so glad you said that because I think we do sometimes fall into this trap of wanting fancier answers about what's wrong and sometimes it really is like you just need to Make that phone call and clear the air with that person because it's draining your energy unconsciously You don't even realize and it's the image I had when you said that was that it's like fixing the leaks of a boat
Ashana: yes, that's exactly right,
because if you're out of integrity with yourself,
you know, and like, I'll go back to those five, yeah, five year period, I was so out of integrity with myself,
like the most ever in my entire life. And how can you make music from that place?
You know, I mean, not the kind of music that I want to make.
Track 1: Yeah.
How did you navigate that? What, what happened for you? You talked to, I don't, you talked a little bit about, the importance of healing childhood trauma or maybe inner child work in, in some of the writing that I've read from you, in unlocking creativity specifically, but was that part of that journey for you?
Ashana: No, at that time it wasn't about that. It was really about me getting out of a very toxic relationship and it took me many years actually to fess up and own up to how I created that.
Track 1: Mm
Ashana: you know, but step one was. Get out of the relationship and close the door and, and, uh, you know, I, I had to do a lot of self inquiry But the very first thing I had to do was like extricate myself and stop living like that I had to clean up my own house,
Track 1: hmm.
Ashana: internally and put myself in a good space a better space we learn as we go along. you know, a lot of the inner child stuff that I really appreciate and love doing. Is related to the voice and singing and allowing that little kid to come out and express herself and also allowing the, you know, the, the wounded. Not wounded. I don't want to use that word. The, the parts experiencing feeling wounded, much different than what I just said first, right? So where there's stuff that needs to be expressed, you know, the anger, the frustration, the despair, the No, no, no, no, no, no. I mean you just like go down the list of things. Then, and we have to get that out. That, that the voice for me is the most powerful, bridge to connecting with our souls. And it also allows us, it is the vehicle. That we have, it's the most healing sound making that all of us have as we can open up the voice and give ourselves the freedom and the space to give sound, give expression to that which we are feeling and, and so much of, chronic illness, whether it's mental, whether it's emotional, whether it's spiritual, is the suppression of our ability to express ourselves and to give voice, to give speech, to give sound to that which we are feeling emotionally. And when we do, and when we really go in there and start doing this, holy smokes, you know, get out of the way. She's coming out and she's got something to say, and it is like this, you know, the doors when they finally start opening, they don't just open, they rip off the hinges and there is this massive tornado of wind that comes sailing through the doorway and out she rises, you know, and it is This fullness that now has permission to live and exist and be and express, and we can do that.
Everybody can do that with their voice. And can you imagine what this world would look like if we had safe? Places to express our anger, our fear, our despair. We learned how to give that voice and there's this transition. What happens inside that space is you, you start expressing that, which you're angry about that, which you're frustrated, that which makes you feel depressed or less than, or, you know, all this stuff we tell ourselves and. You start rising out of that like a Phoenix coming out of the ashes. And then all of a sudden you go, Oh, here's the sound of, I am powerful. Here's the sound of my joy. Here's the sound of my peace. Here's the sound of my love. Here's the sound of my brilliance. You know, here's the sound of my life. Here's the sound of life. And, and then I swear to you, you know, all the little angels, they just start coming around you it's that gift of expression and we all can do it. And this is why, you know, we have music for. As humans, we've been making music for since the dawn of time, right? And we, and we gathered together as communities and we drummed and we prayed in through sound and we visioned through sound and we don't do that anymore.
Oh
Track 1: as you're saying all this, I mean, I'm beaming from the inside out because it's just, there's so much resonance with what you're saying. And I'm also imagining many listeners right now hearing this, who is told, I was told directly as a child, you shouldn't sing.
You don't.
You sound, You sound terrible. You should be quiet. But then there's also, especially as women, so many ways that we are directly, but indirectly told to be quiet, to quiet our voices, to, so as you're saying that, and I just feel like this glowing radiant potential of what's possible for us and what's possible for the world if we were to step into that, like how things would change.
There's a step before that that needs to happen for people. So, I'm, I'm just practically speaking for the, for the person listening to this right now going, that sounds amazing, uh, how do I do that? Because I, I don't know, I don't, I don't even feel like I'm really allowed to make sound or or have a venue to do it or people around, like where, where, where does she or he start to, to do that?
Hmm.
Ashana: the simplest way possible and the way that the most easy and the most accessible. for you. You find the music that you love. So it could be, Oh man, I want to sing like Beyonce, right? It could be, wow, I love Native American powwow music. It could be, you know, Oh my God, such and such on the radio, things like that. Well, I mean, for me, step one, and this was what I was doing when I was a kid. Was I loved Donovan. I love Joni Mitchell. I love Joan Baez. I love Lauren Nero. I love Janice Ian. I love John Denver.
And I would, I have memories of myself, you know, Singing up a storm with my little record player in my room.
And, and it was okay. And there was, there's this place now where we've gotten so, Oh no, we're not allowed to
sing because now, you know, there's a perfectionism in recording. That is. is, is beautiful on the one hand, on the other hand, it's insane because, you know, what happens to artists is, Oh, well, that note is out of tune, well, we'll just tune it up.
Well, this note is out of tune, we'll just tune it up, you know? And sometimes, and believe me, I know this because I know producers , you know, an artist will go in there to sing and there will be, you know, 40 to 500 corrections. On, on the vocal track to make sure that he or she's saying every little note, exactly the way it's supposed to be now, when you did recording 30 years ago, that didn't exist . You showed up and you sang and you got pretty much the real deal of whatever happened in that moment.
So our conditioned perfectionism around, around, um, electronic sound now is infused. It's everywhere.
Kate Shepherd: And our expectation
what singing is,
Track 1: is, is unrealistic. It's,
Ashana: It's,
totally unrealistic.
Kate Shepherd (2): me realize that it's like the way we've airbrushed
Track 1: women's bodies and people. It's kind of the same, the audio, right? Like it's just not, not how we sound.
Ashana: Yeah. And now there are singers really seriously. I watched this documentary few months ago about singers who are now using computer generated like AI and it makes their voice sound right. It's the weirdest thing. I listened to
it. I'm going, Oh my God, you know, that's so strange sounding, but that adds this other sort of robotic, unreal quality.
Kate Shepherd: It's weird. And I feel like we pick up on that on a cellular level. I'm a jeweler by trade. That's my, that's what I mostly do. I make these silver bands that are really full of texture for, I use tree bark tech to make textured bands. And then I do these gold 22 karat gold bezels with gemstones in them.
And them to look like they came from like an archeological dig, like you found this relic of the past. That's what I want you to feel like to nature. and. and. I, I, if something's too perfect, I'm like, Ooh, how can I, how can I bang that up a little bit? Like, I don't, like, I don't want things to be too perfect.
I feel like on a, we, there's something that we pick up on where it's like, you know, there's a realness that's missing that we actually really need.
Ashana: Yeah, we do need it because we need it so we know that we're, we're absolutely okay being who we are,
Track 1: Yeah.
Ashana: you know, and, and a lot of that's been, been taken away, uh, from our, from us in terms of our confidence of just exploring our own creativity,
you know, and we don't have to be perfect.
We just we just have to like explore so can I'm back to your question. So what do you do? Well, you just you just go for where you want to go. Oh, I want to learn how to be a drummer Great. Go to a drumming circle. You want to dance? Good. Go to a dance. You want to sing? You do you like yoga? Do you like kirtan? Go to go go chant. Do you want you like church? Okay, go join a choir you like, you know And it's just this like follow these tiny little breadcrumbs and start with what you know You know If all you know is to get in your car when nobody else is around and turn up the radio and I'll tell you why you're driving down the road, do it. And just pay attention. You ask your team, you ask your guides and angels, show me the way lay open the path for me to open and express my voice and discover my voice, my voice, my authentic healing voice, whatever way, shape, or form. Show me, lead me, guide me, direct me. I know you've got this. You've got this, my soul.
I know it. You've got it. I know you're going to show me. I know it's there. And then just. Make that announcement, make that proclamation, and keep your eyes open . You don't have to keep asking for it, but just keep your eyes open. Gee, that sounds like fun. And when you hear that, that little twinkling in your heart that goes, Wow, that sounds really cool, that sounds like fun. It could be like, super quiet. It could be like, Oh, I wish I could do that. That's it. That's the voice. Listen to that voice. I wish I could do what over there. Go there, you know, follow a, Oh, somebody is doing a class on that. Somebody's got a recording on that. Somebody's, doing a podcast on this. Just follow it. Listen to it. It's that simple. You don't even have to spend money for it.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. You're so right. you've talked a couple of times about the team and I personally feel like I've longed for a team. I've both longed for a team and also had moments where I really felt like there's a presence that walks with me.
And it comes and goes, but I, I don't experience, like I've heard a lot of people talk about a connection to their ancestors or to angels or to other beings. And so I guess I, I would love for you to say a little bit to somebody like me who sort of would want that, but doesn't actually feel that that's present in my life.
And how do I. How do I bring that into my life or maybe it's about suspending my disbelief or maybe, I don't know, like what it is that's, am I blocking it or does it really exist? How do you know that they're real?
Ashana: cause I feel them, and I understand the contrast of when I don't feel them. You know, the, uh, the story that I like to tell people is that many years ago I was working with this, a, a, a spiritual mentor, and she, she was like, oh, you need to go get a Ian, what do they call those? Cur curian photography thing done.
Kate Shepherd: Is that like your
yeah, it's like your aura? reading.
I was like, oh, okay. I never had that done. Okay, I'll go. Right. So I did it and the guy who was on the other end of the. He looks at this picture and he goes, my God, I've never seen anything like this. And I'm like, Oh yeah, how cool. And it was really eyeopening for me because you could see all this green and all this, you know, red, yellow, all around here.
I went up to here and on the top was a band of black right across and all above it was white light And I was like, what's that? And, and, my mentor goes, I don't remember who told me, he says, Sean, that's how much you've been blocking your guidance system. It was like, I made this decision or choice or whatever.
I don't even know where it came from. That's like, no, I don't want this. And so I was walking around the world feeling very isolated and very alone and very lonely for really, really long time . And when I saw that, it was like, wow, okay. And so began this process of Just being willing to be willing to be willing to be willing and I will never forget the day that I You know, I have one of my first alchemy crystal singing bowls and it was it's a rose quartz sitting over there And I and I would play it Every day and I would just ask, I was like, all right, mother Mary, if you're there, show me, it was kind of like that. Really. I was pretty sassy, but, um, but there was this like longing and wanting. I was so wanting to feel that connection. And so I would just say, you know, I'm here. I'm, you know, show me, show me. And I would just keep playing, you know, and playing. And one day it was like three weeks of this was going on and on and on. And all of a sudden it was like I was playing. And it's like the top of my head just like broke open . And I felt this. Like my whole heart went into this state of feeling unconditional love and, and like I was drunk and I knew it was Mother Mary. That was pretty clear. So I think we have to ask. You know, the team is always there, but we have to and we have to be interested and we, you know, create that relationship. It's a relationship. And so when you, when you open the door to that relationship regularly, I promise you, you know, just give it time and show up like you can't make a friend and keep a friendship.
Let's say you got somebody like my best friend, she lives in Santa Fe, New Mexico. And if I don't call her or she doesn't call me You know, we don't have a, I mean, we know each other, we love each other, but it's a relationship. You got to pick up the telephone and say, so what happened? How's your son?
Where's the guy? Blah, blah, blah. Right? It's the same thing here.
Track 1: right?
Ashana: Right? So I'm here. I'm listening. I love you. Even though I'm not sure that I love you because I'm not sure you're really there, I'd be amazing to feel you and me together in some, in the love,
Track 1: Mm-Hmm.
Ashana: And we do that in the best way we know how, even if it's the tenderest way, which just says, you know, I don't know if you're really there, but I'm really willing to be willing to be willing to feel you. Show me that you're there. Just give me a tiny scent and it could be like something that you, something that I'll recognize. Show me like. A white feather or a, or a, you know, somebody, somebody looks at you and beatifically smiles at you and then, and you go, Oh my God, that looks just like my mother, you know, and it's like it can happen in a million little ways
and it's right there.
Track 1: Thank you. I was tearing up when you were saying that I needed to hear that. Thank you.
I wanted to ask you about, celestial alignment for healing, which is, uh, sounds incredibly transformative and I maybe selfishly want to know more about it. If you tell us about that,
Ashana: Yeah, this is, um, this is my, uh, my baby, my new baby. we've been, I've been working on it for a number of years. Uh, it is called Celestial Alignment for Healing. We're getting ready to release our second beta test on this and then it'll be released to the general public. It, I, I wanted to create the ability for. Anybody, anywhere to have a full on sound healing experience, you know, um, even though sound healing is trending, sound healing is not always accessible to everybody. And certainly, you know, the kind of bowls that I play are not accessible for everybody. and I wanted to be able to, to, to create something that covered that gap. So even if you go to sound healing once a week and you're, you're working on things, you're working on a health challenge, you're, you want to feel more connected spiritually, you you're maybe working with anxiety or depression or struggling with something, you know, it's fine to go to a sound healing once a week, but what about all the days in between? You know, how do we stay entrained to those higher vibrational frequencies? And how do we learn to navigate healing sound? And when I say videos, I'm talking about like, you know, music videos with, with, uh, with And so I created this program. It's a seven week online program. You get to spend an hour and a half with me and my husband once a week in a community of, of souls that are on, everybody's on their own sound healing journey. And you get amazing support with incredible music and videos. We are watching people, and this is no promises to everybody.
I can't do anything, but I can just anecdotally tell you what's happening to people that are taking the class. We have people that are, uh, that have, uh, Gotten off medications that they've been on for years. People that have shifted from intense depression and anxiety to, oh, my God, I can't wait to get out of my bed every day because I'm having such a great life. We have people that are in touch with more joy inside of themselves, more clarity of purpose, more connection with the team . . So we're doing our second beta test. And then as soon as that's done, we're going to launch the full program to the general public.
Track 1: Is it live?
Ashana: Yeah, it's live, Yeah. The music. No, you get the music for yourself. You get everybody in the program gets to download it. They watch the videos that all of that is self directed and this is kind of bonus stuff in there. There's, there's bonus meditations and, you know, there's, there's instructional videos. If you want to watch them, there's a whole library of instructional videos on what is sound healing? What are crystal bowls? What is it doing? What's my pineal gland? You know, you've got all of that,
Uh, if you want it as a resource, it's available to you. What we're finding is, is that, um, it's the live classes.
People are like, Oh my God, you know, because we do, uh, we do intentional meditation with sound in the live classes. There's always, uh, some kind of teaching about the application of sound, uh, to, into your life. Uh, So we're, we're, we're working with sound to let go, to release, to open up the voice, to expand our awareness to, uh, and our ability to receive. So it's about deep listening. I mean, there's just, people have said to us that they never dreamed that sound healing could be like this. And, and then one person had said that, that their entire way of listening has changed.
Because of this, so, you know, so I, I'm, I'm super stoked about it. And I think what we're doing is, um, for your program is we're giving us a free download to anybody like this, one of the seminal meditations from this is a
free gift. And so all you have to do is just sign up, and then you'll find out when the, um, the beta test is, or we only take a certain number of people for the beta test. So, um, but the, the full program will be launched this year.
Track 1: . Amazing. congratulations.
And also thank you for, that sounds like a tremendous amount of work that you've put into creating that. I can't even imagine. I really get the feeling that a lot of people will deeply benefit from it.
Ashana: Yeah, yeah,
Track 1: you're going to play us
out. going to play you out?
Ashana: welcome.
Track 1: That was so beautiful. Thank you.
Ashana: Just a little sweetness.
I don't know about you. But for a long time. I've yearned to connect with unseen beings. I'm a very scientific person in some ways. And I haven't always believed that there are beings out there that look out for us
guardian angels ancestors or any other kind of angel. It sounds really great. And I've yearned for it, but it hasn't been something I've been able to create in my own life. What Ashana shared about how to invoke that kind of relationship. In such a practical and loving way, you know, the idea of you want to have a relationship with somebody you've got. Uh, you got to put in the work, you got to show up, you got to let them know that you're there. And I just imagined her sitting there for those three weeks playing her bowl, saying, I'm here, I'm here. Please show yourself to me.
It was very inspiring.
But the takeaway that has left me reeling a little bit from this episode. Is the realization that.
The stuckness I've been experiencing. The feeling that I just keep hitting dead end after dead end. As I try to bring various parts of my work and life. To a path that feels right.
May not be for some fancy cosmic reason.
We're storytellers by nature. We're meaning makers. And I think when things aren't working out for us, we often look for. meaning. Behind, uh, why things aren't working out. But sometimes there's just a really practical reason. That part of the conversation where Ashana and I were talking about. No, what is it that I need to do and address? To free up that energy so that I can be more in my creative flow. It was really powerful for me because as you heard, I realized what's been whispering to me is I need to clean my house.
It's not fancy. That is not a spiritual side quest. That is a very practical grounded of the world. Thing that I need to do to free up that energy. And I intuitively know that that is actually probably the biggest thing holding me back. So I'll leave this with you today. What is the thing that your soul has been whispering to you? That you have been ignoring. What's the thing you? need to address and deal with and tie up. Complete and create some closure on in your life. That you've been avoiding and what might be available to you if you just took a deep breath? Sat up straight. Put your hands on your hips, breathed in some bravery and tackled it with love and joy and grace.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Hello, it's me, Kate Shepherd your host of the creative genius podcast. I'm thrilled that you're joining us here today. whether you're a listener that's been with me from the very beginning , or this is your first episode. I am so glad that you found your way here. This conversation about how humanity as glitching and creativity is the answer. Is the most important conversation we could be having on earth today. Creativity is the meaning of life.
It is life itself. And
For a whole bunch of reasons that ultimately culminate in fear. We have spent a great deal of our resources and human energy
dimming down. And suppressing this radiant thing that lives inside of all of us. I'm an artist myself. I have always been blessed with an incredibly deep connection and pretty open channel. Of creativity. And intuition. Those two things go really hand in hand and all my life. I thought that was normal. I thought everybody had that. And we do. But a lot of us have closed that channel. Through no fault of our own we're conditioned, we're taught. to, to close this part of ourselves down. And that's what the show is about. Refining that part of ourselves,
There are times in our lives when we feel particularly lost. I think we can all identify with moments like that. Maybe you're living through one right now.
Where we feel like we're either at a crossroads or we're on a path that doesn't quite feel like the one we're supposed to be on. There's sort of an overall unsettled feeling of. Not this, not this, my, my, this isn't what my life is supposed to feel like. But I don't know. What is my, this, I don't know what I should be doing
and , there can be a feeling of real loss and sometimes even panic with that goes on for a long time, which it can, it can go on for a long time.
When we find ourselves in these barren stretches of not really knowing.
It, can often mean not always, but it can often mean. that some part of us has become unwilling to listen.
Unwilling to listen to ourselves, our quiet, inner voice. Unwilling to listen to the signs and the clues that are hiding right in plain sight in our lives.
And unwilling to listen to the silence, because we're panicking about trying to get somewhere that feels better than where we are. We fill up all of our time. With go, go, go energy and hassling. Sometimes that turns out as spinning your wheels going in circles. Exhaustion fear overwhelmed.
It can turn up in so many ways. I often talk about.
Looking out for the yeses and the nos. And of course, life isn't just black and white there's more than just yeses and nos. But what I'm pointing to when I talk about yes, as a nose. And I teach this a lot in my intuition workshops. Is you're looking for the feeling tone of a thing. Life is always putting things in front of us that we get to decide. How we want to respond to. Everything from little things to big things. And the little things are a great way to build up this muscle of understanding your yeses and nos. had a guest on the show a few months ago, named Andrew Faulkner.
Who's an incredible, fine artist from California. Go back and listen to his episode. If you haven't. He talks about when he's working on a painting, how he looks out for those yeses and nos. And it's almost like a typo , when he'll put a little bit of green on the canvas, for example, and he'll look at it he'll sort of say like, well, how does that feel?
Does that jump out at me with the energy of. I have a mistake, like a typo, or does it feel like it fits in there? It's that sort of, yes, no feeling. And we can't say yes to everything. And I think a lot of us, especially women. R Conditioned to try to say yes to everything, to try to please everybody to try to take care of everybody.
And the truth is we can't.
That is just something we need to learn to come to terms with. In order to spend our energy wisely and fulfill what we're here to do, our highest purpose. We need to really learn how to. Listen to that. Inner voice inside of us that really tells us what the yeses and the nos are.
Recently I put together an absolutely gorgeous meditation.
It's a 20 minute or so meditation that is intended to support you to come back into contact with this stillness that's inside of you so that you can begin the habit of listening with your whole being.
We can listen with our brains. A lot of the time, which tends to guide what we hear. But there's another kind of listening that we can do when we drop into our being. And we listen from every part of ourselves and that kind of listening can actually have a tremendous transformational impact on your life.
And it's the thing that we're yearning for.
And when you practice this kind of listening regularly. Can truly change everything for you I've done lots of these over the years. I am very proud of this one. I think it's absolutely beautiful. . You can either buy it as a one-off on my website, or is actually included in your membership when you're a creative genius patron. And I decided that for very short time right now. I'm going to make this available to you as a gift. Head over to Kate Sheppard, creative.com and sign up for this free guided meditation to call deep listening.
And I hope that it is. Exactly what you need. To support this kind of deep listening practice in your own life.
In my own. Journey of listening to my yeses and nos. There's a lot of things I've realized I've had to say no to, in order to create time, to produce the show and put it out into the world. And I do this with a very reverent sense of gratitude. I feel that I've been called to do this work, and it's an honor for me to do it. And for a long time, I thought that meant that I just had to do it selflessly and that I could never ask for anything back because it was this calling. Right.
I'm supposed to, you're supposed to just give your calling away. And while there is truth to that. I'm realizing more and more that it's actually okay. For me to lean on your support because there are things I have to choose not to do. I'm not able to put as much focus into selling my jewelry or my art, for example, as I would be, if I wasn't creating this show, full-time. And I don't know if you know this, but I'm . I'm an independent podcast. I'm not, I'm not gonna have any outside funding sources. So I'm learning that it's okay for me to lean on you and say, Hey, I'll create this show, but what I need, I need something back in return from you.
If you're able to offer it. There's multiple levels, you can sign up for on the patron. There's five, 10 or $20 Patrion levels. And they each come with different benefits and bonuses.
That are intended to support you on your creative journey.
And just know that in choosing to support me to do this work,
it makes this work sustainable for me and my young family. And. It helps to ensure that I'm going to continue to be able to grow the show. So if you tune in regularly and you feel nourished by the show. You feel like you, you love the show, you get something from this show. Please consider.
Giving something back. And that can be in the form of Patrion membership, or you could buy a piece of my work. You could post about the show on your social media feed. You could.
Make a point of sending an email to a couple of friends every once in a while, when there's an episode that you really love. There's so many different ways that you can support me to do this show. I hope that you'll consider stepping into a deeper relationship with me. And doing that so that I can continue to do this work for you.
Uh,
today I sit down with a true Renaissance soul poet. He's an author, a meme artist, and a creative strategist based in Austin, Texas. His name is James McCray. You might know him. As words are vibrations. He's responsible for a huge number of internet memes in his work as a creative strategist. James brainstorms with top global brands,
he has written articles on creativity for publications like Forbes, half post. Yogi times and elephant journal and his poetry. Has been featured in the American journal of poetry. And he's the author of three books. He has a third book coming out any day now called the art of you. The essential guidebook for reclaiming your creativity. James is on a mission to uncover the connection between creativity, consciousness, and culture. His insights are both profound and accessible. There was a time in James' life where he was really compromising his artistic dreams and. Minimizing his own creative force that was inside of him. And he shares with us. His own experiences of surrendering to his inner voice and the ups and downs of that.
We explore the importance of sharing our creative work, no matter what form it's in or how we're perceiving the quality of it. And the incredible things that can unfold when we dare to express what's truly inside of us. One of my favorite things about this conversation is James delving into the two main stages of creativity, the yin and the yang, which is also how he's divided up this book. So he walks us through that. And he beautifully articulates his perspective on how creativity originates from our emotions and our energy.
And it's guiding us to tap into a deeper, more intuitive intelligence that really. Is beyond the limitations of the conscious mind.
James has a really gorgeous energy. It's clear that he's on a mission to help people connect with their creativity because he himself understands. The healing power of it, how it connects us to this essential part of ourselves that can offer us comfort can open our mind to new perspectives. And. Is really medicine for ourselves and for each other and for the world.
So grab a pen, maybe even your journal, because you're going to want to write some things down, make a cup of tea. And join us as we journey into the heart of creativity and surrender with James McRae.
Kate Shepherd: Thank You for making the time to talk to me. I'm really glad that you're here.
Track 1: thank you. I'm very happy to, to chat as well. I love, the premise of your podcast And
so I'm happy to be here and chat with you.
Kate Shepherd: in reading your book, I realized how it's almost like we're downloading the same channel and I get really excited 'cause I feel like I've met another person from my squad, you know, like the, the cosmic squad, the work that we're doing.
I feel like it's, it's difficult 'cause It's hard to carry some of the truths that we're carrying, but it's so necessary and exciting we're pioneering and it's
a lot of the times I feel alone with it. And, but, so when I get to meet another person who I'm like, oh, he's, he's tuned into that channel too.
Track 1: Totally. Yeah. I love, I really resonated with your, I dunno if it's your tagline or just part of your, your bio, but um, you said like, humanity is glitching.
Creativity is the answer.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Awesome. I'm so glad to meet you.
I'll share with you why I started the show and where I'm at with it. when I say the word creativity, I, and I'm an artist.
I'm a lifelong artist. I've, I've been an artist my whole life and it's, it's all I really know. And I feel like creativity is the intelligence that's animating the universe. the same thing that's telling the molecules in this bench that is holding up my laptop. Telling them to stay together in that shape
as it is that, you know, nudged you to go on this journey that you went on to write this book, or even the tomato plant in my garden, when it's time to open like that.
To me, I feel like that, that, that is creativity and it's the, it's the intelligence that's everywhere. And we have become, for whatever reason, and this isn't so important to me to understand why we did this, but we have become so disconnected from it. We've become ashamed of it. We feel like we have to curate ourselves.
We feel like we have to shove it down and deny it. we make fun of it almost sometimes the way we sort of make fun of love, it's like, oh, love, oh, aren't you creative? And that we diminish it
but actually. When this thing doesn't get a chance to express itself and move us, things go really sideways.
And that's why I, that's why I say humanity's, glitching. 'cause we've become disconnected from this integral part of, of who we are and what we are. So I was really excited to talk to you because as I read your book that you, you have this gorgeous new book coming out, the Art of You,
there's so many things in here that resonated so deeply with me. So first, I actually just wanna say thank you. Like, thank you for writing such a great book that I really feel will be in service to so many people on this journey, this journey. And congratulations because I know what a tremendous amount of work it is to put together a book like this.
What was your vision for creating this book and how did it come to be?
Track 1: Yeah. Well first of all, thanks for having me, and I just totally agree with everything that you just said. You know, I, I think that creativity is the. The life force of the universe. You know, I think it's, um, when I think about God and what that word means, I think of God as just being source creation. You know, it is the, it is the, um, the energetic source from which all things arise.
And that energy permeates all of us. You know, it's animating our, our, our bodies. Um, it's de it's it, it's designing our bodies in this Fibonacci sequence in perfect proportion to nature. You know, it's like this nature speaks this language and it's the language of creation
and we are not separate from that.
We are part of it, you know, so it's, it's integral to who we are. And I think that when we, um, suppress our creativity, we're suppressing our own nature.
So it's so important to, to remember that and, and, and to be in touch with it and, and to remember the true magic. Ourselves of life, of being alive. I think that, so we're, we're cut off from that creativity in, in some ways, I believe, because, you know, we're denying the.
The miracle and magic of, of the universe of being alive. we get into these routines and society definitely is in these routines of, you know, following orders, you know, being in survival mode. Systems that are cut cutting us off from natural abundance. And as, as, as, as a reaction to that, we suppress our own creative nature because society is pushing us in a different direction.
so it's so liberating to return to creativity and I think that, you know, people like you and your podcast and me and my book, and there's so many others now I feel that are waking up to this power of creativity. I really sense a, create a new creative renaissance brewing is really what I'm hoping for, what I'm wishing for and what I really want my book to be a part of.
And, and, and your podcast and your work. so I feel like there's so many, like-minded artists and creators out there, and, and luckily we're finding each other now and, and connecting and building that network of creativity.
Kate Shepherd: and beckoning each other. 'cause I feel like, so for me, I don't, and probably for you too, and I'd love to know, but for me, the journey to really surrendering, to letting creativity run the show as it were in my life, wasn't always this like crayons and acrylic paint and fun days in the studio.
Like, it's terrifying actually to go from a world where the rational mind has been in charge for so long to surrendering to this like edgeless, infinite, unknowable thing, right? So it's so important that we're here kind of like come, you know, people to find their way. 'cause it is actually quite terrifying that that precipice it's, it, it feels like a precipice I think sometimes.
There's a decision that we make that we, and we're talking about the renaissance and the this, this place that we're at in our civilization, which is where we are sort of acknowledging that the rational mind, which has been running the show for too long on its own unchecked and has caused all this dysfunction, is very habitual for us.
It's become the, it's, we're so identified with it that we think it's true and we think it's the only way. And when we come up to, for me, when I came up to that sort of intersection in my life where I realized I had to make a decision to go into the unknown, to surrender to this thing that doesn't make sense.
That isn't what is running the world on it. Right. And it's like, so it can be scary. And I feel like when, when I read your book. And it's the, it's the inspiration behind all of my work too. It it, what I get is that it's like I can feel the service that you wanna be in it to beckoning people over that edge to knowing like, it is, it is scary.
Yeah. It is really scary. But the most trustworthy information lives inside of creativity.
James-1: Absolutely. Yeah, I think, I think creativity is scary for a lot of reasons, but primarily because creativity is an exploration of the unknown
and creativity is inherently irrational. I
realized this the other day. I realized how irrational creativity is because. It's, it's completely unpredictable. So let's say like one of my favorite modalities is poetry. So let's say I sit down to write a poem, there is no algorithm in the world that could predict the words that are gonna come out. It can't be predicted. So like creativity inherently is a glitch in the matrix. Because it is, it is breaking the linear cause and effect of the logical, rational mind, and it's adding this spontaneous expression that comes from beyond the mind. And it's so important for anyone and especially artists to be comfortable navigating that uncertainty For me, what helped was learning that your intuition is your compass when you're navigating the unknown. You know, we're used to looking outside of ourselves for direction and for guidance and, you know, looking to our bosses or to our presidents or to our, the CEOs or whoever they are, and. Those people can't help us when it comes to, to creativity and to, and to aligning with our own purpose and, and, and, and to creating a life that's in alignment with our soul's calling. But we have this inner navigational system called intuition, which helps us navigate the unknown. So I feel like yes, society is so caught up in this overly analytical, rational mindset. I used to live in New York City, which is a city that is very much like the ego on overdrive.
So that's, that's an exaggerated example of kind of the, the type of world we live in. It's all analytical, it's all hyper-rational, and I. It suppresses the other side of the equation, which is feeling an emotion and energy. And one thing I've learned in my own creativity is that, is that the creative process starts in your emotions. It starts in your energy. so if I'm trying to think of an idea, what I do is I just tune into my body. See how I'm feeling and it's almost like I'm scanning my body, I'm scanning my emotions, my energy, and see what's trying to come through me, what's trying to come out. And then when, when I sit with those emotions long enough, it will eventually kind of bubble up into a, a thought or an insight, and then I can, go from there. But I think it really comes from within, it emotions and our, our our bodies have access to more subtler intelligence than the mind is capable
of understanding. You know, the
mind is very nuts and bolts. It's like data and it, it can process data, but it can only access what's already there. It's like the mind is like a, it's
like a computer. It's like a hard drive. , it's storage for information that's already there, and it can, it can work with that information and it can strategize with that information. But I feel like our, our bodies and our energy and our emotions are like tapping into the cloud. You know, I think our intuition is a portal to other dimensions. Where ideas are living, you know, beyond, you know, the, the, the Greeks used to call this the muse, right? Where there's this other intelligence that's beyond the conscious mind that when we slow down our busy ego and quietly, I. Tune in, we can access that voice of the muse, which I think is just another word for our own intuition. And in doing so, we have access to much more richer, deeper intelligence, um, than we would have with the conscious mind alone.
Kate Shepherd: I'm imagining you living in New York and you were working in advertising, I think, is that. Right. Yeah. And so I'm imagining that life is like, you know, you're out probably drinking with clients and busy go, go, go and lots of screen time and lots of distractions. New York City, I've been to New York City, it's, there's, you know, any number of distractions in any corner you turn down.
So I'm guessing, but that you weren't operating from a place of this creative muse running the show. How, what was that journey like for you? How did you, how did you cross that bridge?
James-1: Yeah. You know, so I started off as an artist, I feel like, earlier in my life, like just a
pure artist. I grew up in a very small town where there was just, you know, space for my imagination to wander. so I started writing poetry at a very young age. was painting for a while, like in my, when I was a teenager and. Eventually, you know, I just wanted, I wanted to be an artist, but eventually, you know, all of my friends were going to college and it's like getting a real job is like something that you're supposed to do at a
certain age, right? So I ended up going to art school because at least I thought, well, I'll find some way to balance creativity with a profession. So I studied graphic design and. That was, you know, great skillset to learn. And then I ended up getting my foot in the door in the advertising industry as a graphic designer. So I feel like I kind of snuck into the business world
through the back door
as an artist, you know?
so I was designing and, and then it becomes, you know, creativity on demand, right?
'cause I'm, and, and creativity within all these strict rules where I'm designing logos and websites and all these things for clients. which was fun for a while, but I got, I got kind of sick of it and, and wanted to be more, uh, I realized that a designer in, in advertising, they're like the last in the assembly line. There's all this thinking and all these ideas that, are decided. And then the designer is there at the end to make it look pretty.
And I kind of wanted to be more upstream of that ideation process where like coming up with creative ideas and, and cool marketing campaigns and things like that. So I actually pivoted my career into being a brand strategist. So this is like helping brands position themselves in the market and doing things like. Brand messaging and taglines and campaign ideas. I, I would even like name companies, like give them names and name products and things like that. and I'm really grateful for that experience 'cause I learned a lot of valuable skills, you know, creating presentation decks and presenting and public speaking and all these things. But you're absolutely right. It's very much, It's hyper productive. So, and this is the thing with creativity, and , my book. the Art of You is really divided up into two main sections, and this is the, the, the two biggest stages of creativity, which are yin and yang. Right? And yin is the, is the feminine receptive, intuitive flowing aspect of the universe. And yang is the. More masculine oriented, productive, doing action oriented parts of the universe. So these are yin and yang, they're equal opposites. And we all have both of us, both of those inside of us. , but our society these days is very much disconnected from that yin, from that receptive,
feminine flowing. so there was no yin in the advertising industry, meaning, you know, it's just like go, go, go work, work, work doing, you know, five clients at once, jumping into meetings all day, and there's something there. You know, there are aspects of that that are good because I did, I did. It's kind of like. It's helpful to build creative endurance.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
James-1: So it, there was a lot of, there was burnout where it's like, I'm doing, you know, too much. And it's like my ideas, you know, I think for, for true creativity, you want to be able to have a deep, well to draw from, you
know, that, that deep well, of ideas. And when you're just work, work, work, work, work, you're not. You're just, instead of drawing from a deep, well, it's like a little puddle,
so it's like running on fumes. So there was some creative endurance that I built doing that, but it was also, you know, I was just very disconnected from, from the yin and from, you know, ultimately fulfillment because, And also all my creativity was just , in service to these big corporations that at the end of the day, very few of them I actually cared about. And, very few of them were doing maybe even good in the world. So it's like, you're just, you're just, you're kind of, you're selling your, creative nature in your creative spirit in order to prop up, you know, the same, , capitalistic system that is. Worldwide, suppressing the creative nature
Kate Shepherd: Right.
James-1: us all.
So it's
kind of like
Kate Shepherd: giant bipo, it's almost like a bypass. It's like you're, you're, you're tapping into this channel of infinite amazingness, but you're kind of hacking it, and then you're shortcircuiting it and it's spitting out this tiny little, like, it's cool, but it's not what it's possible so what was it in you
James-1: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: woke up to that?
When, when, how did you, how did you snap out of that?
James-1: Well, you know what, what happened for me was I reached a point where I felt like I was just trying to advance , and progress in my career, and I reached a point where no matter how much I pushed. I wasn't getting anywhere. I felt like, in other words, I felt stuck. And
I think a lot of people professionally have felt this at one time or another, or many times where like it just felt out of alignment and I'm, I was showing up every day and it was just like killing my soul day by day. And I reached a point where. I had no other choice but to surrender,
meaning I just, I felt like I was, I was hitting my head against a brick wall
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
James-1: and, nothing was working anymore. It's like , I used to be more in control of my own destiny and I was like doing great things and I was, you know, getting promoted and all these things and all that had just been like, cut off for me.
I just felt like anything I tried wasn't working, which. I just left me feeling very, static and stuck and I had no choice but to surrender and I just gave up I really reached a point of just giving up and just feeling like I surrender. I don't know what to do anymore. And there's this moment in surrender where. It can provide you with a moment of grace. That's what I found. So when I stopped trying, when I stopped forcing, I just let go and surrendered. And in that surrender, what happened was for the first time in many, many years, poetry started coming out of me again. Poetry was the grace that was given to me in that moment of surrender.
And. It was just like I opened a portal that had been, that it had been shut, and I just started writing poetry more often and I started getting some published. and then I ended up writing a book of poetry shortly after that. that, that was it for me. It was really, um, it, it was just feeling so stuck and feeling like I was. No matter how much I forced it, it didn't work anymore. But then when I let go and I surrendered, I, I, I created space for that inner artist that had been suppressed to come back and to return.
And, I haven't looked back since.
Kate Shepherd: write in the book, you don't need tremendous talent. You just need the courage to question conventional wisdom. And it sounds like, you know, I, I love that you just gave us all of that, because that's, that's exactly what you were doing. You were living that as you went, and then you just kind of got to the end where you're just like, oh my God, I can, I can't.
I can't. And then, and then there was this other, there. It was, it was all, it wasn't, it wasn't like you had to go looking for it. It was all, it was all right there waiting.
James-1: Absolutely. Absolutely.
Kate Shepherd: I'm imagining you, as you're writing those early poems, you know, what you're thinking about sharing them, and you do talk in the book about sharing your work, and I wanted to ask you to talk about sharing your work a little bit more and what is the importance of it and what is it appropriate and how do we navigate that?
James-1: I believe strongly in, in sharing your work, uh, regardless of the form it takes, like you said, in my book it says that it's being an artist is not about having amazing talent.
And that's not the point I think that I. I don't like, um, how art and creativity are positioned in our society, right? So, so for example, I think there's a lot of imbalance in the world today, and that that comes in a lot of different forms. Like, just like look at the economy. There's a lot of wealth that are in the hands of a few.
And then the vast majority don't have very much
in terms of wealth. And I think there's a similar dynamic in creativity. Because there are a select few professional artists
and published authors that are bestowed with this title of artist, right? And then everyone else, if they wanna be creative, it's almost like they're being unrealistic. So I really believe in extracting capitalism and creativity. And that's not to say that you shouldn't make money from your
work if you're, you know, that's. Amazing. If you can make money from your work in any capacity, that's awesome and you definitely should. But that's not the only reason to create, like we've been talking about. I think creativity is human nature and it's a life force that moves through us and we do a disservice to ourselves and frankly to the entire universe when we don't allow that to move through us. So of my favorite sayings is it's not about being good at creativity, it's about creativity being good for you.
Kate Shepherd: I love that.
James-1: So I really believe for me, I, I, I believe in what I call the creative purge because I believe that creativity is healing just to do it. Like you can, I think there's a similar phenomenon to, I, I compare it to like a good sweat,
right? If, if I, I love to go in the sauna and, just get a good sweat and it just, the way the sweat kind of pours out of you, I, I feel a similar sensation when I'm writing.
'cause it's like I'm purging something from my system because we, we go throughout our day and we get caught up with, who knows what. And there's all kinds of, um. Trauma and negative emotions that come with life. And I think that what happens more often than not is we, is we suppress them and we bury them. So creativity gives us an opportunity to release them. So I think that when you just sit down and write and write from the heart, you're releasing some stuck energy within yourself. So just by writing down in your notebook, you're, you're, you're purging. It's like an energetic purge and. That's step one.
And that's healing unto itself. But what, what I find even more healing is when you can share it. '
Kate Shepherd: That stuff, even that, even that perge garbage stuff,
James-1: Well, you can share, I mean,
whatever you make.
Kate Shepherd: call. I had a, I had a guest on in way back in season one, and she talked about how she went through a lot of extreme trauma as a young person.
And when she came into adulthood, part of what she did was she started painting and she had this like yearning to paint these beautiful paintings, but for two, almost solid years, all that came out of her was just like muddy, gunky, ugly.
And she, looking back, thinks of that as almost like clearing up the sewage in the pipes that was blocking the, and she said she doesn't actually feel like she wants to share or needs to share or you know, that stuff. How do you, how do you know what, what's the right, you know, what, what's ready for sharing or what, how do you know in your own self when, when you're gonna share something and when it's just for you?
James-1: what I see, 'cause one of, one of my favorite things to do is I, I host, , creative open mics called Sunflower Club. this is a forum for people to express themselves in a safe environment. I've seen people go up there and share things that are very personal seen people come up and share things that they have never shared in public with anyone
ever about. Personal things that happened to them as children or as young as young adults that were very traumatic. And you can see the release that happens when it's almost like, you know, I'm not a, I'm not a religious person. Um, but I. I can see the benefit to, in, in, in Catholicism, how they have the confessional. I love, I, I do love that idea because you're, you're, you're, you're confessing something, you're getting it off your chest.
So when you share those things, you're getting it off your chest. So when people come up and share at Sunflower Club, I, I don't care.
And we don't care how perfectly polished the poem is. And of course if it's, listen, if it's a great poem. All the better. Like we applaud talent as well, but it's really when someone just admits something that's uncomfortable , and you can tell it's like. It's, it's, it's really, it's getting something out of them that the whole room feels it.
We all feel like, oh, this is, this is, this is special. We're seeing or something. We're seeing something real. This is
a real moment. This isn't polished and packaged and it's, it's, it's raw and it's authentic. It, I just think we need more rawness and authenticity and that. Naked vulnerability. Um, so that's what I love to see,
working on your craft to become a great artist is a, is a kind of a different thing.
and you do need to get, I think, the bad art out of the way. On the, on the road to making good art. I mean, I wrote a thousand poems before I turned 25 years old, right? So I've got so much experience writing and I, and, and those that were, you know, really never shared because that was, you know. Prior to social media,
But I needed to get, write a lot of bad poetry before I could, be a better poet. So there
is a, there, there is a lot of benefit to practice and to get and to getting your bad work out of the way.
But there's also, especially when it comes to writing and, and poetry, there's so much benefit in sharing it. Just to, get it off of your chest.
Kate Shepherd: And I'm thinking about just the failure rate in nature in general. Like there's a failure rate built into, you know, a fish will have a thousand fish because do all of them are gonna make it. Or I think about my paintings and like, you know, for every 10 paintings that I do, there's one that I feel like this belong.
I mean, some of them might be emotionally, you know, I might feel connected to them, but yeah, there is a certain wisdom . even in the quote unquote failing.
James-1: Oh, sure. Yeah. It's like you have to be a bad artist before you can be a good artist.
And it's also like, I, I love the analogy to like standup comedy, because every standup comic will tell you that, the whole, the whole game is getting comfortable on stage, like. It doesn't matter how well you can write a joke in your room by yourself, that's not the point, is like, it's about being comfortable in that moment and, and being able to navigate the room and feel comfortable bombing because you've bombed enough where it no longer frightens you
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
James-1: so you can express
freely.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah, there's a freedom in it. I think mastery that has a mastery that is the pathway to mastery. You have to fail so many times. You , you wrote something in the book that I didn't understand and I wanted to ask you. You wrote the line between the art and the artist is starting to blur the content creator is becoming just as important as the content.
What did you mean by that?
James-1: Yeah. So that line, , I'm really referring specifically to, to where I see art developing. Today, meaning the, the genres and the mediums that we work in. Right? Because I, I, I think creativity can be expressed in so many ways and it has in so, in so many ways throughout history. I say that art is always made with the tools and technology of its time.
So for example, you know, oil painting, it was like people used to use oil paints and they still do, but that was a big thing. Or even like writing sonnets, it's this very specific style of writing the mediums that artists work in are always changing and evolving. And I think when I look at what are the tools and technology of our time, we're looking at things like the internet and social media. So I'm really interested in the internet and social media as. Mediums of artistic creation, and that's different than sharing a painting on Instagram, which is taking an old art form or an established art form, and then sharing it in a new technology, or like taking a, an excerpt from a poem and then posting that on Instagram.
These are, these are great things to do, but what is, what does art look like when it's created, when it's created? As a native art form for the internet.
So like, for example, for me, like one of the things that I'm have been best known for is making internet memes,
right,
So an internet meme is such a, is such a, a product of social media, right?
There was, there could not have been internet memes. A hundred years ago, like it
wouldn't have been fathomable. although there are certain, things like the da da art movement did have like these weird juxtapositions of text and images that were meant to be kind of silly and absurd.
So there are certain corollaries throughout art history or even pop art, you know, is something meme meme ish about pop art and Andy Warhol and things
like that. So there's breadcrumbs, right? But a meme is such a. It just, it's, it's a native art form to social media. So now we have this, it's almost a derogatory term to call someone an influencer.
I feel like, oh,
they're a social media influencer. It's such a like, blah. Like, I'm just here to , show my lifestyle and travel and get paid for it. But , I'm really interested , in the potential of this position of an influencer , in terms of making art, which, which, which just means like showing up and, Expressing yourself and, , sharing your, your life and your, and your art in a way that's more personal, right? So you're not just sharing the final product of your art, but you're really, inserting yourself into that conversation.
And it's kind of like how you're, how you talk about it, how you show up, Where people get to know you as a person as part of that, and that's part of what they're consuming. So you're, you still might make art, you still might be an author, you might be a writer, you might be a painter, but it's really like you become part of the art.
And it's, it's kind of like what, like what I see, like Andy Warhol was like, people have said that like. Andy Warhol's greatest work of art was himself. 'cause he, he curated this image that was , so iconic, right? And, and, and like, it's almost like he was a, a work of art in, in, in a way. So on social media, it just
opens up the door to share yourself, in new ways. And, and if you can do that with authenticity and in a way that's vulnerable and true, and I've seen it, how that can. create a, a bigger connection with an audience when they feel like they're, they, they get to know you and, and you're
inserting yourself into the equation rather than just seeing the finished product. It's like kind of opening up the door to behind the scenes
and, and, and, and having your lifestyle be part of what you're sharing.
Kate Shepherd: I think for a lot of people. Especially creatively, you know, people who are kind of drawn to this world of creative expression and who are on this healing path. There's probably a certain amount of trauma or difficult experiences that we're healing from. And oversharing can, , can be a trauma response . So how do we walk the line? And I, one of the things I always, this is kind of my guiding light guidepost, is I always wanna share from the scar not the wound. So if something is really a live for me and it's, I'm not done processing it yet, like it's not useful for me to share it with you in a public way, like my social media feed.
'cause it's not adding to your healing. It's certainly, I'm not done my healing. So it's not in service to anything and I wanna be in service to things, but. It can't always be in service to stuff. Like sometimes it is just an open mic night and you're sharing from the wound and it's actually, you've gotta, how do you walk that line on an everyday,
James-1: Yeah,
Kate Shepherd: how do you do it?
James-1: it's a great question and that's something that I'm always calibrating, because, um, social media is a medium that rewards frequency.
I used to be really uncomfortable sharing very often. I used to share, you know, on social media like once a week. And then what happened was when I started making memes, I really tapped into a new kind of creative energy. I just had so many ideas coming through me, I try to block off a big chunk of time every morning to be creative and that's, you know, pretty much non-negotiable unless, you know, I'm traveling that day or something important is happening. And, you know, some sometimes are more productive than others, and I don't
force it.
You know, like sometimes I might not have any ideas, but it's just the more I show up, the more swings at bat. I'll have to have a good idea and to
make a, a, something good. the past few years have been a, a lot have been, has been coming through me, so I started sharing a lot as a response just to, I had to get it out because I had all this, I had a backlog of of art to share, so I just started getting used to sharing more often, there's always a balance of quality and quantity. You know, like now I'd rather take my time to make sure that what I'm sharing is meaningful and substantial. And you know, it's like when you share in social media, you are affecting the consciousness of the people that see it,
Kate Shepherd: mm-Hmm.
James-1: or art in general. Actually, anything you do.
Kate Shepherd: Anything? I was just thinking actually,
even thoughts you have.
James-1: anyone that encounters anything you do or say you're affecting their consciousness,
even if it's just a little bit right. So first of all, , how do I want to affect people's consciousness? What is the impact I want to have on people? And I think it's really important to be clear on that. What's your role in the world and what's the role of your art? And what is the role of your social media profiles? And to be clear in your intention.
'cause then you can measure, okay, does this, is this piece of content aligned with my intention?
Kate Shepherd: Right.
James-1: Or even you're at a, you're, you're speaking to somebody, it's like, is what I'm going to say aligned with my intention as a human? And I think it's really important to. To fact check what we say and what we do and what we create and what we share with our intention to make sure we're having the desired impact on people. so now in my life as a person, as I'm talking to people or as I'm attending events or in the social media content, I share, I am trying to be more intentional and not just share for the sake of sharing, but to really say things in a way that. Can be an agent of my own purpose, you know, in whatever I deem that to be in bringing my intention into my work on a, in a, in a bigger way.
So there's no right. You know, some people share every day, some people share less frequently. I'm always kind of calibrating that within myself, and I think it's gonna be different for everyone.
Kate Shepherd: I love that. Bringing it back to intention. And you talk about that in the book in terms of even just finding out what creative projects you wanna work on, how important intention is for guiding your own expression. 'cause I mean, there's an infinite number of things that you could be, do, say, have create in the world, and you can get really overwhelmed trying to navigate, you know, always changing streams and, and having a really clear intention about what is my work in the world and what do I want it to be?
You get to decide that, that
there's no right or wrong, but you get to find out like, what is my deepest, wisest self telling me about why I'm here and what I'm supposed to do and what's, what are the desires and what are the, what's the yearning? And then how can I align what I share and how I share it with?
And I think that's really helpful for just limiting, there's a freedom in that limitation of your intention, which is what I
James-1: Yes,
Kate Shepherd: right? Yeah.
James-1: exactly. The more clear I've got with my intention, the more, um, just the more purposeful my work ends up being.
Kate Shepherd: I've noticed in my work, I, I teach a lot of, how to access your intuition.
'cause we've lost it. It's a lost, it's such an obvious part of us, but we've really lost the ability to even know, and we overcomplicate it. People think it's this magic trick. Oh, you're intuitive. You've got, you must be from a lineage of witches or no. Like, we all have this, that, so I, I find myself in this odd position of teaching people how to do this thing that I just think we all know how to do.
Okay.
but there does seem to be a real. Visceral fear when people come into CO because it's a presence. Intuition to me is just really coming into contact with this presence, this quiet presence that has been peering out of our eyes since we arrived.
And it's wordless so it doesn't speak any language.
It is, like you say, really communicating to us through desires and feelings and emotions and yes, a lot of yes no stuff. Like more yes no than any kind of thinking or feeling. And it's alive. It really does feel, I get a full body chill saying this to you. It's alive and it's a, doesn't that just sound, you know, if you're listening to this, that just sounds so beautiful and amazing and like the, that's what we are absolutely terrified of that presence.
This is, I see it over and over again. You talk about living a creative life requires us to cultivate a sense of that presence and of that power within, but we're really, really, really scared of it. How do we reconcile that?
James-1: When I look back at my own journey, what has enabled me to be more in touch with my intuition is having a dedicated meditation practice.
Kate Shepherd: Hmm.
James-1: Because one thing I've noticed is how many thoughts. We have during a day that are not helpful Thoughts And
i'll,
and it's also like you, if you're thinking it's really hard to be listening
Kate Shepherd: Hmm.
James-1: and the essence of intuition is listening because you are receiving something. It's out of your control. We'd like to be in control. Right. We like to
think that we're so smart. I figured this out
Kate Shepherd: Right.
James-1: well, when I truly have a good idea, I promise you it's coming through me and, and, and I can take credit for it only in so much as I prepared my mind and my consciousness to receive it.
Kate Shepherd: Right.
James-1: That's as much as I can take credit for it. 'cause I even, there's been, you know. My best poetry and I, and I, and I didn't really learn this fully until more recently, where I try to tune in and literally dictate the poem as it comes through me. So like I'll have a line to start a poem and I might not have any idea where it's going, but it's like that's what came to my mind. I'm not gonna object or try to think of a better idea. I'm gonna write it down exactly as it comes. And even if I'm writing it, I'm like, this, I don't quite understand this. It's like, doesn't matter. You don't need to understand it. Just follow where it takes you. So it's about listening. It's about listening and receiving. You could say it's, you know, what, where's it coming from? Who knows? You could call it your higher self. You know, you could call it maybe it's source creation itself. You know, which is another way of saying God,
Kate Shepherd: Right.
James-1: you know, maybe there are other entities working with us. That that's the whole idea of the muse.
Maybe there are other ethereal beings that, speak to us when we have ears to listen. When you're thinking too much, you can't listen. It sounds weird, like I really try when I'm going about my day, and especially during my creative process, I try not to think too much. I just try not to think, and sometimes that makes me absent-minded, like throughout the day because I'm just not paying attention all the way to certain things.
And, but what that does is it, it, it makes me receptive to ideas, so I'll just have things pop into my head and then I can just, you know. Take that and develop it. I think there's a role for thinking in the creative process. Like if you're editing something, you
can then you, your mind you, because the ego, the ego wants to be involved.
And, and we have this, this chatty ego that's always, overactive and. You know, there's so many different worries and regrets and anticipations and things that are just bouncing around in our heads all the time. I start every morning with something simple, like 10 or 15 minutes of meditation just to kinda get me in that, just clear that channel. But in the past, you know, I, I've used to meditate for one hour, two hours, three hours.
So, so just really to be grounded in that practice, right, and just to, um, train myself to. You know, know how to, how to do it. So now I maybe need less of it,
Kate Shepherd: the muscle almost. It's like you've Yeah. It's a muscle that you're build. That's what I'm hearing you saying . You can build that muscle and then it becomes almost habit, and then it's just, you're probably doing it. You don't have to sit still to do it. You're probably naturally spontaneously doing it
James-1: Totally. So it's just, for me, that's just about, you know, we can, it's hard to turn your mind off completely, but it's just about focusing your attention on that empty space between your thoughts
Kate Shepherd: Mm-Hmm
James-1: and just sitting there and, and being, again, it's being comfortable with that uncertainty
and, and, and just sitting with that unknown. And I promise you, if you do that long enough, something will start to speak to you.
Kate Shepherd: mm-Hmm. Will you tell us, tell us about your book. Tell us about how to, how to read this book, how to live with this book, how to integrate this book into your daily practice.
James-1: the essence of this book is, is creative alignment people get stuck in different places during the creative process. So what I've really tried to do was, was, is, was outline step by step how creativity works and how an idea goes from imagination into reality. so it's. It's divided. The first half is Creative Yin, which is about being, so this is, for me, this is the first half of the creative process and it's all before you even make anything at all. , it's about cultivating your own consciousness to be. Receptive to the voice of the muse. So there are chapters like how to set an intention, how to cultivate your intuition, how to use your imagination, whereas Creative Yang or doing is about developing your own style or learning how to experiment with technique or even. How to finish and launch projects, how to. Make money off of your work. And then lastly, it's about creativity and social impact. So how you can use your message, your art to make an impact in the world. So the whole book will kind of give you all the tools. To activate your inner artist in whatever way. And some people might need more help on the yin aspects.
Some people might need more help on the yang aspects, but I wanted to lay it all out so you can read it from beginning to end and it's like a full linear kind of progression. But you might just be really interested in, you know, creativity and money or in, or, or intuitions. You can kind of zoom in on, on chapters to find. What you're gonna, what you're, what you're seeking guidance on. and also it's a very visual book, so you're gonna flip through it. There's all kinds of illustrations and art, because I'm a visual learner and I know so many people are as well. So in addition to, you know, regular long form chapters, there's a ton of illustrations and art that will demonstrate the ideas in. Creative, fun, visual ways you can flip through it and just almost use it as a coffee table book and just get inspired by some of the visuals without having to dive deep into any of the chapters. So there's really something for everyone.
Kate Shepherd: Well, I was struck when I was experiencing this book that it isn't really just a book you read. You can, and I did, you read it cover to cover and it's useful that way. But even what you were just saying about how some people might want a little bit more of the yin and some people, like there are times in your life when you're gonna, you know, there'll be like, actually, this season right now, I need a lot more reminder about rest and cultivating flow and, and then there'd be, you know, six months from now I'm going through something else.
And, and I really, it was, it struck me that this was a book that you would live with and that would, it was. Like a living workshop. So it was almost like you, you're, you're walking yourself through what you need when you need it, and it, there are a lot of books out there that you read from start to finish and they affect you and they, but this is one that I think that the reader would keep with them and actually live with.
And so hats off to you. That's a huge accomplishment, especially with a subject like this that's so hard. It's so ineffable to try to pin some of these things down and I think you've done such a great job of it,
James-1: Thank you so much. I feel like the book was just trying to come through me and I was just, again, just listening to almost like the book is writing itself and I
was just trying to, you know, dutifully. Crafted into existence. , for me, a book is like a, a, a big sandbox. You have all these blank pages to play with. so I, I had a lot of fun making it, creating it, writing the chapters, making the art. So I hope it's infused with some of the, the love and joy that went into the, the creative process. And, and I, and I can, transmit some of that energy
, to the readers. And, and another thing that I love about it is all the stories I was able to tell about my favorite artists and writers and creators, because I feel like I've been studying art my whole life.
I love to watch documentaries on artists and read biographies or go on YouTube and watch interviews with some of my favorite creators, living and dead. so I picked up all of these stories and. Pieces of inspiration from some of my favorite artists, and I was able to sprinkle those all throughout the book so you get a little bit of an art history and writing history lessons throughout
the, throughout the span of the book.
Kate Shepherd: it's very rich. Like I am actually, it's a, you know, it's a little book where I'm just looking at it here. There's what is 220 pages or something like that, and it's, there's so much, there's just so much in here.
Yeah.
James-1: thank you so much.
Kate Shepherd: I wanted to invite you to read us the artist's pledge
James-1: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: us?
Before you do that, maybe tell us , where's the best place for us to get the book? Okay.
James-1: You can search for it anywhere. It's available on Amazon, all the, all the online retailers. There's a list of them all in my Instagram bio. And also I'm offering a bunch of bonus gifts with a purchase of the book. So if you buy the book, go to the link in my Instagram bio and you enter your order number, and there's a whole bunch of extras that you're gonna get, including a, a series that I'm hosting called Meet the Artist, where I'm interviewing,
Kate Shepherd: Some
incredible people. my favorite.
James-1: writers,
uh, and, uh, there's gonna be some other, like a, an an inner artist guided meditation that I'm, , doing.
Kate Shepherd: And I'll make sure. So your Instagram bio is, words are vibrations.
Did I get that right? Yeah. And, uh, we'll put all of this in the show notes. If you're driving down the street right now, you're listening to this, don't, you don't have to pull over and we'll, you just visit the website and you can get all of that.
It'll be in the show notes. So I wanted to, I wanted to get that outta the way before I, again, I always forget the, the business stuff.
James-2: Appreciate that.
the end of the book. I just wanted to write just a, a, a, a bit of a, an homage to, to, being an artist and to, and to living as an artist. So this is a, a little short passage called the Artist's Pledge. I promise to keep creating, to remain curious, to trust my instincts, to imagine a better world, to appreciate beauty. To take risks, to feel my fear and do it anyway to keep showing up no matter how hopeless it seems to give my mind and feet space to wander, to keep exploring the darkness in +search++= of light.
Kate Shepherd: Thank you. , I'm so glad you read that to us.
James-3: Yeah. Thanks for suggesting it.
Kate Shepherd: I usually at the end of every episode, I ask a question called the billboard question, but I think that that's gonna be our billboard for today.
James-3: That, that that whole thing can go on the billboard.
The whole artist.
Kate Shepherd: the whole, yes. Love it. I think that's so beautiful. Thank you for making the time to chat with me today.
I really appreciate it.
James-3: Oh no, the pleasure is all mine. Thanks for
having
me.
I don't know about you, but I feel so grateful to cross paths with people like James. His insights into creativity and vulnerability. And this amazing journey of self-discovery that we can go on when we open up and are willing to surrender. To something mysterious and bigger than ourselves. Have left an indelible mark on my heart and in my mind, And I suspect the same is true for you.
From the importance of embracing our creative impulses, no matter how imperfect. To the magic that can happen when we share them. Even though we might feel vulnerable about them. Or I believe that they're not ready to share with the people around us.
James is whispering for us to trust that there is a path toward a more authentic and fulfilling existence. And it starts inside of us. Being willing to listen and surrender. And maybe even be a little bit weird.
Creativity. Isn't reserved for the chosen few with exceptional talent.
I love that. James says that it's actually almost irrelevant that you have talent. This is a birthright that we all possess and there's this treasure trove of wisdom waiting to be an earth within each one of us inside of you right now. And by daring to question conventional wisdom and bravely share our unique gifts with the world.
Even if that's slowly at first. We become catalysts for our own transformation. and we build the wave of this Renaissance. That's coming. That's growing. That ultimately will transform humanity , into something that isn't glitching. And that is in fact thriving.
I love that James and I share that. Vision that we're not at an apocalypse. Even though many old ways of thinking and doing are coming to an end because they're no longer serving us. And there is a lot of ending energy in the world right now.
What it's leading to is a beautiful. Alive, new beginning. So thank you, James, for your generosity and sharing your time and your journey and your insights with us today. And to our listeners. Thank you for joining us on this. Vivid exploration of creativity, consciousness, and culture. I'd love to hear from you what you're working on, what you're excited about, what you're struggling with. Head over to at Kate Sheppard creative or at the creative genius podcast on Instagram or Facebook and drop me a line. I love being in community with you, and I'm so glad that we're on this path together.
And in case you missed it earlier, I want to make sure that you know that for the next little while, only for a limited time, I'm giving away for free as a gift. A copy of my beautiful new guided meditation. Deep listening with your whole being. I've created a lot of guided meditations over the years.
And this one is by far one of the best you can sign up to receive a copy of that on Kate shepherd, creative.com.
Your support and engagement.
Add fuel to this Renaissance that we're building. So if you feel called. Please head over to patrion.com/the creative genius podcast. And explore, having a membership with us it makes a huge difference and if you take one thing from this episode today, I hope it's that you'll remember that creativity is not just a solitary act. This is a communal celebration of our shared humanity. When we create an explore and share our light with each other and the world. We're actually fulfilling our greatest purpose.
Hey there, lovely souls! I've got some incredible news to share with you all. After years of pouring my heart and soul into crafting one-of-a-kind nature-inspired jewelry, I am beyond thrilled to announce that my handmade Nature Inspired jewelry line, Morning Moon will be showcased at the iconic Granville Island Public Market in Vancouver for the next two years!
A Journey Rooted in Nature: For those who don't know me yet, let me take you on a journey back to my roots. Growing up amidst the rugged beauty of Nova Scotia, I developed a deep love and reverence for nature. This connection inspired me to translate the magic of the natural world into wearable art. With Morning Moon, I strive to capture the essence of Mother Earth in each handcrafted piece, infusing them with love, meaning, and a touch of magic.
Resilience in the Face of Adversity: My journey hasn't been without its challenges. Like many, I've faced setbacks and obstacles along the way. From personal struggles to the upheaval of the pandemic, each trial has only strengthened my resolve to pursue my passion. Through it all, I've learned the transformative power of creativity and resilience, turning my struggles into fuel for inspiration.
A Commitment to Sustainability: I believe in more than just creating beautiful jewelry—I'm dedicated to making a positive impact on the planet. From ethically sourced gemstones to eco-friendly materials and sustainable packaging, I'm committed to reducing the environmental footprint of the fashion and jewelry industry. Partnering with organizations like Eden Reforestation allows me to give back to the Earth, one tree at a time.
Join me at Granville Island: Granville Island isn't just a market—it's a vibrant tapestry of culture, creativity, and community. Surrounded by the stunning waterfront views of Vancouver, it's the perfect backdrop for Morning Moon's nature-inspired creations. Whether you're a local or a visitor, I invite you to come and experience the magic of Morning Moon at Granville Island Public Market. We can connect, share stories, and celebrate the beauty of nature together.
Stay Connected: Excited to explore the world of Morning Moon? Dive into our collection at lovemorningmoon.com and KateShepherdCreative.com. Follow our journey on Instagram @lovemorningmoon and @kateshepherdcreative for behind-the-scenes glimpses and exclusive updates.
Discover Granville Island: Plan your visit to Granville Island Public Market and immerse yourself in its rich tapestry of art, culture, and culinary delights. From artisanal treasures to mouthwatering treats, there's something for everyone to enjoy. Join me in celebrating the spirit of creativity and community on Granville Island.
Gratitude and Excitement: Before I sign off, I want to express my deepest gratitude to each and every one of you who has supported Morning Moon on this incredible journey. Your love, your stories, and your unwavering belief in the magic of nature have inspired me beyond words. Together, we're crafting a brighter, more beautiful world, one piece of jewelry at a time.
With love and gratitude,
P.S. Don't forget to mark your calendars and visit me at Granville Island Public Market for a truly magical experience! Let's make memories and celebrate the beauty of nature together.
]]>LISTEN IN APPLE PODCASTS, SPOTIFY OR YOUR FAVOURITE PODCAST APP
EPIOSDE SUMMARY
In this enlightening episode of The Creative Genius Podcast, we are joined by Jaime Hamilton, a passionate middle school English teacher and talented watercolour artist. Jaime shares her journey of embracing her purpose and navigating imposter syndrome while empowering teenagers to embrace their individuality.
Jaime opens up about her personal mission to become the mentor she longed for during her own teenage years, now guiding her current students with compassion and wisdom. Through teaching teenagers, she has unearthed invaluable insights about herself and the human experience, offering transformative lessons on authenticity and self-discovery.
If you've ever grappled with your inner critic or sought guidance on navigating the complexities of teenage years, this episode is a must-listen. Join us as we delve into the heart of mentorship, resilience, and the pursuit of true authenticity.
Through her insights, she illuminates the challenges of self-judgment and conformity in the middle school environment, offering valuable lessons on authenticity and self-discovery. Join us as we explore the transformative power of creativity, resilience, and trusting one's inner wisdom.
SHOW NOTES
Kate Shepherd welcomes listeners to another inspiring episode of The Creative Genius Podcast and introduces the remarkable guest, Jaime Hamilton, a middle school English teacher and watercolor artist from California. Jaime shares her personal mission to be the mentor she needed during her teenage years, now guiding her students with compassion and wisdom. She discusses her journey from being a reluctant English teacher to embracing the profound insights teaching middle school kids has given her, despite initially preferring to teach history.
Jaime offers a glimpse into her approach to connecting with teenagers in her classroom, highlighting the challenges of reaching out to certain groups while remaining authentic. She reflects on the misconception of mistaking our inner critic for ourselves and the liberating realization that brings. Jaime shares strategies for confronting our inner critic, including journaling and engaging in dialogue with it, emphasizing the importance of authenticity and self-compassion.
The conversation delves into various topics, from embracing imperfection in creativity to navigating childhood traumas and finding healing through self-expression. Jaime and Kate exchange stories about survival and resilience, emphasizing the transformative power of creativity and honest relationships. They explore the energetic portal of creativity and the significance of trusting one's intuition in the creative process.
KEY TAKEAWAYS:
FULL TRANSCRIPT
ATR2100x-USB Microphone-2: Hello there it's me. Kate shepherd. I'm so happy to be sitting here with you today for another beautiful episode of the creative genius podcast.
ATR2100x-USB Microphone-1: We have a really beautiful guest for you today. And I'm going to tell you a little bit about her more in a minute, but first. You know, those images that you look at and you see them a certain way, maybe you look at it and you see a horse. And then your friend says, Hey, I actually see an old lady. And then you squint at it and he kind of puzzled over it until you to see the old lady. But then now you can't. Unsee that. And go back to the image that you used to see.
It's an, it's an amazing thing that can happen when you have a profound experience of changing your perspective on something.
I've been having some experiences with my inner critic recently that are like that.
For most of my life, I thought. That, that thing inside of me, that was constantly whispering horrible things at me, , making me believe that. Things were scary and that I should stay small. Or that I wasn't very good at creativity or that I was too loud or too opinionated. I too many feelings or I wanted too much, or I wasn't worthy of love. Or friendship. At life didn't have my back and I better keep hustling. That's too late.
I'm too old. I'm too fat. I'm broken beyond repair. I'm a lovable. Things are never going to work out. So I better not relax all of those things. That that voice would whisper to me. I really believed that that was me. I heard that voice and it sounded like it was happening in my, my voice. So I thought it was me. But I've been starting to see, really see that, that inner critic isn't me and it never was. And once I started seeing that I couldn't unsee it. I see now. That that part of us and we all have it in us. Is, uh, it's an apparition of some sort, it's a, it's a facsimile of a person.
It's not actually a real person. It's not you and it's not anybody else.
It's a conglomeration of people. And it's a mechanism that I, as far as I can see sprouts up to keep us safe from various different things in our life when we're too young. You know, when we're little, we need to have a little voice in our head saying don't run into traffic. Or don't climb that tree to the very tippy, tippy top. And it serves a purpose.
It keeps us safe and its job is to take all of the salient information from the outside world. Internalize it and animated in such a way that helps us make good choices, ones that help us survive.
And as we grow through life, This ever evolving. Audio hologram for lack of a better term. Is fueled by fed by informed by this rolling collection of the most influential people and situations in our world, parents, teachers. Bosses boyfriends, husbands, wives, coworkers, friends, neighbors, even media. Fragments of their voices and ideas gathering. Momentum and volume, and it's powerful enough to paralyze us into inaction. Or into smallness or what it thinks is safety.
Unchecked. This entity starts gathering some of the most scary things it can find because it, I think it feels like those things are the most useful. And it's constantly sending us warnings about them. And we can find ourselves in a place where we don't want to. We're too scared to have a voice we're too scared to ask for what we want.
We don't feel like we can be confident. We're scared to go after our dreams. . We're immobilized by fear from, from things that this thing is constantly whispering to us because we've left it unchecked. We haven't checked what the inputs are into this thing. I have been personally very paralyzed by that voice.
I let these, this inner voice squeeze my own, voice it to silence. I let it isolate me from friends and lovers and.
Communities and I let it make me not say what I really felt or thought. I let it make me be on my best behavior rather than brave and bold. And I let it take me quite far away from myself for a long time. Because I really did believe when it told me that if I didn't bad or dangerous or scary things would happen.This part of us gets formed when we're really little to keep us safe.
You know, that little kid who shouldn't be running out into traffic it's about that time. I think that this part of us starts to form. And for those of us who didn't have a wise. Resourced adult at this pivotal time and the creation of this inner guide. We ended up modeling after whoever was there.
And in a lot of cases, there's a lot of baggage in that person that we end up internalizing too. And what I saw that I couldn't unsee I just think is the most incredible miracle in the world. Is that by design? This thing is malleable. It's designed to evolve over time. And while it may have evolved to tell us all the negative, scary things that keep us small with practice. And compassion.
We can feed it new information. And train it to help us better. We could actually deprogram the guilt and the shame. And begin to feed it with trust and curiosity and joy. We really can. We can partner up with this inner moderator. And show it. What kind of information is useful to us? We'll help us navigate. Into a life where we're thriving. And letting it all hang out. And where we're really expressing ourselves and enjoying ourselves.
And our guests today.
And I talk about that. Jamie Hamilton is a middle school English teacher and watercolor artist. From California. Whose purpose right now is being that teacher. That she needed when she was a teenage girl.
There are a lot of really profound insights in this episode. And I can't wait for you to hear it.
I feel like I was really born to do this work, For a lot of my life because of those voices, I didn't let myself believe that I might have a purpose. And as soon as I started doing the creative genius podcast, I realized this is what I'm born to do. To have these conversations to give voice to this wisdom and this intelligence that is bursting at the seams to try to find its way back to us. And it is an honor for me to do this, this work.
And it's my gift to you. It takes me. I realized the other day at about 25, sometimes 30 hours. To create one episode, all the things that go into creating the episode, finding a guest and reading their book and pouring over the questions and having the time on the phone with them and then editing it and then mastering the sound and creating show notes and social media posts and newsletter articles, and sitting down and recording these intros and the outros for this. I mean, it's just a huge job and I love doing it.
And like I said, it's what I'm born to do. And part of what I'm learning, how to do is how to lean into support from my community to support me, to create the thing that supports you. So I'm asking you, if you listen to this show and you, and it touches you and it feeds you and you receive something from it. Please consider signing up for my Patrion.
There are multiple different levels that you can join. , there's the $5 Patrion, which would be brilliant. It's a $5 a month. It's like buying me a coffee to thank me for creating the show. And for that, you get all of the episodes a week early.
You'll get a bonus episode. You'll get the occasional extra bit of content here and there. And it is a wonderful way of supporting me to keep creating this show for you. And I really actually can't do it without you. And there are other levels too, you know, there there's the colorful community where once a month I do, uh, in depth hour long live workshop on how to activate our intuition and creativity. And wherever you are in that, please know that I'm so grateful to be in this relationship with you. And I really do rely on your support.
So if you haven't signed up to be a Patrion please consider doing it. I really, won't be able to continue doing it without. Receiving support from the community. So thank you for considering that there are other ways to, you can help. You could buy my artwork or jewelry on KateShepherdCreative.com or on loveMorningmoon.com. Those are fantastic ways of supporting me to continue to do this work. And there might be other ways that I haven't even thought of yet that you might think of to support me, to keep growing the show. We need to do public relations. We need to do emails and marketing and editing. And there's so many ways that you might plug in. To helping me grow this show and continue to create this really deep and profoundly healing and beautiful content for people. Um, that I might not have even thought of yet.
So if there's a way that you want to plug in and help, please know that. I'm open to receiving that support from you now, or so if you want to get in touch to discuss any of those things, you can email me kateshepherdcreative AT gmail.com or you can send me a direct message on any of the social media platforms.
You're going to love this conversation with Jamie today. She, her whole being is just a smile, a beautiful, gorgeous smile. She came from a pretty. Rough beginning. She didn't have loving, compassionate, gentle parents when she was small. And in fact had to navigate some pretty.
horrible messages from her own parenting. But she grew up to be this person who just has the biggest heart and is so naturally loving and beautiful and encouraging. And accessible.
, I think my favorite part of this episode is when I asked her.
part of the journey that we go through in being brave to show up in this life as our true selves. You know, when we transcend some of those voices, our inner critic has been laying on us for years and we finally realized, oh, there's another version of me here. That's trying to show up. That can be scary.
And I asked her. You know, how do you do that? How do you navigate showing up as your full self? It's scary. It can be, especially at first and. Her answer was so simple. But. Profound and helpful. And it was another one of those kind of light bulb moments for me.
So I can't wait for you to hear that part of the episode. So if you have an inner critic in your life, if you have. Teenagers in your life. If you're looking for inspiration and encouragement to. Find the bravery and courage to. show up as more of your true, authentic self. This episode is for you. And I can't wait for you to hear it. Enjoy my conversation with Jamie Hamilton.
Track 1: I'm so glad to finally meet you. Thank you for coming.
Jaime Hamilton: Me too.
I'm, I am so honored. Like, I, I've listened to some of your guests and I'm like, super imposter syndrome here. I'm like,
what do I have to add? Like, these incredible artists and these people who've written books and stuff. But, we put that in a box.
we put that in a box.
Kate Shepherd: Well. I, so, but let's talk about that for a second, because actually I've been going through a lot of that lately of, of just like that and realizing that that voice is not me, but I've thought it was me my whole life. And Well, maybe let's come back to that for, hold on. Back up the truck.
love that we're order there. Why you start off by,
Track 1: telling our listeners who you are
and, where you are right now? And if you had to put the work that you were put here to do in the world into one sentence, your highest purpose, like if you feel like you have a calling,
you know, what would it be?
Jaime Hamilton: my name is Jamie., I live about two miles from my. Childhood home in California and Sonoma County I, I'm a mom to a 6-year-old co-parenting mom. I am a middle school English teacher and I'm uh watercolor artist my purpose,right now is to be in the classroom Being that teacher that I needed
when I was a teenage girl,
you know what I
mean?
And showing them that it's okay to feel it's okay to have emotions. It's okay to create, it's okay to be weird. it's okay to be all of these things. being an artist and selling my work at farmer's markets, it's really interesting to see the way kids just naturally come up to my booth or to me, and then on the flip side to see how their adults or the other adults do too.
So I think that I'm on this planet to serve teenagers, because they're some of the neediest human beings that we know.
Kate Shepherd: I believe that creativity is the intelligence that's animating the universe. It's that quiet thing that nudges you to create your art or to leave a job or a relationship. And as far as I can see it, I think it's that same thing that tells Bamboo how fast to grow or starfish, how to move across the rock.
Like it's all creativity
and we could come up with different words for it. And you know, we do and we have, but really, for all intents and purposes, that's, that's what I think creativity is. when we suppress it or uh, don't let it express itself freely in our lives and let it guide us, we start to glitch.
And that's why I say humanity's, glitching. 'cause we've just systematically found all of these ways to indoctrinate people into this world of the rational mind where creativity doesn't really have.
Home and in my own work as an artist and as a, an intuition coach, which I find myself doing more and more of as people are kind of hungrily going, okay, well what is this other part of me that I,
that I know I have inside?
And how do I learn how to, you know, I'm often reminded just how widespread that is. Like how routinely we are denying this part of ourselves. And, you know, so many people just truly believe that they don't have creativity in them or that they're not entitled to it or that they don't deserve it. Or the imposter syndrome.
I mean, all of the ways. And so that's why I dedicated my, I wanna be in service to helping as many people as I can come into contact with this beautiful thing and let it lead their lives. And I was really so excited to talk to you, especially as a teacher of middle school kids, because I feel like that is.
That is such a critical pivotal time. I mean, I think, what do you think about what I'm gonna say here? I feel like around 10 is when we start to that judge, the self judgmental side, we start to interpret all those things and then, and then you go right into being a teenager. And what has teaching shown you about all of this?
Jaime Hamilton: this is my 15th year teaching In so many ways, it's changed and in so many ways, kids are just always the same. You know what I mean? Like the neediest ones ask for love in the hardest of ways. And, what I've discovered teaching English, which I, I did not enter teaching to teach English. I wanted to be a history teacher 'cause that's what my major was. And I hated English. I just hated it, you know what I mean?
Like in high school it was like, Shakespeare sucks , I'll never do this again. And I love teaching.
Am Midsummer Night's Dream too? Teenagers because they're like, I like this girl, but I don't want her to know, you know? And like Shakespeare, he gets teenagers, but I digress. in middle school we are so trying to be just like everyone else and it's like. You talk about that glitch, that disconnect.
And they're so unhappy trying to be like everybody else. And if they just realized how freaking amazing they are individually, what makes you beautiful is that you are so different. I have one girl this year who is just quirky as all get out, like laugh at inappropriate times, just like she's like a mini Jamie, you know? And, and I tell her all the time, like, we would've been friends if I was 12 and you were 12. But like, she is so like unabashedly herself and it's so interesting watching her peers. They don't like it I don't know. It's really hard to explain. I, I feel like in my classroom we do a lot of talk about, we're all different, we all have different experiences.
We're, um, you know, and that's what makes us great. We don't have to be the same. We don't have to think the same. And in, in middle school it's like really, it's this sweet spot where yes, you are combating that like need for, um, conformity, but also they're still open to the idea of, well, I am unique and I am different.
And I am special. And, you know, I, I didn't have a lot of, uh, love or support growing up, like, especially in the middle school Era, for me it's equally like, it's even more important to remind them that they are beautiful, that they're unique, that they're rad just the way they are, and that they don't have to have it all figured out.
'cause these middle schoolers, they're just like, they're stressed. They're stressed out.
Kate Shepherd: What are they stressed out about? Are they stressed out about that tension between wanting to express their true self and the need to conform? Would you say that's like the biggest
thing? Yeah.
Jaime Hamilton: Yes. Like this need to fit in. , it's like jamming, what is that phrase? Like a round
peg into a square hole or whatever. You know, they, they need to fit in and like, that's what school's teaching them how to fit in and commas, but you know how to fit in. But. They're like, their insides are just so diametrically opposed to that because they don't fit in and, you know, I don't think we were meant to fit
in. my daughter was just diagnosed with autism. She's six and her dad, and I know that she's neurodivergent. We know that she's different. and it's just been really interesting going through the IEP process with her and, and watching her with her peers. she's so different and on some level she doesn't care. But it's that same thing on another level. She knows that she's different and she knows that she doesn't quite fit in. So it's like a push pull, if that makes sense.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. What, what is IEP?
Jaime Hamilton: it's called an individualized education plan,
You know, as teachers, we love our acronyms.
Kate Shepherd: So when you are close to kids and you see them going through this and grappling with this, I. To me that feels like if I, like, if I had to be in that situation, I feel like I'd be so overwhelmed by how to deal with it.
'cause kids are powerful. They have this big energy.
They are, they're a little scary. I mean, I have kids and I find them a little scary sometimes. You know, those big feelings. And,
Jaime Hamilton: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: and, but you also said a minute ago, you know, they, some of them ask for love in some really difficult ways. in those moments, how do you, how do you show up for them?
'cause this juggernaut of an idea that you have to be acceptable and be a certain way and be like everybody else, or be the thing that is, you know, curate yourself so that you're palpable and, or that you're acceptable and people love you. And that's really enormous. Like that is woven into the fabric of, of our reality.
And so trying to help. Anybody, whether it's a teenager or yourself and your own inner critic, navigate that and, and tease it apart and find another voice to listen to. I mean, I'm finding it as a 47-year-old woman, really hard to do now even. So how do you do that with your kids when you come up, when you see that that's what's at play, how do you guide them through that?
Jaime Hamilton: With everything that we do, we have to just be authentic. And kids more so than adults can tell when you're lying or tell, they can tell when you're BSing. And I, I used to tell one of my former student teachers who is an incredible English teacher now, him himself, just be truthful.
Just be honest and be true to you because they know they can sniff out a liar like nobody. and not all teachers do this, my, approach is, is use, honesty and truth. You know, one of my tattoos that I have on my shoulder, it's truth without fear. And I really do try to live by that in my classroom, in my personal relationships, in my relationship with my daughter and her, you know, my co-parent, when my students are struggling or grappling with these big ideas or grappling with who they wanna be, or even just small behaviors in the classroom, nine times outta 10, it can be fixed with a personal one-on-one conversation like, Hey man, you seem like uh, you're a little off today. Do you wanna go take a walk and just come back? You know, and allowing them the grace to misbehave because they're going to misbehave because they are teenagers. demonstrating too that we as adults have off days and this is how I cope. This is how I deal with my off days. It's a very, relationship oriented approach to teaching. now in 2024 when there are so many competing things for their attention, you know, having that eye contact, having that face-to-face, having that like true conversation I think is the way to, get through. And we do a lot of, um, like journaling, art journaling. We did this really cool coffee filter activity the other day where I had them in a coffee filter, put right down the seeds of things that they wanted to grow, and then we put like markers on 'em and then we used water to spread it out. treating them like adults or treating them like human beings, I think is really what I'm trying to say. because. People give teenagers a really bad rap, but I think they have it more figured out than we give them credit for. And their moral encompasses are tweaked by hormones, but I mean, who isn't? I think at the end of the day, they know what's good and they know what's not good.
Kate Shepherd: I feel like I would be scared to hang out with a room full of teenagers all day. Maybe I wouldn't, may, maybe I'm not giving them enough credit. I just remember who I was as a teenager and I think, oh my God.
Jaime Hamilton: It's really hard to connect with them some days. I have one or two classes in particular this year where it's like, okay, I cannot share my true, true self with this group.
Kate Shepherd: So how do you navigate that? How do you, so you have a feeling I cannot, I cannot show up as my true, true self here. That's, I'm presuming that's the voice of wisdom in you showing up. There's something wise in you that goes that they're not ready. This isn't the place. I can't, what, you know, it's intuition is guiding you in one way or another.
how do you figure out what to say? How authentic to be I, 'cause I struggle with that in just like day-to-day life. You know, how much of myself can I really show up as you know, how much of my messy,
yeah.
I don't know what I'm doing self can I
bring this? Especially if you're in a leadership role.
That's a,
Jaime Hamilton: Yeah.
Um, you know, it's funny, I was having a conversation with a kid, um, on Thursday about this, and he was like, I find it easier to talk to strangers online. And I said, I find it easier to talk to strangers on the street. And then I said, be careful what you say online kid.
But,
Track 1: Right.
Jaime Hamilton: but, um, you know, this idea that sometimes with people that we don't know, it is so much easier to be your real and true, authentic self
because there's not that pressure of knowing that they're gonna come back and we're gonna continue to have conversations. With this one class in particular, it's just the makeup of the group and,
Kate Shepherd: Like a Lord of the Flies kind of vibe.
Jaime Hamilton: ish. I connect really well to those kids who, come from not super great homes. I feel like I have more in common with those kids and I have a really difficult time with, um, entitlement so I just kind of have to take a step back when I can see that,
and not everybody is worthy of seeing your true self. Not
everybody is worthy, , or has earned the right to see those pieces of you. With that particular class, it just takes a little bit more time and a little bit more relationship building and a little bit more, they need less of me and they need more of each other.
I
think that's really what it boils down to.
Kate Shepherd: So what has all of this taught you about navigating your own inner protective parts and, and personality and, and it, you know, pasts traumas and, because I imagine you can't do this work and it not bring up stuff for you. Yeah.
Jaime Hamilton: It does. It absolutely does. I started seeing a therapist in 2020 during the lockdown to deal with some really heavy family stuff.. What's interesting is that the, the things that I've thought that I've healed from the things that I thought that I outgrew, , with this new job. 'cause I started a new, at a new school in August, and with this new relationship that I'm in, which I also started in August,
it brought up all of these things that I thought that I'd fixed or that I thought that I'd addressed.
And even my counselor last week, she was like, you have, but this is just the next layer.
Kate Shepherd: Oh good.
Jaime Hamilton: Oh, I know, right?
Kate Shepherd: there's more layers.
Jaime Hamilton: I know, I know. Yeah. Uh, that was, that was a hard session.
I do a lot of journaling. I've always been a journaler, I've always been a writer. I've always been, you know, a crafter, a creator or this, that, or whatever.
I play music, I sing, I, I do all this stuff. And, when life gets really, really heavy, one of my coping mechanisms is just to shut everyone and everything out. Close the door, sit in my notebook, sit in my paint, sit with my guitar, you know, uh, listen to James Taylor, who's my celebrity crush, and just to go internal and the struggle this year, since August specifically, again with this new relationship and this new job, is I can't go internal anymore. Like I have this, I. Incredible man in my life. And he's like, you, where'd you go? You can't go there. it affects my teaching, because I, I just, I get grouchy, I get angry, I get, you know, moody and teenagers, man, they match
whatever energy you have.
And that, I'm gonna tell you right now, that is a long 100 minute block.
Kate Shepherd: Well, and I think there is this weird idea that we're supposed to con like find out who we are, heal our stuff and show up as the best version of us. And just like, you know, always show up that way in the, in, in all the different places in our life. And I mean, we are laughing about the layers, but that's actually a gift.
Like we're going deeper and deeper and deeper and. and. There isn't supposed to be a place where we arrive and we're just good and we're done and we're,
but that's really hard to be in the world in a consistent way, you know, authentic. Like showing up authentically really means like, sometimes, you know, especially for a lot of people listening who I think are probably people pleasers, a lot of us creatives tend to tend to be people pleasers.
Jaime Hamilton: Or it's like, here, I made this thing. Love me. Look, I
made this thing Love me.
You know? Or like, I made you this thing. Love me.
Kate Shepherd: I mean, I noticed this a lot with my little kids when they were, when they were little, little, and they always brought me art. Like my daughter just, she's nine and she's just stopping that phase where she would, you know, draw me little birds and bring them to me. Like I have just, every notebook is got stuff falling out of it, and they're always giving you gifts.
And it's like, look what I made you, I, to me, the, what I was hearing was, look what I made you. I love you.
Like, like always an offering of like, I love you. I love you. I
Jaime Hamilton: Well, and then at what point does that look what I made you? I love you. Turn into look what I made. Love
Track 1: Mm-hmm.
Jaime Hamilton: And I feel like in that middle school, you know, between 10 and 15 is really when, when our kids shift, you know, like, call it puberty, call it socialization, call it whatever. it's just really interesting.
And then we as adults spend that the rest of our lives trying to go back to that. Look what I made, I love you stage. And it's just, it's really interesting.
Track 1: Especially if, if you're somebody who it, your creativity and your drive to create is quite large, it makes natural sense that you would want to turn that into your livelihood. And that is the, that is the dynamic in that livelihood is, look what I made, love me, buy it from me.
Right? It can't just
be a pure offering anymore. And it, and it, that's a hard line
to walk.
Jaime Hamilton: I'm so glad you brought that up because, I experienced the most intense burnout in December I was looking at my Instagram post, 'cause I, I try to post every day 'cause it makes me feel good and, and I, I love putting my artwork out in the universe, but there were like two and a half weeks where I didn't post anything, I came into January knowing I need to create, not for anyone else, but for me. I'm at this place right now where I just have to create, for me, it's not to sell, it's not to do, it's, you know, it's not to launch a collection or this, that, and the other, but I need to create just for me. yes, we're serving others by creating our art and putting it out in the world.
And yes, we're mothers, we're serving our children and we're doing this. Or we're wives, or we're sisters. Or we're daughters, or whatever it is we are. But I think it's really important that we, check in with ourselves and, and create just for the sake of creating.
Kate Shepherd: So
tell me about what that looks like for you. When I think about creating, just for me, I, I can't even imagine. I mean, I love the act of creating, I love the idea of. Making something that didn't exist five minutes ago, like and beauty, I love generating beauty. That is just
what a trip that we can, that we can just do that at will.
But creating for myself, I don't really know what that means. What does that mean to you?
When the world is really, really heavy or life is really heavy or I'm just in this mucky place, I have to get it out of my head in, into my notebook or out of my head and onto paper I do a lot of my processing in my notebook for me it's more therapeutic, I guess.
Track 1: Can you give
us an example of something you might create that way
Jaime Hamilton: I keep coming back to, these onions after my counseling session. It's just like onions on the brain. And I just started doodling. These onions, it wasn't, it wasn't for anybody else but me. When you look at an onion, it has all these rings. And it made me think about, I did watch Shrek with my child a couple weeks ago and, you know, ogres have layers, so do humans. But like at each layer, what, what are we dealing with?
What are we experiencing? What, you know, what questions do I have? What, what's at the juicy, meaty part of the center of this onion? Like, what am I trying to get to? And so, for me, the act of just creating for creation itself is more of a, I think, a conversation with myself,
Track 1: Yeah.
With a part of, with a true part of yourself. 'cause we were talking earlier about this, and I've been thinking a lot about this thing that I've mistaken for myself my whole life, which is this kind of, it's my, my inner critic, right? Which, which I've accidentally, 'cause it's so close and it's so embedded that I've mistaken it for myself.
But when I really sort of look at it, I realize actually it's this like. Facsimile of a person. It, you
know, that sort of sits really close . And so I had some words with it this morning. Like, you know, it was being really hard on my like, oh, it's too late, you're gonna fail. You've already failed.
All the failure. Failure, don't even bother trying. And then I just get really heavy and tired. I wanna give up on everything and I forget all to see all the good. And I've been in therapy talking to, you know, we're trying to be gentle with it and let it find a new job for it. And I've been doing that for about a year and this morning I was just like, that's not working.
and I just kind of had this really intense conversation with it where I was just like, I'm onto you. I know you're not me. Like I, like you're, I've I've found you out and what you're doing is really not helpful. Like what you're doing is, what's the point in making me feel like shit all the time?
What are you trying to, like, I get that you started off trying to help me and make me survive when I was like six years old and needed to have a parent voice, making sure that I don't run into traffic and
all that stuff, you know, in my head. But like, now, what are you doing? Like,
you're fired. you're fired. and I'm not, and I know you're gonna still be here jabbering on and on and on, and, but, but I'm onto you now and I'm gonna be looking for you and basically fuck off.
I've, I've, and I've tried being gentle with it
hasn't worked,
Jaime Hamilton: my inner critic is, um, she's really ugly. She's really, really ugly. Like, do you remember those anti-smoking ads from the eighties and nineties
where there was the, it was covered in tar.
That's what my inner critic looks like. And she says things like, you're not beautiful.
You are not enough . You're, unlovable. You're not, you're not worthy. And she's not me. I know that she's my mother because those are things that my mother would tell me. And, uh, those are things my father would tell me. And it's so important for us to know that those voices, they're not coming from us and they don't stay long term. and so what I've had to do, you had to tell yours to fuck off this morning. I really wish I could, but mine just needs to be reminded. No, you are beautiful and you are lovable and you are not perfect. But we love you anyway. And you are worthy. You are worthy of the love that you are seeking.
You're worthy of the love that you're putting out there. I have to write myself love letters and, and it's funny 'cause I, I too write my dude love letters and I put 'em in the mail. I love the idea of snail mail, but I have been writing myself love letters to remind myself just, how. Desired and lovely and wonderful. We are, because there's just, there's too much in the world telling us that we're not like, especially as women,
you're supposed to be a mom, you're supposed to be working, you're supposed to be doing this. The, the kitchen's supposed to be clean, the laundry's supposed to be done, you know? And um, I say fuck off to all that personally,
Track 1: I have had moments where, that inner critic, for me, it's so close that it's, it's, I don't even see it as a thought. It's a, it comes in as a feeling and it's just like
already overwhelmed. I've already failed. It's already
futile. There's already too much.
I'm broke.
Like all the things and I'm curious what you think about the, you know, I, I got to a place today where I was just exasperated with it,
and it gets to be like a house of mirrors inside, right? It's like, who's exasperated with who and who am I? Who's writing love letters to who and where's the
real, how do you find the real me in all of this?
What, which one of those things to you is the real you?
Jaime Hamilton: I think that it's really important for us to have friendships with people who, who know and see the real us
because when we're in those intense moments of like, I am a fucking failure. I did this one thing wrong and he's never gonna wanna talk to me ever again, or I did this one thing wrong, I'm gonna get fired. and. I think that our friends, uh, like our, our close friends and chosen family are the ones who can just put their hands on our shoulders and just say, when we can't ourselves. you're okay. I mean, you're not okay and it's okay not to be okay,
but you're okay and it's gonna be okay. Because, um, it's a lot to carry those multiple people in our heads, hearts, whatever. and I, I try to carve out time in the morning to, to write, to journal, to write my notes to myself. but when life gets busy, I think it's, it like that connection piece, connecting with others is so incredibly important. And especially for someone who likes to isolate, it is so important.
Track 1: I think a, a very common response to having gone through really difficult things in the past is to isolate. And so there might be, you know, people listening to this going, okay, well yeah, that's, I, I, I have all that too, but I, there are, there is nobody in my world who really sees me, who I've let see me, what, what would.
You say to either a student you had or you know, somebody listening to this going, yeah, but I'm alone. I don't have that reflection. I don't have anybody to do that. For me,
Jaime Hamilton: Such a hard question.
Track 1: is, I know.
Jaime Hamilton: we talked earlier about sharing with strangers and I, I think that
that is a great place too. You know, the beauty of doing these farmer's markets that I do is that I'll have strange conversations with people that I'm never gonna see ever again.
And I, I wrote something down the other day.
It's like I. In a lot of these conversations, I'm just kind of dropping these truth bombs you know, maybe more for myself than for them. But you can have really interesting and intimate conversations with strangers in a safe way, um, that you maybe can't have with other people that you are
Track 1: Hmm.
Jaime Hamilton: to.
Track 1: love that.
Jaime Hamilton: So, you know, I, there's a little dog park down the way here and when I'm in my head, I'll take my notebook and I'll walk down there and and, I always run into one or two people and we have a, a conversation, connecting with people I think is key, especially now , like post lockdown stuff and then, being outside The sunshine is the cure for everything.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
I, I'm hearing from you putting yourself out into the world. Even if you're
really alone, you can put, there are always ways to put yourself out into the world in
Track 1: new places. And it, and it actually leads me to something I wanted to ask you. You've written about finding balance in the unbalanced and love in surprising places and connection in previously disconnected places.
I wondered if you could say a little bit about that.
Jaime Hamilton: finding balance in chaos is like where I thrive, you know, like when I have a lot going on in my life, I'm able to just kind of compartmentalize and dedicate time, dedicate this, dedicate that. And so finding balance in unbalanced whatever is something that I feel like I'm pretty good at. Growing up we, we grew up in absolute chaos . From the outside it looked like a normal family. And, you know, it was not, but, um, finding love in surprising places, I think people act as mirrors, and we see in others the things that we love and likewise don't love about ourselves. I think when I wrote that piece, I was, and still am in this just beautiful place with this human being. in him I can see all the things that are lovable about myself and then conversely in him, I can see all of the things that are ugly and dark and need help. We're all work in progress.
Track 1: I'm imagining there are people listening to this going, Ooh, I wanna know more about how she finds balance in chaos. Because, you know, some people thrive in it, but some people really don't. They just sort of shut, because there's like, you either, you know, fight or flight and you're like, you're doing it all.
You're, you're, or you freeze and you can't do any of it. And so for the person who doesn't know how to find balance in the unbalanced or chaos, what would be your, if you had to throw them a life raft, what would you, what would you throw them?
Jaime Hamilton: it's just do the next thing,
Just do
the next thing. Uh, December was really, really hard for me. total overwhelm, total mayhem and my personal, my relationship, my child stuff. And the only thing that I could do was put one foot in front of the other I , I journaled about it. The thing that came out was, the only way through it is through it. You know, it's like that book going on, a bear hunt gonna catch a big one. I'm not afraid, you know, there's mud up ahead, can't go around, it can't go under it. You just gotta go through it. Some seasons that is way more difficult. Some seasons you have a whole cheerleading squad behind you cheering you on, and then others, it's just you and you just gotta put one foot in front of the next and just do the next thing that you can do.
Track 1: All those parts can come up and make you feel like, no, you should need to do this and you need to do that. And you're like, I can't just, what's the next right thing? That's such a good, that's such a good answer.
Jaime Hamilton: Well, and then trusting yourself too,
Track 1: How do you trust yourself? Do you, so, and I wanted to ask you about this, 'cause this feels like I, this is connected to creativity in that it's like, I think creativity is the voice of, of. All the opposite of what we're talking about. So creativity is the love and the compassion and the knowing and the intuition and the knowing.
I'm gonna say that again. 'cause I
feel like creativity is so much of that, that feeling, knowing or the action of knowing, like it's like dropping into this place that just spontaneously knows.
And there is this like, you know, tug of war between these two parts of us, it seems like where, you know, this, these these know-it-all parts wanna push us into doing things.
And this creative part or this intuitive part is just like, but it's just like this and they don't live in the same realms. And because we get ragdolled, you know, sometimes we're really in the rational mind and we're in the inner critic and we're in that and it seems so real. And that's how, like, that's our worldview.
That's the filter. We're seeing everything.
It seems so compelling and real. It can be really hard when the soft, quiet, gentle.
Invisible, but enormous and infinite voice of creativity comes in and just 'cause creativity. Doesn't ever, that's how I tell the difference between the two. Creativity will never shove me to do anything.
Like, it'll never give me a, you should do this, you should do that. It'll never have any urgency. But, but when you're all whipped up in, in, in that other rational mind place, it's almost impossible to hear. And even if you do hear it, that other voice has such amazing arguments for why you shouldn't trust it.
So how have you learned how to trust the voice of your own intuition and creativity?
Jaime Hamilton: interesting?
Track 1: that it's ongoing?
Right.
Jaime Hamilton: Well, what's interesting is, as you were saying that, I was thinking about when you're in that mode, it's hard to even breathe. I'm someone with chronic back pain. I have a disc that slips out every once in a while and it happens when I'm stressed. the one thing that I've learned through that, aside from, you know, diet and exercise Yeah.
Is that, is that you have to breathe, you have to breathe through your pain, you have to breathe through your discomfort, you have to bring oxygen into your body to get rid of all that other crap. I can tell when I'm getting stressed at work or in mom mode or the creativity's just not coming.
It's like I can feel it here in my chest and in my shoulders. And so the, the first thing I do is I always take a deep breath. And Lily, my daughter, she's so funny. She goes, it's okay, mommy. Just take a deep breath like this . And she does this deep breathing and it's almost like. unlocking, you know, a key unlocking something. And then once we get that oxygen back in our body and our hearts and our brains, then the path just kind of makes itself known. the beauty of being an artist too is that we don't have to share every single piece of art that we make. Like we can make bad art, , make bad art all the time that I don't share. sometimes just getting it out, whether it's a bad song or, you know, a terrible poem. I love writing terrible poetry. It's
Track 1: so fun. I, I do
Jaime Hamilton: I wrote one about onions actually.
Track 1: maybe you need to read it to us if you feel like you can.
Jaime Hamilton: I can later.
Yeah, it's. I
Kate Shepherd: You don't to.
Jaime Hamilton: I'm actually really
proud of it. breathing and drinking water are two very underrated
things that when we're in stress mode, when we're in like block mode, when we're in just, I can't do anything right mode. Um, like that's when our bodies are telling us, Hey, you need to
stop. You need to pause. You need to breathe, drink some water and go chill the hell out.
Kate Shepherd: How do you tell the difference between ego creating or the rational mind creating versus creativity? What's the, what's the, is it and how, like, how does it feel in your body? Creativity? Is it like, does it come to you in visions? Does it move your arms? Does it, how does it feel? What does the felt experience of creativity to you?
Jaime Hamilton: For me, the world is loud. And then when I put that paintbrush on the paper, it's quiet.
Kate Shepherd: Hmm.
Jaime Hamilton: And, um, you know, I'll put on a, a movie for my daughter and I'll sit in the same room and, you know, she gets so frustrated. Mommy, you're not watching the movie. Yes, I am, but I'm painting. for me that true creativity is, the actual act of, of painting or doing or creating There's another piece of it too, actually, Neil Gaman, who's one of my favorite writers, he says that ideas come from Confluence, like the connection of, of two seemingly unrelated things. so sometimes we'll be watching Kung Fu Panda or you know, the Disney movies, and I'll hear something that I've heard 10,000 times before. But because I'm in a different mode, it hits at a different level and it's incredible. When I'm in that mode of creation, I'm much more open and, influenced, not influenced influential
Kate Shepherd: Influenceable,
Jaime Hamilton: There we go. Thank you.
Kate Shepherd: is that word? Is that a word?
Jaime Hamilton: It's now, now, it's, now.
Kate Shepherd: I've, I've heard so many different ways of describe that creativity seems to move so differently in each of us, and
I'm always curious how people find their way into it. And it sounds like for you it's a lot about just creating some, a little bit of space with breath, with a little pause in the moment, some water
and
just almost switching off that other part and, and
not too much about it.
Jaime Hamilton: Which is so hard. , especially if we work a regular nine to five or, you know, whatever. Um, but it's really, really important, somebody asked me why I get up so early 'cause I get up at four or five in the morning to create, to write, to paint, to do
whatever. it was the only time growing up where it was quiet in
my house, you know, sometimes it's the only time in my house where it's quiet still. And I think that you nailed it. I didn't even know. But it's about creating that space,
Kate Shepherd: Mm-Hmm.
Jaime Hamilton: um, physical, emotional, in your chest, in your heart, wherever.
Kate Shepherd: Do you do that you like every day you've done that since you were a kid, you've gotten up really early in the morning and made stuff
Jaime Hamilton: not always. I didn't have space when I was a kid. Like my bedroom had three walls. It didn't have a fourth wall.
I physically did not have my own space
until I was maybe 13. when I taught for a year overseas in China and I journaled every day. I wrote every day I had a Tumblr, when I started teaching is really when I started to wake up early and, and do these things in the morning.
'cause my brain is on fire at 5:00 AM Like I get the good ideas at 5:00 AM and at 9:00 PM my brain is asleep.
Kate Shepherd: so much of it is about unlocking just how, how this system of yours works, you know? And, then, I don't wanna say hacking it, but just tapping into that and just being like, okay, like this likes to, like, sometimes I'll, I'll wake up at three o'clock in the morning for whatever reason,
and, and I'm awake and I'm annoyed that I'm awake.
And I used to fight it and try everything to go back to sleep. And now I just say to myself, oh, it's awake,
it's Like, let's just, and going with that rather than kind of fighting the creative flow. Yeah. I.
seriously. For sure. And at six 30 I always get this 'cause our, our living quarters are upstairs and our bedrooms are downstairs at six 30. My daughter will yell from the bedroom, I need you the best part of my morning. And it's like, okay, creativity's done. Mom mode is on.
switch has flipped. I used to try to get up early 'cause I also find that there are fa, not always, but there are seasons when that time of day is really, really, it's usually in the winter. But that time day is usually really good for me and I cannot, for the life of me, get my children up by seven 30 for school.
But if I sneak out at five o'clock to go and meditate and write. They are awake within minutes, mama. And I hear a quiet little soft, warm
voice, mama, like,
you know, and they're a little scared, like, why am I alone in, they sleep in my bed with me, mama, where did you go? And it's like, what? How did you, how do you, how did you know I was going to, it's almost like there's a departure.
I don't know. It's a weird thing. Like I haven't just left to go, they don't wake up when I go to the bathroom.
Jaime Hamilton: No,
they know when you're not there. Like we're, you know, and we grew these babies inside of
us, so there's something that will always connect us to them
Track 1: Yeah.
But it's like, I've left, like I, it's like I have left mama mode
and I'm in, I've gone into a different realm. I've passed through a portal. I'm upstairs. I'm not any further away than if I come up here to wash dishes or make lunches. They're not waking up.
But as soon as I pass through that, like there is an energetic realm I think you pass
Totally. Totally. Yeah.
It's like you've, you've severed the connection briefly and um, they can sense it.
Yeah,.
percent totally. Yeah. My daughter is very empathic too, her dad and I, the three of us are very emotional and, and her dad and I are not together, but we are very good friends. The three of us can tell when something's not right with the other parent
Jaime Hamilton: and it's so interesting the way we are connected to our children. He and I are raising her in a way to have the childhood that he and I both wish we'd had. she can sense when there's disconnect. She can sense when there's turmoil, when there's sadness, when there's whatever.
And she can also sense when there's this incredible joy too. , that's part of the reason why I love teaching too, is because these middle schoolers, they're, they're, they're like away from that connection in a way, but they still get it and they're still connected. they'll call you out on your, on your stuff.
Like nobody will.
Kate Shepherd: Which
is terrifying, but also kind of, isn't that what we're all aiming for? I mean, I that that's what I want. I wanna be able to just bust out and be the real me and say the things I really think, but, but grounded in a place of, you know, self love, like energy, like the energy of my real self, which.
Might be brutal sometimes, but is also always loving.
And I
like, I think that that's what kids show us sometimes is just how to be that, you know? So bravely honest.
they don't sugarcoat it. Ms. Hamilton, you look tired today. Why didn't you put on your makeup? Um, thank you Ms. Hamilton. You look terrible. Are you okay? Thank you for that. Unfair. But then it's like, okay, I thought I actually looked good today. I thought was hiding all of this stuff that I've been going through, but that girl right there just checked me.
Jaime Hamilton: and same thing, they're like little mirrors. the difficulty comes in teaching them how to to keep that, you know, keep that honesty, keep that truth, but then also be nice.
Kate Shepherd: Well, in a weird way, those two, well, no, those two things can't go together. And in a weird way, we're most at ease around the people who are able to do that the best. Whether they're insane
and shouldn't
be leading countries,
Right.
or whether they're, you know, deeply wise the people who just say what they really think and feel.
There's a charisma to them. There's a magnetic,
Jaime Hamilton: totally.
Kate Shepherd: uh, draw to them and. I think, I feel like I've just a little bit, I'm, I'm not brave enough to really be the real me, but what would, what would happen if I was, what would happen if I, you could, just walk around my life knowing I'm a good per, like, I know I'm a good person,
Yeah.
right?
So good person.
I, and I know I am, but, but I also still really curate, like, the version of me that you get is very nice. I'm very, I also came from a lot of trauma in my childhood and we were, I'm gonna use the word T in quotes 'cause it wasn't as gentle as being taught, but we were taught very good manners. I was terrified most of my life about not being, I had to be nice. I had to be a good girl. I had to be nice. I had to, my survival depended on it really. And so, you know, the yearning for me is like, man, I would love to just be like. Brutally honest about what I think about about everybody and let the chips fall where they may,
but I'm still too scared to truly do it. I
mean, I do it a lot, but,
Jaime Hamilton: that is so fascinating because your survival technique was, perf perfection. Maybe mine was invisibility. Like
I just wanted to be invisible because if you saw me. You might hit me, or if you saw me, you might tear me down. And so I spent my childhood trying to be invisible,
but then I realized around middle school, you can't really be invisible. So it's better to put on this version of yourself that is just a freak, like just weird as hell so that people can't see inside. So I used to wear these fire engine red doc marten boots in middle school. I'd steal my dad's boxer shorts and wear them and wear neon green tights underneath.
And these shirts that were too tight. And just like I curated myself in a way where if you took one look at me, you might make an assumption and then write me off because the alternative of you looking and seeing me. Was so terrifying. That's the thing that I'm, I'm constantly learning in my relationships with my adult friends and with my boyfriend, is that he sees through all that shit and it, he, like, he sees right down to my core.
And, um, and now as an adult, I don't wanna be invisible anymore. I, I, I'm done being invisible. I'm done being this version, this thing that you think I am. My dad could never live this, but he always used to say, say what you mean and mean what you say .
it's like really ironic because he just can't.
Kate Shepherd: Well, and to think about that, you know, those people in our lives as other versions of us there, he, he also was aspirational and probably if he had anybody in his. Sphere anywhere that could have had a, this kind of conversation with him and felt brave enough, to be honest, would've been saying a lot of probably the same things.
Like, I didn't, my, my parents couldn't and I didn't, and there was violence and there was this, and there was, and yeah. I mean, I think it's just like we passed the torch and And we all, and, and then, and then recognizing, oh my gosh. Like there's, that's how you survived. You became invisible. And I became, and, and so we've got all these like avatars interacting with each other and ever is the real, the real deal, you know?
But it's all there always peering out at each other. And we're like, it's like, hi, I, I'm here take the notes off. Yeah. Well and that's why I think it's so important to have those, people in your life who do act like mirrors or who do see through all that stuff, you know? 'cause they can remind us when, when we forget you are a badass, you're great, you're lovable, you're amazing. you don't have to be perfect.
Well, it brings me to, and I wonder if you've already inadvertently answered it, at the end of every episode, I ask , the billboard question. Um, which is, you had a billboard that it was a magical billboard and it could reach all of these people who long to express this true version of themselves with all the gifts that come with it, , which is to me another way of saying creativity.
But for all the reasons that we've talked about, all the traumas and all the. Difficult childhoods and all the mean mentors and all the critics inner and outer that they've had to navigate in their lives. They just don't believe that they have it in them. They just don't believe that they have the right to express it or that it really even exists in them anyway.
Or that there's any point or any of that. But you are gonna put this something on this magical billboard and, and the words that you said could get into this little crack and could, help somebody through that help somebody realize like, oh wait, there's another way of seeing this.
What would you, what would you put on it?
I came up one with one in the shower the other day, and then I forgot it .
I have this tattooed on me, and it came out of some intense journaling, it says, there's this beautiful lotus flower on my shoulder, and they only bloom in the mud, right? And so it says, beautiful things come from messy beginnings.
Jaime Hamilton: I feel like that would be one side of the billboard. And then the other side would be just start, we're not perfect. We're not supposed to be. and wherever you are right now is where you're supposed to be.
Kate Shepherd: That's beautiful. Thank you.
yeah.
I'm gonna pick, so normally what I do is I pick a word for the episode before the show, but today I was, and I trust when this happens. I just had this strong feeling that I was supposed to do it in the episode with you here.
So I'm gonna draw a word for us out of my bowl. Wisdom. So it's a, it's a wizard looking angel. She's wearing like navy blue robes and she has purple wings and she's carrying a lantern that there's light coming all outta this lantern. And she's standing at the top of these snow covered peaks and she's just kind of holding, holding the lantern up.
And the word wisdom is beside it.
I love that.
That's
Trust. Trust in your gut, trust in your intuition, trust in your inner wizard. That's Yeah
I love I'm gonna send you a picture of this.
tell us where we can find you and your and how we can support you and learn more about you and hear more from I am mostly, mostly on Instagram. Hey mama paints. That's me.
Um, that's one M-H-E-Y-M-A-M-A. Yeah. Hey, mama Paints.
paints. Yeah. I used to call my daughter, Hey mama. 'cause I wanted her to say it back. And so when I decided to start this as a little side hustle business, it was just natural. So, hey mama paints, and then my website is hey mama paints.com.
Jaime Hamilton: I do a newsletter every two weeks or so. And, that's, where you can find me. take a look at all my dirty cards that I paint,
Kate Shepherd: I love it. I'm gonna put all that in the show notes. Thank much. I like, I wanna hang out with you more.
I feel like I am meant to go back to Canada, so it'll, it's gonna happen.
Kate Shepherd: We've all been through so much in our lives.
We've survived, impossible situations and found ourselves at times, probably more than once with broken hearts.
Some of us came from really difficult childhoods. And some of us didn't but found ourselves in difficulties later on in life. Either way, most of us have so much that we are working to heal from. It can be hard to know what voices to listen to or where to even start in our own healing journeys.
so if you take one thing from this episode today, I hope it's to take to heart. Jamie's beautiful reminder that when we allow ourselves to practice creativity, for its own sake and just for ourselves.
We open up a conversation with the deepest part of ourselves.
And we just might find that in there. Liv's the wisest, most loving friend you've ever had. Who's been there with you all along.
In a world filled with constant noise and distractions, finding moments of peace and clarity can feel like a luxury. Amidst the hustle and bustle of daily life, it's easy to lose touch with our inner selves and the creative genius that resides within each of us. However, in the midst of this chaos, there exists a powerful tool that can help us reconnect with our inner wisdom and unleash our creative potential: guided meditation.
At the heart of this transformative practice lies the art of deep listening – a skill often overlooked in today's fast-paced society. Yet, it is through deep listening that we can cultivate a profound sense of presence and awareness, enabling us to tap into our creative genius with greater clarity and insight.
The "Creative Genius Guided Meditation Series has just released a new meditation: Deep Listening with Your Whole Being," offered by Kate Shepherd. It serves as a gateway to this inner sanctuary of wisdom and creativity. This guided meditation series is designed to help individuals embark on a journey of self-discovery and creative exploration, inviting them to immerse themselves in the art of deep listening.
So, why is this guided meditation series particularly useful in our modern lives?
Cultivating Presence: In a world filled with distractions, cultivating presence is essential for nurturing our creativity. Through guided meditation, we learn to quiet the mind and tune into the present moment, allowing us to access a state of flow where creative ideas effortlessly emerge.
Accessing Inner Wisdom: Deep within each of us lies a wellspring of wisdom and creativity waiting to be tapped into. By practicing deep listening, we can access this inner reservoir of insight, enabling us to uncover innovative solutions to challenges and bring forth new ideas.
Enhancing Intuition: Intuition is a powerful tool for creative expression, yet it often gets overshadowed by rational thinking. Guided meditation helps us sharpen our intuitive faculties, allowing us to trust our instincts and unleash our full creative potential.
Stress Reduction and Relaxation: The practice of deep listening through guided meditation promotes relaxation and reduces stress levels. As we let go of tension and anxiety, our minds become more receptive to inspiration and creativity.
Fostering Self-Expression: Deep listening encourages us to connect with our authentic selves and express our unique voice. Through this practice, we gain the confidence to share our creativity with the world, knowing that our ideas are worthy of being heard.
Ultimately, the "Creative Genius Guided Meditation Series" offers a pathway to rediscovering the beauty and richness of our inner world. By embracing the art of deep listening, we can unlock the door to our creative genius and embark on a journey of self-discovery and transformation.
In a society that often values external achievements over inner fulfillment, guided meditation serves as a powerful reminder of the importance of nurturing our inner selves. Through the practice of deep listening, we can cultivate a deeper connection with ourselves and the world around us, leading to a more inspired and creative way of being.
So, if you're ready to embark on a journey of self-exploration and creative discovery, why not give guided meditation a try? With the "Creative Genius Guided Meditation Series," you'll have the opportunity to unlock your full creative potential and awaken to the magic that lies within you.
SIGN UP to my newsletter and receive this Guided Mediation as a FREE gift from me!
]]>EPISODE SUMMARY
This is an encore presentation of one of our most listened to episodes in the series so far. This episode revisits Wendy McWilliams' inspiring journey, originally featured in Season One. Wendy, who started seeking a simple hobby at the age of 49, eventually discovered her life's passion in painting. Despite going through 22 different jobs, including roles at Calvin Klein and Revlon in Europe, Wendy found fulfillment and success as an artist with her work sought after for private collections worldwide. The central message of the episode can be summed up with this: "You can't believe everything you think," emphasizing the importance of overcoming limiting beliefs.
SHOW NOTES
When Wendy McWilliams was 49 years old, she felt like she needed a hobby. What started as a search for a simple past-time hobby, quickly evolved into her life’s passion - a thriving art career her work sought after for private collections around the globe. After working through 22 different jobs including for Calvin Klein & Revlon in Europe, she finally landed on what she was meant to do in life - painting.
It’s hard to not be skeptical about ourselves and our abilities. Art allows us to channel a source of energy, of inspiration, and opens us to become a vehicle for creativity to create beauty through our hands. We are meant to create, to allow creativity to flow through us. Our job is to remain open and to make sure we do not believe everything we think - especially when it comes to limiting beliefs.
“You hate your own creations because you think they look too much like you made them. You think if you keep trying you can make your work look like some other, better person made it. But there is no level of skill where you transcend yourself. The thing you hate about your art, is the most valuable thing about it” (paraphrased from Elicia Donze)
In this encore presentation, the episode revisits Wendy McWilliams' inspiring journey, originally featured in Season One. Wendy, who started seeking a simple hobby at the age of 49, eventually discovered her life's passion in painting. Despite going through 22 different jobs, including roles at Calvin Klein and Revlon in Europe, Wendy found fulfillment and success as an artist with her work sought after for private collections worldwide. The central message of the episode is encapsulated in the phrase "You can't believe everything you think," emphasizing the importance of overcoming limiting beliefs.
Kate Shepherd: Hello there. It's Kate shepherd. Your host of the creative genius podcast.
Today, I find myself tucked up inside while the world around me has all, but come to a standstill. Because where I live in Vancouver, doesn't often get snow. And when we do everything, just sort of shuts down.
overnight it's I think it was about a foot of snow has fallen and. It's just about lunchtime. And I feel like we've had about that much more since this morning. So it really is one of those quiet days.
The schools have shut down. Most people aren't going into work. Our roads haven't been cleared.
We really heard not set up for this.
There's a kind of joy in that for me. I was thinking about why we love snow day so much. Of course, everybody loves an unexpected day off.
But there's something magical about getting to stay inside all day.
If you have kids in school, you get to stay home with them. If you don't, you probably get to work from home or even take the day off.
And time seems to change shape and really slow down.
There is an opportunity inside days like that. For us to look around and maybe allow ourselves. To deepen. Our willingness to be in the surrendered state. To enjoy the day to enjoy the different direction you're being taken the theme of season three, this season of creative genius podcast. Has been about learning to see. And our ability to learn, to see can be greatly enhanced by our ability to surrender. surrender to the way we thought things should look. Surrender what we think is supposed to happen next to what we think we're supposed to be doing and noticing, and seeing and feeling. And even thinking.
When we do surrender to the, what is of any given moment.
Something magical becomes available to us.
We're able to start to look around for what we might enjoy, what might make this moment. Wonderful. So it wasn't the way I thought it was going to be.
But what, what else is here?
The episode you're about to hear today. Is a wonderful example of somebody who.
Found herself in a situation
that she didn't necessarily want to be in and looked for the fun and what it led to. And I'll tell you a little bit more about that. In a moment.
I wanted to let you know about an exciting opportunity that's happening over at creative genius studios. We are looking for a small group of volunteers to help us build the show and bring it to the next level. So, if you love the show, if you're a super fan and you love what we're doing and you would love to be a part of bringing this show to even more ears and more hearts. And you have experience to share, could be podcast editing or marketing. Or email marketing, it could be anything. If you feel like you have skills that might help develop the show.
And You've been on the lookout for an opportunity to volunteer for something that really feels close to your heart.
Please send me an email. or a direct message on Instagram at Kate Shepherd creative. Or you can go to Kate Shepherd, creative.com and find my contact information there and get in touch that way.
. I'm excited about growing the team. For creative genius and where we're going to take the show and all this work that we're doing.
Kate Shepherd: And I would love to hear from you today's show is an Encore presentation of one of our most cherished bookmarked loved, shared. I listened to two episodes. We remastered it for your audio pleasure. And I'm so excited to bring it to you today.
It's Wendy McWilliams who joined us back in season one. And there were just so many important messages in, in so much of what Wendy shared with us. That I felt it was the right time to bring it back .
Kate Shepherd: Her journey is a powerful reminder of the importance of remaining open and having fun. And being curious and lighthearted, but really letting enjoyment guide the way. And I think what happened for her when she really allowed herself to let her senses guide her. And let the question.
Well, what would be fun guide her? The absolute miracle that happened next for her. If you hear something in this episode today that reminds you of someone.
Send them a link to the show and let them know.
And if you're looking to deepen your own intuition and your own ability to follow the yeses and the nos in your life. I would love to remind you about my activating intuition and creativity workshop. I do it once a month in the lead up to the full moon, it's a live virtual event. It's gorgeous.
People really enjoy doing it. It's included as part of the colorful community, creative genius Patrion.
You can also sign up for the workshop as a one-off on Kate Sheppard, creative.com.
A joy to bring you this conversation again. May it be exactly what you need to hear in this moment of your life. Enjoy this Encore presentation of my conversation with Wendy McWilliams.
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This episode is a transformative journey through the intersections of art, business, spirituality, and surrendering to the creative process. Gain valuable insights into overcoming obstacles, embracing uncertainty, and igniting your artistic passion. Tune in to unlock your creative potential!
Kate Shepherd: Hello there. Kate shepherd. And you're listening to the creative genius podcast.
I'm thrilled to have you here and genuinely honored to introduce you to today's guest. Bibby Gignilliat
Bibby is a remarkable artist and human whose story is a Testament to overcoming self-doubt. Navigating life's twist. And discovering the intricate connections between art business and spirituality. We start by delving into Bibby's journey, a path marked by early struggles with doubt. Pivotal moments shaping her artistic direction and the courageous leap.
She took back to her true passion art. Throughout our conversation, Bibby shares and valuable information. She shares the strategies that she uses . For selling art with authenticity. Cultivating a thriving community and harnessing the power of digital platforms to amplify her own artistic endeavors. And amidst these insights lies a profound truth. That becomes more obvious as the episode goes on. And it has to do with Bibby's perspective on embracing uncertainty. About relinquishing control and immersing ourselves in each moment to uncover inspiration. In life's subtle whispers. The gems that maybe shares with us are.
Nothing short of a guiding light for anyone charting their own creative course.
One of my favorite moments in the episode is when we get a glimpse into Bibby's nightly ritual with her artwork. It's a simple ritual, but one that I'll closer inspection. Is Actually a beautiful pathway for all of us to experiment with relinquishing control and dipping our toe into the water of uncertainty. If you find that these conversations are serving you and you appreciate the depth of them and listening to this. Show every other week. I invite you to consider joining the Patrion community.
We really rely on the support of our own community, which is you. , and I'm proud to offer the content that I offer inside the Patrion memberships. Especially at the colorful community tier. I have a monthly workshop called activating intuition and creativity. That is truly transformative. And it resonates deeply with our patrons people keep coming back to do it month after month. So I invite you to explore that and join us.
Your support and thoughts mean the world to me. If you hear something in today's episode or a past episode that really deeply resonated with you, will you. Consider leaving a review. Your words in that way, help nurture this creative community and space that we're creating and that we're cultivating and help other people decide whether or not they want to listen to the show,
And in the spirit of fostering creative connections. I want to ask you , to have your ear out today. Four. Something that really catches the attention of your heart. and then share that with a friend, share that moment.
Kate Shepherd: You can take the timestamp if you want or not. You can just tell them that this episode there was something in it that really got your heart's attention and you wanted to share it.
I really draw strength from you. My creative community. And sharing this podcast might ignite something profound in someone else and have a deep impact on their own journey. There's so much in this conversation that I think you'll benefit from hearing. I can't wait for you to hear it. Let's get right into it.
ATR2100x-USB Microphone-5: Hello Bibby. Thank you for joining us today.
Bibby gignilliat: Hi.
Thank you.
Track 1: if you were walking down the street with somebody that you just met, that you thought, Ooh, I might be friends with this person.
I just have a feeling, how would you describe who you are and the work that you do in the world?
Bibby gignilliat: That's a great question. Who I am? Well, I can tell you who I am in the work world, but then I'll tell you who I am as a person. So I'm a mixed media artist with a studio in the ICB building in Sausalito. We're an old ship building, building with 180 working artists, and I am a full-time artist. So I actually make a living as an artist. Believe there's no such thing as a starving artist. I'm a, uh, an ambassador for artists actually. and as a person, I really think it's important to serve and there's all sorts of ways to serve. and I serve by teaching and I help people kind of cut loose and connect to that creative part of themselves. I also, I believe, set an example for people to follow their heart and passion. I did the whole corporate thing, which we can get into, and then came to art later in life. lastly, I believe that, I am bringing joy to the world and light to the world at a time when it's really needed the most. it's really important that we shine our light as opposed to dimm it down when everything's going on I bring a lot of joy through my work, through my workshops, through interacting with other artists here, and in meeting other people.
Kate Shepherd: So, uh, you said you, you came to art late in life, but actually it's almost like you came back to art late
Bibby gignilliat: Yes. That's a better
Kate Shepherd: did art when you were, when you were and you had, uh, you even won an award when you were quite young for early pieces of art. What happened?
How did you, how
did you leave art?
Bibby gignilliat: when I was age 10, I was painting every Saturday at this place in Oak Park, Illinois, and that's when I, um, got an award and loved, I just loved painting. I was very free. And then I had a critical teacher and became a perfectionist, and I understand that psychologically kids become perfectionists usually around age 12. And that's when I became a perfectionist. And that's about the same time I had this critical teacher. And so I stopped painting. But the whole time I was doing everything else I did, which was computer programming, I worked at at Adventure Travel Company as a bicycle tour leader, then went To William Sonoma and was in database marketing and then went to culinary school and then, ran a a hands-on cooking party business in the city, which brought people together through group cooking. The whole time I was doing all that in the back of my head, I always was thinking about art and maybe having a gallery show and Julia Cameron says in her book, the Artist's Way, if you really wanna know what you should do in life, look at what you loved as a child. Well, one day I was sitting in, my office and I just felt like a complete fraud because I
was sort of done with running a company for 20 years.
It was super stressful, and I was ready to have my next chapter and I thought, I've gotta take a courageous action step. so I signed up for a painting class with Nick Wilton, who, I took the class. I was the worst one in the class. And could you not? I can show you my work and you would agree. I've shown people and they're like, yeah, you were the worst one, But what I did have was, um, a lot of gumption in discipline. And so I got a space in this building. It was a hundred square feet. I felt like a complete imposter. and so I didn't even wanna leave the studio, but I kept working on it. And I found, like six months later, a collage teacher named Michael Cut Lip who changed my life because I realized part of the reason I wasn't understanding Nick's principles was that I was a collage artist and I needed to create texture. 'cause texture. was really important. Before I created my design. And so I just had a different way of doing it and I have since gone back to Nick's classes and now I get it because I'm doing it from my perspective. Um, but anyway, that's a really long answer to your question. But here I am now with the 1500 square foot studio in the ICB building and I've been making art for nine years.
Kate Shepherd (2): Well, congratulations. That makes me so happy.
Bibby gignilliat: Thank you.
Track 1: When you.
look back and you think about that teacher, was it something that they just said to you in a, in an offhanded comment, or was it sort of repeated message that you got from this person?
Bibby gignilliat: I think she was, I don't think she liked me 'cause I think I was sort of out of the box and I think she
wanted to control me and I was too out of the box for her.
Kate Shepherd: mm-Hmm.
Bibby gignilliat: um. Like a lot of schools, they try to, you know, take kids that have learning disabilities like I did and you know, was out of the box and try to put 'em in a mold and you don't fit in a mold.
And I am an Aquarius and so very rebellious I like to draw outside the lines. And so, I think I just pushed all her buttons. Maybe like the, the person that, that, uh, shut you down
Track 1: yeah. And when I think about her, I think she was, uh, it's, it's often that resentment is just jealousy. It's like they see your freedom and it isn't that they're bad people, it's that they never had anybody to set them free either. And so
it's like we do that to each other, right? Like, yeah. I always thought that was weird about medicine too.
Like doctors, well, you know, you have to work for 800 million hours a week to, because that's how they did it before us. Like, well, no, we can stop the bad cycle at any time. Yeah.
So you had this. Fairly successful, uh, career in business for two decades. I'm assuming you were comfortable financially and
Bibby gignilliat: Totally.
Track 1: so I'm always curious about that transition point for
people.
Was it, how did you do that? What, what was the scariest moment? Was there a terrifying moment? What was the, what was that whole part of the journey like?
Bibby gignilliat: I have a strong belief in LEAP and the net will appear
and sometimes it's like, where's the net?
But it does eventually appear I know myself well enough to know that I have to kind of set myself up, for success. And so to be comfortable taking that kind of a risk. So what I did was I was running my company when I took the Nick Wilton class and got the space in the building, but at the same time I was, I was training myself in art and basically giving myself like a master's in art. I also went to the Academy of Intuition Medicine and was studying energy work. And I was doing that at the same time because I thought, okay, if I, I leap to this art career, I need to have more than one potential source of income. I eventually sold my business, while I was doing art and I had finished the academy program and at that point I had a runway For two years of enough money to be able to hold me over. And at the same time, I knew I also had this energy medicine career that I could, I could practice energy medicine if I wanted to,
which is like sort of hands-on like healing. And so that allowed me to feel comfortable enough to go for it. and at the same time, I was also starting to sell a lot of arc. So it, that helped. and lastly, I would say I, the year after I sold my business, I was still in that runway period. I took another risk and I moved into this 1500 square foot studio space. And I remember running into Nick Wilton in the hallway and I said, Nick, I'm thinking about teaching, but I'm not ready. And he said, well, you just gotta start before you're ready. And I, I love that because, I wasn't ready and I started teaching. I did a practice class on some friends, so to refine it and everything, but my, my classes started paying my rent in this big studio, and that was a real relief too.
Track 1: me, what's coming up is, okay, well,
Kate Shepherd: so what happened towards the end of that, two years that you'd given yourself was that things were, were working, you were selling the art,
know, it was, it was working. What, so for the person listening to this, who's going, well, that's nice, but that's not what's happening for me.
What I saved up and I'm almost out of the, I'm, I'm almost at the end of the two years, but I cannot imagine going back to corporate America or wherever it is they have to go back to.
What do you tell them?
Bibby gignilliat: Well, I'll, I'll tell them something. They might not like hearing but it's true. And the truth is that. As an artist, you have to work at the business side. and I think a lot of artists wanna do the art side and don't wanna work on the business side. And it's understandable. It might not be in their skillset, I would say, exercise isn't really in my skillset. I hate it, in fact, but I just swam this morning. You know, I'm gonna be doing it every day 'cause I wanna be healthy. And it's the same for an artist. if you wanna have a successful
art practice, you have to work at it, and spend an hour or two a day on the business side.
And that might mean making an Instagram post or writing a newsletter. or it could mean, researching some interior designers to contact or whatever it is for you. you have to take the time to do that in order to build your business. And it was funny, we had an open studios about a year ago, and I went up to this one woman and she was complaining about how no one came to her open studios.
And I said, well, what did you do to promote it? And she said, nothing. And I really have a belief that you reap what you sow. So one of my biggest tips would be to do the business side.
Kate Shepherd: On the business side, , what do you think you did that moved the needle the most in terms of selling art?
Bibby gignilliat: That's a great question. I'd say two things. the first thing was we had someone that was a, at the time Facebook expert that came to talk to us and he was saying, this is so Obvious and profound that you know when you're posting on Facebook, they own it, right?
It's owned by meta, right.
And so when Facebook first came out, you could send a post out and let's say you had a thousand followers, all those thousand followers would get it. But as they were refine their model, it got to the point where now it's only about 7%. I don't know, it might have changed even lower, but it's about 7% that actually see what you're posting. Because they own it, they own the algorithm, they're gonna change it over and over and over again. But what you can own is your own mailing list, email and snail mail list mail.
And so he said, you know, you really ought to be , emailing to people on a regular basis. So I started emailing every two weeks, sending out a notice, and now I don't do it quite as much 'cause it was too much for me. I would show my art in situ. I was an earlier adopt adopter of insight two shots. and then I would promote classes and any other thing I wanted to tell my clients, you know, an open studios event or whatever. I would write, , things about what was going on for me in my studio and that kind of thing. so developing your own list is super important, number one. And number two, the other thing that I did that helped me a lot was, I started doing Instagram early on I was doing reels. And reels are really important and not as important as they used to be, but they're really important. And you get way more, viewers from a reel than you would on a post. And so I started. At first, I was just like doing all this stuff that felt like, Hey mom, look at me . And one of my friends down the hall said, you know, you're such a good teacher. Why don't you show some tips and tricks on techniques? And so I started showing little 32nd techniques, you know, and they went nuts.
Like people loved them. And the beauty of that is it was feeding into my online class, et cetera, et cetera. So,
Track 1: Well,
Kate Shepherd: it back to service.
Bibby gignilliat: it goes back
Track 1: at the top of the show. It's, it's all so much of it comes, yeah.
Bibby gignilliat: yeah.
yeah, And um, I remember one reel, and I don't get this kind of result anymore. Like I'm lucky to get, I don't know, one 10th of this, but at early on I did a real, where I was using a simple Windshield wiper squeegee. And I did a ink drawing, with Sumi Inc . And it got 675,000
views
Track 1: Oh my God.
Bibby gignilliat: and I've
never anything like that since. And so, and because 'cause of that I got like a thousand followers and then those followers, then we get more followers, et cetera, et cetera.
Track 1: yeah, I feel like it's really stuck. Like I feel like that for a new artist coming in now or for somebody coming in now, unless you're willing to do like really goofy, funny, I mean, I can't get it up for that. I So, I don't know, like for the person who's just sort of coming into it now, what, what, what do they do?
Like, how do you grow your, even your email list, you know, it
Bibby gignilliat: Yeah, that's a great question. Okay, couple things. First of all, Everyone creates paintings, right? So you could get a tripod, they're like 50 bucks on, Amazon, and you could just show a process video of how you paint and if there's any information you can share with people, just share it. And then you get this really nice reputation as being a, a generous, kind person. And if you can think of something goofy, do something goofy. Or
if, if it's just a matter of turning around like the real hot, hot thing right now as people where you have the back to the camera and you turn around with your piece
of art or whatever, that gets a lot. Um, so just do it regularly. You know, I post every day and I don't make a big deal about it. I use the copy function and copy and paste previous text. And so I just post every day. and again, come, let me just come back to one thing if you don't wanna do it. Either hire someone to do it if you can afford that or get an intern to do it, or you know, figure out a trade or something.
There's clever ways to get around the cost piece.
Track 1: there are people out there who are really trying to build their, you know, their list and their email file.
And it's just like you said, the algorithm. I think it can feel a little bit like, well, I missed that boat. You know, I wasn't, you know, I wasn't on Instagram in the, in the glory days, and now it's too late. And I don't believe that either. I don't actually believe that that's true. I mean, it might be true about these platforms, but I don't think that that is the only way you can sell your art or the only way you can build a business.
I think there are other ways, but we got, we have gotten stuck believing that social media is the only way.
Bibby gignilliat: I'm vigilant about, at my Open Studios any sale that I do make, I capture not only their email, but I also capture their snail mail because I print postcards and invite people twice a year with postcards to open studios. And I send out about 400 now. But again, it's nine years in. And, I had to build that list from
scratch. In every open studios I have a guest book out. And I, and this is a really important thing, I have a friend help me at Open Studios, because sometimes it's awkward for me, even though I seem like an extrovert sometimes I get a little awkward, especially around. The selling aspect. So I
have a really Gift of Gab friend that comes who's really good at sales, and she captures names. We do it on an iPad and we, it, it integrates directly into, in, uh, MailChimp. And so we get, usually every day of an open studios, we get 25 emails,
at
Track 1: That's terrific.
Bibby gignilliat: We have a guest book out for people that wanna write in there and they can write their address in there. That's another way. had my friend Andrew Faulkner on the show earlier, and he was always struggling with, increasing his mailing list and he kept saying, how can I get more names on my mailing list? I said, the best way to do it is to teach. And so he's getting tons of people now because. People wanna take your classes and so they wanna be on your email list to be notified of new classes.
So that's another great way. And again, I started painting in 2014 and I started teaching in 2018,
Track 1: I love, and I love that idea of, of do it before you're ready, because you're never gonna feel
you're, oh, you're never gonna feel ready. It never feels like, oh, now I've accumulated enough, you know, uh, wisdom and information and no, you're never, you're never ready. It really is just about sharing what you know now.
Bibby gignilliat: Yeah. And
finding like everybody's got their something as Nika Costa said in her song, everybody's
got their something.
what? Your something is
Track 1: Yeah. Well, that's half the battle, I think. Right?
Would you say that you have a calling
Bibby gignilliat: yes, I do have a calling and let me say two things. so I feel like I'm halfway to my calling. I'm at a crossroads right now and in a transitional place, I would say, with my art. I teach and a lot of my, um, I. Teaching not only revolves around technique, but spiritual principles. and one of the big things I focus on is sort of freedom and non-attachment, and helping people to let go of control. I often talk about Michael Singer in his book, the Untethered Soul Michael Singer says that there are often rocks in the river and they block the flow. And so people that are struggling with flow often are either holding on, they're gripping to an aspect of the painting, and that's usually the piece that has to go in order to take the painting to the next level. I'm a real proponent of teaching some of these spiritual principles in my classes, but I've been on this huge spiritual journey myself, and I am Wanting to bring more and more of that into the classroom, but I haven't quite figured it out yet. And one of the thoughts is I've been doing, um, a lot of breath work. and it's so powerful and it's like where you listen to music and you just breathe in and out continually for like an hour and so many things come up and so much gets released when you do it.
I did a breath work session last Friday and the instructor said, pick a word that you wanna bring in as an intention. And so a lot of people think of me as so free. The word that came up for me was freedom. And I didn't know why that came up or anything. But then in the breath work session, I had a vision of me wearing this back brace that I wore in high school for two years. And it was very restrictive. Like I could hardly move. And it was like the back brace energetically was still on my body.
Bibby gignilliat: And so in the breath work session, deep breathing deeply, I shook it off and it was super powerful. So the point of that, of me saying that is that I'm interested in maybe somehow doing something like this with art, um, or making it more of a, a spiritual psychological experience. And I'm not really sure what that's gonna be yet.
So it's still incubating and I'm sure it's already affecting my art. people are looking at my art and saying, oh, it's got sort of a. Complexity and intellectualism that wasn't there before. I don't know where it's going and I'm just getting, trying to get more and more uncomfortable with uncertainty, which is not an easy place for me to be. And that's, that's where I am.
Kate Shepherd: Before we started the show, I think I explained to you sort of my philosophy about creativity. I believe, and I'll just say it again here, for anyone who hasn't, who's just tuning in for the first time, I believe that creativity is the intelligence that's animating the entire universe.
It's, you know, the same thing that's telling you how to, where to put that piece of texture and, and move it if it doesn't feel quite right. Or, uh, gives you a crazy idea for how to fix your computer monitor in a dream in the middle of the night.
Bibby gignilliat: Mm-Hmm.
Track 1: And it's, I think it's even the thing that tells a tulip when to open.
You know, I, it's, and it's doing all these things at the same time and it moves through us. Like you said, this is what I believe that it moves through us. We're channels for this thing, and we, and we need creativity, and we need the rational mind both together. They need to work together to create what it needs to create.
And we're glitching because we've shoved down this, the creative, the creativity voice, right? We are really good at rational mind. We're really good at letting science and logic and that run the show things I can prove. But this sort of more ethereal, untouchable energy, the spirit of it is, is uh, is something that we've denied ourselves.
You seem like somebody who has a pretty deep connection with that facet of your being. That energy, that intelligence, how does it communicate with you and how do you communicate back with it? Is it a two-way thing? Are you just receiving? Are you, is it a conversation? Does it give you visions? Do you hear a voice?
How does it feel? Like, what is it? What is it for you?
Bibby gignilliat: I have like three things to say, so this is a perfect time. You, you let, you teed me up to read this amazing quote by Brene Brown that says there's no such thing as creative people and non-creative people. There's just people who use their creativity and people who don't, and not using it doesn't go without penalty. As it turns out, unused creativity is not benign, it's dangerous. So that's the first thing I'll say about like, the importance of creativity. and I, I believe if everyone were creative and, and, and, well, I do believe everyone's creative and you know, you might be a gardener or you might be a singer or you might be, you know, a writer. But it's just so important for us to express that. I think if everyone were expressing their creativity, we probably wouldn't have, what, what's going on in the world right now?
Track 1: A hundred percent
Bibby gignilliat: The second thing is when I went to the Academy of Intuition Medicine, one of the things we talked a lot about was there's the frontal lobe of the brain, which is the analyzer, and we need it, and then there's the center lobe. Which the center part of the brain, which is more the intuitive place. And I believe that the more you can be in the intuitive center, it allows you to have that stream of flow. And, and, and then it's important for it to be like a, a dance between the intuition and the analyzer. You don't wanna throw the analyzer out with the bath water, but you just don't want it driving the car. I find when my analyzer's driving the car, the work looks very restricted and is very controlled. And, some of the flow has been blocked. the more I'm in my intuitive place, the better and I can feel when I'm in it because it's that state of flow where you, get lost in time and you have access to a lot of ideas and things will just come to you Then the last thing is one of my spiritual principles that I've worked really hard on, and it's still an everyday thing, is sort of surrendering and offering the whole thing to something higher than you. And then offering doesn't really mean that you're, passive, but it just means you're looking for the breadcrumbs or the signs or the spaa of things of the way you're supposed to go.
And it like a really stupid little example is I might be stuck in my studio and I'm like kind of in my analyzer struggling and all that, and then all of a sudden I'll look on the floor and there'll be a scrap. That's the scrap. You know, like, where did that come from? But it's on the floor somehow it got there and that's the exact scrap that helps me to move forward. Does that make sense?
Track 1: Oh, totally makes sense. I love it. Yeah, because you get out of the part that's trying so hard to figure it out and you just actually, and it actually, you've teed me up now to my next question perfectly, which is this. So this whole season of Creative Genius is about learning to see, you know, I think there's, there's, we're taught how to see and then there's a process we get to go through by choice.
I think where you can unlearn so much of how you were taught to see and then actually see things. For what they really are. See reality for, for what it really is. See the, see the, you know, and, and, and art is a wonderful way that we can do that. You know, if I'm trying to learn how to paint a portrait, if I'm trying to do it from how I think a portrait should be painted, the end result is gonna be very different than if I actually stop and look at it and say, oh, her skin is green actually not beige or brown or whatever color my brain wanted me to.
Because the brain will show you what it wants to, what it wants you to see. And, and the rational mind and the brain or the mind, whatever we wanna call it, has a certain sort of set of parameters. It has these ideas of, if I do this, then I'll be safe. So it shows you things that will keep you safe. Right.
I so I guess my question is.
What do you think? What have you seen? What do you think is the most common thing? Our rational minds want to prevent us from seeing. What is it that that part of us doesn't want us to know or discover?
Why does it keep us from that freedom?
Bibby gignilliat: I have to think about this one for a minute.
Kate Shepherd: It's a big question.
Bibby gignilliat: I think I'm just relating it to my classes. I think most people are just afraid to be out of control.
Kate Shepherd: Mm-Hmm. uncertainty.
Bibby gignilliat: I think you know nobody, I. Really likes to be in uncertainty. I don't know anybody that does And I think one of the most important things one can learn in life is to get comfortable with uncertainty. 'cause we don't have any certainty. Like everyone's always trying to be in control, especially me. And there's no control that we really have. I mean some to some degree, yes. Like you can control, like this morning I could control that I had three eggs for breakfast and that kind of thing.
But in the bigger picture, and I think in the creative process, there's a lot of letting go of control and that's where the more interesting work is, I believe.
Track 1: How have you navigated that? How have you befriended uncertainty or gotten more comfortable? With being out of control in uncertain situations.
Bibby gignilliat: ,
I Went to the Anderson Ranch Learning Center this summer to learn how to draw. 'cause I wanted to have more control over my drawing. Like I felt like I didn't know how to draw. So I went and the, I didn't know what I was signing up for really. I could have done more research, but I didn't. and it was a very controlled class where we were
drawing on the grid and it was super uncomfortable for me. And I tried and tried and tried and I came home and I had this huge realization, like I am an abstract drawer. I like the drawing to look out of control or less controlled. And so it was sort of embracing the of letting go of control. I have a lot of uncertainty in my life right now. My dad has dementia and, he's 91 and my mom's 91 and they're gonna pass. And so I, I angst about that uncertainty . And I, you know, have uncertainty 'cause I'm in this crossroads with my work I know I'm gonna bring something more forward and I haven't figured it out yet. So there's levels of uncertainty. And the way that I've dealt with it is I just keep offering it over to something higher than myself. And I keep saying to the divine, like, I want what you want for me. Because we can talk all day long about manifestation, but what you might wanna manifest might be not as big as what, something higher than you wants to bring you. And I just, you know, I know my dad will pass. That's a for sure thing.
and so it's more about just being present. And there's this little book I just got recently. It's called
in In this Moment. it's just. Teaches you to notice the moments and looking, look for the, you know, the signs that might be coming your way.
I saw yesterday a caterpillar, a big furry caterpillar, and I was like, oh, wow, that's so interesting because I feel like I'm the caterpillar that hasn't yet become the butterfly.
Track 1: When we are out of control, uh, or when . Maybe not when we're out of control, but when we're, when there's a lot of uncertainty in our lives. Almost in, you're describing a, a moment, a chapter in your life right now where almost everywhere you look, it's uncertain or you don't know where it's gonna go, and yet there's still something in you that is present enough to notice the caterpillar.
And I think a lot of the times, what goes with uncertainty is that part of our, our being our mind kind of rolls us up and we're in a panic mode of sorts. And we're so worried about resolving the uncertainty 'cause it's very uncomfortable, very uncomfortable to be in uncertainty. And so we're rushing, we're using all of our resources to try to, and we spin out and we don't even notice the caterpillar.
And you, so you mentioned the caterpillar, but you also mentioned the scrap, the perfect scrap on the floor. Like there's something in you that you've cultivated that allows you to be present even in the midst of uncertainty and, and. Even more than uncertainty there, what's the word of beyond uncertainty?
It's like, uh, like real discomfort or really difficult time. How did you do that? How did you, why do you have that in you? How did you get that?
Bibby gignilliat: Well, it's been really hard, I have to say. I've been in this really difficult spiritual chapter and it, it's all been wonderful. It's like getting a PhD in spirituality. it's going to unfold into my art that I know somehow 'cause that's even my higher calling to serve. all I can do. No, and this gets me to another point of my spiritual belief system, which is we come into this lifetime with a course curriculum, I believe, that we've signed onto before we even got here. And I know that all this is part of what I'm supposed to be learning. so you kind of surrender to the learning and keep focusing, and I'm, I'm not perfect at this, but keep focusing on what you do have versus what you don't. So I can get into like, oh my God, my dad might die. But then yesterday I had this wonderful call with him and he asked me the same question like five times, and that I've gotten to be really comfortable with.
And just pre, you know, just be present. Just answer the question, don't get irritated. Don't try to change the subject. Just let him ask the question over and over and over again.
Track 1: What happens in that surrender Because I read instructions to tape on the wall of my nursing home if I ever end up with dementia. And it was like, don't try to stop me from asking the same question over and over again. You know, indulge my, my, the, the things that I'm saying that are not correct, that are not factually correct,
you know?
And I, And I, was like imagining a scenario where somebody did that with somebody who had dementia and I was like, oh yeah, that would be a way more fun interaction. It doesn't, we're so stuck on trying to make things be the way that we think they should be, that we forget to be with them the way that they are, which might actually be beautiful.
Bibby gignilliat: Yeah. And that comes to, uh, you know, I used to do a lot of improv theater and the beauty of improv is it teaches you to be in the complete moment. And so let's say you are my partner in improv and you say there's a purple elephant. I'm not supposed to say no, it's green, which blocks the person and shuts down the connection and the flow. And instead I say, oh yeah, and it's wearing pajamas. And then you go from there, right? And so it's like
that figure eight flow that we're talking about, and it applies to my dad and to art.
Track 1: Using, using the obstacles. I've put obstacles in quotes, using the obstacles as part of the flow. know, pushing off from the rocks that are,
Bibby gignilliat: Surrendering to the moment.
'cause the only time we have fear is when we're in the future or in the past.
But usually there's relatively little fear, unless like there's an earthquake happening or something. But very, very little fear in the moment.
Track 1: Yeah. If you're really
in it. Yeah,
Bibby gignilliat: So just keep, you know, that book is so cute the, in this moment, like, so in this moment I'm just sitting here enjoying this conversation with you and I'm in this wonderful studio surrounded by my art and everything's good, right? And so just breaking it down moment to moment as opposed to like, what am I gonna be a year from now?
Or am I ever gonna have love, romantic love, or whatever the fear question is, like, what am I gonna do when my dad dies? where will I be? And you know, all those things, that can take you off your center. I.
Track 1: , tell us about your creative space. And what does space mean to you? What is important about spaces
for
Bibby gignilliat: Oh yeah, that's a great question. So I feel so fortunate 'cause I'm in Sausalito, California, this beautiful place if you've never been here, it kind of reminds me of Italy with incredible views of the water. And this building is an old ship building building. So it was used to create ships in world Wari, and then they converted it to art studios and for 55 years or so, maybe more, it's been an art studio building There are 180 working artists in the building. Some come every day like me and others, you know, once a year will come, So it's all different levels of people interested. Some are hobbyists, some are, you know, trying to make a living as an artist like I am. and all different levels of skills
, it brings me to another point, which it's so important to be in a community.
. I'm an extroverted introvert, so when I'm creating, I like to just be in my space. And, and, but then I love the idea of touring the building and visiting with people or getting inspired by other people's art.
Or, if I'm stuck calling Andrew Faulkner in to say, give me a critique on this piece. Um, this afternoon I'm having one of the more senior artists in the building, who's been in the building 30 years or something, uh, down to give me a critique. 'cause I'm stuck on a few pieces there's just a lot of things that we offer each other. And now
we've done this whole branding on the building and we're, we're really trying to get people to come to our next open studios and sharing information. And I did an Instagram seminar yesterday in my studio, so some of the people in the building, we had a 91-year-old lady that was in the room, you know, that doesn't, didn't really know how to do Instagram, but she was learning Instagram, you know, so that
Track 1: I love that.
Bibby gignilliat: get people to the, our event coming up.
So that's the, good thing about the building. And then my actual studio space is 1500 square feet and it's got like four windows that look out, you know, the view's nice. And the sun comes in in the afternoon and. I just have a lot of space for, , I create mostly large art. I love creating big , and so this space helps me to feel like I can do that. It's big enough to invite people to come in and do, like to paint together or do meetings here , and then I teach, once a month out of here at least,
for the person who's listening to this going, okay, well I'm just starting out and I can't even rent a hundred square foot studio somewhere for myself. What would you say to them about using what they have?
.
yeah. Well, um, and keep in mind I had a hundred square feet shared. With someone when I first started and I, I was in there for two years and I was creating 12 by twelves and now I, my biggest piece in here is 72 by 96. So,
um, you have to start somewhere and it's better to start somewhere, even if it's at home. And, but the most important thing is if it's gonna be at home, I don't recommend it being like on the dining room table where you're worried about getting it on the dining room table. Like it's good to have a place maybe like your garage or basement or attic or whatever, where you can really get kind of messy and you could leave it out and open.
'cause I think you're gonna be more likely to do it if it's available. You can just walk in and get started without having a lot of setup and cleanup.
Track 1: Mm-Hmm. , do you have, like a ritual that you do every day or a habit that you have that you might say sort of shifted everything for you? what are your rituals in your and your habits around creativity?
Bibby gignilliat: I like to wake up and I sit outside in my garden, which is very inspiring and, you know, have my coffee and ease into the day. before Covid I used to get up and go to a cafe with my laptop and that's when I would do the business side. I'd write my newsletters, you know, respond to anybody. And then I'll come into my studio and then I create for like four or five, six hours and then head home and exercise and might do a little Instagram right before bed. but that's pretty much it. I don't do any like formal meditation, but I have kind of my quiet time in the morning to kind of ease into the day and the garden and it's, it feels sort of meditative.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah, I think meditation is misunderstood. It doesn't have to just be sitting there with your eyes closed in a straight back, like can, you can be medi. You're probably meditating for many of those. Six hours that you're at the studio, you're actually probably in some sort of meditative state
when you're in that
Bibby gignilliat: And then walking, I find very meditative,
especially if I have to think through something. And one of the things I do with my art is I'll often take a photo of it at the end of the day and then right before bed when I right, either before or after the Instagram, I'll look at it and I'll get out the markup tool on my iPhone and I will
play with it and see like, what if I did this mark on it, or what if I did that Mark, this is what I especially do if I'm stuck on something and I try it at night and see what I can come up with with my markup tool. So that's another little thing I do often when I'm in the throws of a big painting.
Track 1: We had a guest on in season one who, who said what would happen if you, you know, you loved this painting, but it wasn't quite finished, or it didn't feel like it needed, it felt like it needed something. What would happen if you took your biggest paintbrush and your darkest black paint?
And just made a big line across the middle of it. And I was like, Ooh, . She was trying to point to like letting go and not getting so attached to what you think you've created. But I like that idea too, because I think we also need to give ourselves permission to tiptoe into that.
You know, maybe we're not ready for the real paintbrush, but maybe we can do that on our iPad and it can help us look what happens.
It doesn't, the world doesn't end because you made a mark that didn't work, right?
Mm-Hmm.
Bibby gignilliat: a recovering perfectionist and it's been one of the ways I've, I I believe control is a form of perfectionism or is perfectionism, and so it's been one of the ways it's helped me to kinda let go of some of that more easily.
Kate Shepherd: what do you think is maybe the most common limiting belief that people tell themselves? What do you think is, is at the root of most of it? Of holding ourselves back?
Bibby gignilliat: A lot of people say they can't make a living as an artist 'cause I don't know why, but our society has taught people that, that your artist has to starve. And I don't believe that at all. like I said earlier, I don't wanna, you know, take it for granted. But I work at it.
I do the business side.
Track 1: Mm-Hmm.
Bibby gignilliat: Does that make sense?
Track 1: Yeah. Yeah. I think the idea that, that you, Just have a dream and then are sitting in your armchair at home. Waiting for the universe to deliver it to you is, I mean, , it's foolish. , you do have to work for it. And then, you know, if you really, really, really, really, really work for it, it still doesn't happen. Okay. Maybe then you surrender and say, well, maybe this wasn't my path, but I think you, you do have to work for it,
Bibby gignilliat: I think
it's a little of both. It's it's surrender and, and allowed to come to you. What's gonna come to you, but also respond to the breadcrumbs and, and do the work.
Kate Shepherd: You talked about teaching. If somebody's listening to this and they're clear across the country from you or you know, somewhere in Europe or somewhere beyond, people still study with you? How can we find out more about that and how can we support you?
Bibby gignilliat: Thank you. well, during C-O-V-I-D-I freaked out 'cause I was doing pretty well that year. And then all of a sudden income went dry and I had to come up with an idea for making income. So I decided to teach an online class, which I had no intention of doing. but now all these years later, I have 950 people from around the world that have taken the class, it's a self-paced, self-study class. So you sign up for it, it's $197 and you take the class at your convenience. It's like 20 different modules with a big handout, with a lot of links to it, to all the different resources I mentioned. And I talk about a lot of the principles we've talked about today in, in that coursework. and there's a Facebook group, you know, that people can join to post their work and that kind of thing.
Kate Shepherd: And it's an abstract, it's a learning to,
Bibby gignilliat: It's mixed
media.
, for your listeners, I would offer it at a discount of 125.
Track 1: , one thing I wanna tell you, and something one more question I wanna ask you.
Before every episode, I, I have this beautiful wooden heart-shaped bowl, and it's, got my angel cards in it. Just, they're little tiny cards
and each card just has one little word on it.
I
just ask for a little bit of guidance or blessing or like, what is the, you know, the word for today's show and today's word was
purpose, I thought was so beautiful. 'cause I feel like that that's the path that you're on. You've got lots of questions about purpose and uncertainty and what's happening right now.
And I feel like for a lot of us, you know, listeners and myself included, there's a, underneath our creative impulses, there is this sense of like, needing to understand our purpose so that we can be in service.
Bibby gignilliat: Yes.
read
a quote last night that said something like, um, I'm gonna find it for you because I think you're gonna love it. your purpose is not the thing you do, it's the thing that happens in others. When you do what you do,
Track 1: Oh, I just got actual chills.
Bibby gignilliat: your purpose is not the thing you do. It is the thing that happens in others. When you do what you do by Dr. Carolyn Leaf, LEAF.
Kate Shepherd: I got actual chills on my arms when you said that. . the end of every episode, I ask everybody the same question. It's the billboard question. So if you had this magical billboard that. Would reach all of the people who yearn to express their purpose and express their creativity.
But for all of the reasons we've talked about, teachers, you know who, who shut them down when they were younger, or limiting beliefs that society has given them and they just don't believe they have it in them. They really do not believe they have these things in them. And you could reach them with this message on the billboard.
What would you put on the billboard?
Bibby gignilliat: I would just say take one courageous action step. I think what happens is people think about this whole, like how am I gonna make a living? Like all this kind of stuff. But maybe it's just as simple as set up the dining room table or set up the garage or take an art class.
Track 1: I love that . Thank you. Thank you for coming today. I really, I've loved meeting you.
Bibby gignilliat: Loved meeting you.
Kate Shepherd: As we wrap up this incredible conversation, it occurs to me that there's a resounding theme that echoes throughout this entire episode. Around surrendering 10 certainty. It's one of the hardest things. That we can ever do. . It's sometimes it feels like our whole body is primed to resist uncertainty. But when we allow ourselves to be open. To surrender to the uncertainty, to the unknown, to be in a place of not knowing. That's the moment we become open. And available. And attuned. To the whispers of life. Those seemingly small moments, the perfect scrap on the floor. Uh, for caterpillar.
They can hold profound significance. AnD immeasurable guidance. On our creative path. Before we part ways I want to give you a quick reminder to mark your calendars for January 25th. I have something truly special lined up for you. It's our January. aCtivating intuition and creativity workshop.
This is a live online workshop we do every month in the lead up to the full moon. It's beautiful. People love doing it. They use words like transformative. and powerful and deeply resonating. And a lot of the people who do it keep coming back for more. So that says something. That workshop is included when you are a Patrion member at the colorful community tier. Join the creative genius Patrion at the colorful community tier.
ATR2100x-USB Microphone-7: All the information you need to sign up for Patrion membership. Can be found on patrion.com. Slash creative genius podcast. It's P a T R E O n.com. slash creative genius podcast, you can also find everything they need on Kate Sheppard, creative.com.
K a T E S H E P H E R D. creative.com.
Kate Shepherd: If there's one thing I hope you take away from this episode today. It's that in surrendering?
We open ourselves to finding unexpected treasures, unlock hidden potential. And are open to the information we need to embark on a journey where creativity and inspiration thrive. And are in fact at the helm.
Embracing uncertainty.
Isn't just about navigating the unknown. It's about discovering the magic. That's hidden right there in plain sight within it.
You're a part of a community now. This creative genius family is a community.
And the more of us that work together to embrace the unknown together. And steady our wobbly selves when we hit rough patches. The more grounded and emboldened will feel to step even deeper into the mystery of life. May you find inspiration in every twist and turn on your creative path . And until next time. I'm here. Cheering you on.
Dive into a recorded audio workshop inspired by Episode 56 of the Creative Genius Podcast with Beth Suter. Discover the power of aligning your goals with the New Moon cycles for maximum impact on your life.
This is a resources you can come back to on the day of the New Moon each month in 2024 (there are 13 new moons this year!) You'll Discover the power of aligning your goals with the New Moon cycles for maximum impact on your life.
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I get *really* excited about creating meaningful and useful materials and resources for you inside The Creative Genius Patreon. Hand on my heart, I feel like this membership is one of the best value for money out there.
What's inside?
Thoughtful, useful content like access to my Monthly Activating Intuition & Creativity LIVE workshop, bonus episodes, handouts, homework, journal prompts, guided meditations, early access to episodes and truly SO much more.
Just dropped: 🌟 Life Planning with New Moon Energy
Dive into a recorded audio workshop inspired by Episode 56 of the Creative Genius Podcast with Beth Suter. Discover the power of aligning your goals with the New Moon cycles for maximum impact on your life.
This is a resources you can come back to on the day of the New Moon each month in 2024 (there are 13 new moons this year!) You'll Discover the power of aligning your goals with the New Moon cycles for maximum impact on your life.
📚 Handouts Included: We've got you covered with handouts to guide you through the workshop and make your experience seamless.
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👉 Join The Creative Genius Patreon
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With gratitude and excitement for the coming year together,
]]>In this insightful conversation, Kate Shepherd reunites with Beth, a watercolor artist and moon cycle coach, to delve into the profound influence of moon wisdom on intention-setting and navigating life's ups and downs. They explore the nuances of moon phases, their impact on energy, and emotional states. Beth underscores the significance of reflection, celebration, and rest synchronized with the rhythm of the moon's cycles. They also confront the contrast between societal expectations and our intrinsic nature. Beth shares simple and profound wisdom on crafting rituals and setting intentions for the new year by aligning with New Moon Energy
Welcome to the second part of this special two-part series dedicated to bringing closure to the old and welcoming the new. In the first part aired in December, Megan Sheldon guided us through ceremonial closure techniques for bidding farewell to the passing year and ushering in the new. Megan's expertise lies in creating personalized rituals and ceremonies, empowering transformational moments in our lives.
Now, in this sequel, we welcome back Beth Suter, a familiar face from Season One's Episode 11 of the Creative Genius Podcast. Beth, a watercolor artist and moon cycle coach, shares profound insights into harnessing the potent energy of moon cycles for intention setting and life navigation.
Beth delves into the nuanced understanding of moon phases, linking them to reflection, celebration, and rest. Her depth of knowledge illuminates how each lunar phase corresponds to different aspects of life. She guides us on aligning with these cycles, creating rituals, and setting intentions for a fresh start every month.
Rather than overwhelming ourselves with an extensive list of resolutions, Beth simplifies the process by identifying one aspect of moon cycle energy that can yield substantial transformation. She crafts a feasible formula, tailored for each new moon, revealing the magic within the 13 to 24 cycles within a year.
Beth emphasizes the importance of honouring the natural cycles of rest, growth, and release, inherent within moon cycles. This episode is a powerful resource that listeners can revisit monthly, offering prompts, questions, and a structured routine around the new moon for transformational experiences.
Central to Beth's teachings is the reminder that growth isn't the sole focus; it's equally vital to embrace rest and release. Moon cycle rituals serve as a reminder of when to channel vibrant energy and when to nurture introspection, providing a balanced approach to life's evolution.
Listeners are encouraged to embrace Beth's offering by committing to her new moon rituals monthly, an invitation to incorporate these practices into their lives for sustained growth and introspection.
The next Activating Intuition & Creativity workshop is scheduled for January 25th. For patrons of the Colorful Community tier Patreon Membership, workshop admission is included. The support from patrons helps sustain the podcast, and Kate Shepherd is grateful for every contribution.
As we embark on this journey of intentionality and transformation, remember to take care of yourself and have faith in the unfolding journey.
Reflecting on Personal Growth: Embracing the power of retrospection to release what no longer serves personal growth.
Moon Cycles and Intention Setting: Understanding the profound influence of various moon phases on directing energy and emotions toward specific intentions.
Aligning Practices with Moon Cycles: Embracing reflection, celebration, and the vital role of rest as harmonious practices in sync with the moon's rhythm.
Societal Expectations vs. Authenticity: Unveiling the disparity between societal pressures and the intrinsic essence, particularly prevalent during festive periods.
Rituals for the New Year: Insights into crafting meaningful rituals and intentions using upcoming moon cycles for a fresh start and sustainable progress.
Moon cycles offer a potent tool for intention setting and navigating life's journey.
The diverse phases of the moon exert distinct influences on emotional states and personal energy.
Reflection, celebration, and deliberate rest serve as pivotal practices intertwined with the ebbs and flows of lunar cycles.
Crafting rituals and setting intentions in tandem with moon phases offer a gateway to renewed beginnings and continual advancement.
What We Talk About
Beth's Insights on Moon Cycles: Understanding and harnessing the energy of lunar phases.
Power of Moon Energy: Delving into the phases' impact on emotional states and intentions.
Embracing Reflection and Celebration: Highlighting the importance of rest and honoring achievements.
Navigating Societal Expectations: Addressing the contrast between societal norms and authentic inclinations.
Crafting New Year Rituals: Insights into setting intentions aligned with forthcoming moon cycles.
Tapping into Lunar Cycles for Intentions: Strategies to release and progress through moon-aligned intentions.
NEW MOON DATES FOR 2024
January 11th, February 8th, March 10th, April 8th. May 7th, June 6th, July 5th, August 4th, September 2nd, October 2nd, November 1st, and then December 1st and December 30th.
Tune in for a transformative dialogue on syncing life's rhythms with the captivating cadence of moon cycles, fostering intentionality, and embracing authenticity in navigating life's journey.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
WeLcome to this second part. Of this very special two-part series that I put together for you. part one, which you would have heard back in December. Was about closing out the year, close it. How do we say goodbye to a year? How can we bring some ceremony and ritual? In ways that feel personal to us, to our lives, to close out the old and prepare for welcoming in the new and our guest, Megan, Sheldon. Walked us through some absolutely gorgeous ways of doing that . Megan is a master at helping people create ritual and ceremony. In ways that really feel like them so that we can really feel into the transformative power. That these moments can have in our lives.
So if you haven't listened to that episode, I wholeheartedly encourage you to pause and go back. And make time for that and do some of the journaling and some of the reflections and she had us think about a word. That might represent everything that, that 2023 was for us summing it up into a word. And then creating a ceremony around letting go of that.
And for me, that was really a really, really powerful experience. And I would love for you to have that too. So go back and listen to Megan. You can do that any time. It doesn't have to be in January. You could be listening to this in June. You can have these kind of starting over moments at any time. Which is something that our guest in part two of this series talks about to. Beth suitor is back.
She was with us in episode 11 of the creative genius podcast, way back in season one. And honest to goodness. Some of the things that Beth has shared with me over the years have truly transformed my life. Not just like, oh, this is kind of a new thing that I liked doing and what a cool idea. Some of the things that I've implemented in my routine and in my day to day life, even with creating this podcast. Have been utterly transformed for the better. By suggestions that Beth has put in front of me. So I'm very excited to have her back.
Beth is a watercolor artist and moon cycle coach. So she really has a in-depth. Intimate understanding of how powerful moon cycles can be as a tool for setting intentions and navigating life. She talks us through the different phases of the moon and how they relate to reflection and celebration and rest and how, which phases for what and how we can start to align with these cycles. And create rituals and set intentions in alignment with the moon cycles to give us a fresh start every month. , I asked Beth. To join us for this episode to help us create one small little new habit that we could create that would have the biggest chance of supporting major transformation in our lives.
So this episode is geared for the person who's ready for change. Who's ready to step into a new version of themselves. But who doesn't want to overwhelm themselves with a huge long list of goals that may ultimately end up feeling overwhelming.
Rather than bringing us a whole new complicated set of things we have to learn and master. She picked the one facet of working with moon cycle energy that she felt. Would have the potential for the biggest impact on our lives. And she simplified it down so that it was attainable and achievable and not overwhelming. And then she created a formula for us to use it. Every new moon. And there are 13 new moon.
So explain that all in the episode, usually there's one every month, but there are 13 to 20, 24, and she explains the magic of that.
I feel like as I get older, I realize that. Overwhelming myself with a huge, big, long sky high list of ways. I want to improve and change and grow and even bring my dreams to life. Usually it doesn't land very well. All right. It's a recipe for overwhelming myself and I really love. How Beth approaches this with a truly grounded, rooted, and sustainable formula for us to actually. Tap into all of the wisdom in Ireland cycle.
So we get to honor the natural cycles of rest and growth. And release, which are all included in the moon cycles. This is a really powerful episode. I would bookmark it. You can come back to it every month. And that's what we hope that you do. She actually walks us through a bunch of really beautiful prompts that you can do. Questions, you can ask yourself. And oh, a little formula for a routine or ritual you can create for yourself every month. Around the new moon. So that you can tap into this wisdom and experience some of this incredible transformation that's available for you. And one of the things that Beth is almost always stressing to me that I'm always grateful for the reminder is that it's not always about growth. In connecting with the moon. We remember that the natural cycles include growth. And rest and release and working with the moon helps us to remember where we are at any given time. And how we can surrender to those beautiful natural cycles. And so doing cultivate a life. That is that fertile soil for, for helping us make our dreams come true. And achieve our goals and our visions that we hold for ourselves. It's a powerful, beautiful episode. I hope you listened to it on repeat back to back with Megan's episode . And if you're a patron, I will be cutting out the parts that Beth created for the formula that you should listen to every month. And putting that as a downloadable inside your Patrion membership.
I f you're listening to this, and haven't upgraded to the Patrion colorful community tier yet, or you haven't done one of the monthly workshops. I bet you with all my heart to do it. These workshops are, I feel like there's something that just comes through me. I'm channeling. I feel like when I'm giving them. I'm actually the voice of creativity. Itself not, I'm not it's coming through me.
It's like I get out of the way. And creativity. Uses me to speak to you to help you heal the thing you need to heal. So that you can express more of yourself and then you can go out and do that. And then have that. Ripple effect. Right. Then you get to be that for somebody else. And it's an honor for me to do that.
And it's also just.
Plain old, amazing to watch people healing. Really old stuff and navigating really new stuff. And having the experiences that they're having with the workshops. So please join the patriotic colorful community tier, if you haven't yet. I promise you. It's the best $20 that you'll spend all month.
The next one is on January 25th, and this is the perfect time to sign up for it. Get out your notebook. Find somewhere really cozy to sit and have a listen to this episode.
With the clear gentle kind and infinitely wise, Beth suter
I'm so happy you're back. Thank you for coming, Beth.
I'm so happy to be here.
For those of you who were not with us way back in season one, Beth was among my very first guests on the Creative Genus Podcast. She was in episode 11, and we talked about lunar phases and aligning with and connecting with the magic of Moon Wisdom, uh, a way of.
Amplifying our intention setting and manifesting and navigating life kind of is a, is a really powerful tool. And I took, a lot of Beth's information that she shared with me in a coaching capacity applied it to my life and my work, especially with this podcast. And I, I always say this, Beth, I re I've referenced you in so many episodes, , it has, it changed my life.
And so when I was thinking about . I wanted to create a really beautiful episode for closing out 2023. I know 2023 feels almost like this cap year at the end of a string of really hard years for a lot of us. And it feels
potent. It, yeah, it feels really like an a special, I mean, we always have this instinct at the end of the year to ritualize, you know, end of the year and, and then the new year with resolutions and stuff.
But I wanted to create something . Really special for the listeners, to help us to really sort of sit in a deeper ritual or ceremony around that and, help us close out the old year and bring in the new year. And you're the first person I thought of to do that.
Oh, thank you so much,
Kate.
So, and may, so for people who didn't hear that episode way back when and who don't know who you are, can you just give us a little sense of who you are and the work that you do, especially when it comes to the moon.
Yes. And thank you again for having me.
Very happy to be here I just adore you so much, . my Name is Beth Suiter. I'm a watercolor artist and a moon cycle coach in Boise, Idaho. I kind of have two parts of my business, the watercolor artwork, and the moon cycle. I have found that I have a very big passion for teaching, especially women, how they can use the phases of the moon, plan their goals and set intentions for their life professionally and personally. And I have seen that through this process. Not only do they learn about the energy of the moon, but what they really find out is their own personal patterns . I think it walks them back to themselves and it slowly builds intuition, bringing them back to their higher self and remembering what they love to do and how they want to move through the world. It's been amazing to see what it's done in my life and then in your life and in the women that I have been able to have the privilege to teach and work with. So thank you for letting me be here,
I wonder if you could tell us how does Moon. Magic. I, I guess that's the best way. The terminology, I'm not sure what terminology we should use. I like moon Magic, but so how does
Moon Magic influence our energy and our emotion and how, overall, like, I know you're gonna get us into some of the sort of specifics of different phases of the moon and how we can use those in different ways, but overall, how do we begin to harness the energy?
Like how, how does it work?
Well, I think the best part of it is if you just think about, it's a time for reflection. There's a time for action and there's a time for resting , and then it's rinse repeat over and over again, and it's when we can start trying to line up our own personal resting. With the time that the moon is resting, that is where I have found the magic lies.
So just simply, if you look up at the sky, the more light that the moon has, then the more energy. And as it has less light, then less energy, but it, it builds. So a new moon is when you don't see, there's no illumination.
It's a new beginning, a blank slate for you, and it slowly starts gaining light and you are slowly gaining energy and you're getting this feeling of newness, of freshness like we do at the new year. And maybe you have an idea cut sparks and you wanna act upon it, and this is a great time for you to take that action. And as the moon is gaining her light and energy, you can build your momentum. And then when the moon reaches her fullness, the full moon, which we are all very familiar with, it's a time of release and celebration. So we can look back and think about the last two weeks and all of the gifts that have come our way. Any heartache that has come our way , and we can celebrate all of it. The next day , the moon starts losing light again, and now we're going back to that slowness again. and we're trying to stick with what we had set our intentions for at the beginning of the moon cycle. Why this works so well for me, and people that I come into contact. I am an achiever and a doer, and I love goal setting, and I love making progress, and I love seeing progress . I I'm a generator, and my guess would be you are a generator or manifester. Generator. We tend to have a lot of energy, so we will
power through even to our detriment and. I have found that it's harder for me to honor rest and recognize the power in it, and that I'm not going to see return on investment or progress every day. And that's normal and it's natural. And now I value resting and just being so much more, and I don't know why, but I needed a permission slip for it, and the moon cycle gave me that permission slip . I used it today, for example, I woke up very anxious and just not feeling great. I knew we were meeting and I just, I didn't feel good and I thought, I know it's the last week of the moon cycle. I know that my energy is lower. I know it feels like a sludge and I know that if I get out into nature and I forget my to-do list. I can feel better. And that's what I did. I went to the river for an hour. I came home and I took a bath and I just said, I am gonna be today.
And just allowing myself that time, I could relax back into myself.
I think especially this time of year , it's very difficult. Because nature is telling us to rest
more even on a bigger, uh, more than just one moon cycle, but just within the season of wintering.
the nature inside of us is saying, yes, let me slow down, let me sleep more. AnD for me personally, I have found there's some dissonance between my true nature and the part of me that is trying to engage within what's happening. society, right?
Externally. Um.
there's a real disconnect or there's a real sort of splinter there where what, what, what the world is telling us we should be doing is very, very different than what our bodies and our hearts and, you know, our, our own internal systems are telling us we need.
Yes.
to hold the two.
And I, I love that explanation of sort of overall how Moon wisdom can serve us. I think, I think a lot of people think, oh moon, it's magical and, you know, new agey and weird and I mean, it can be just like anything. There's, it's a continuum. You can take it as far as you want, but just at its very basic, it's a symbol that's in the sky that you can see or not see, depending on where it is.
Every day that can remind you and, and be, and be that permission slip for you. I like the moon can actually tell you like, oh look, I'm in the dark right now too and I'm still
gonna be here, you know, two weeks when the, you know, and I thi so I just wanted to just quickly say. For anybody who wants to know more about this 'cause Beth and I went into this in great depth in her episode.
Go back and listen to episode 11 because we talk about this and it's like a masterclass. I of moon wisdom and how to harness this stuff for yourself.
I feel like most of us have this impulse when it comes to the end of a year or the end of a month or the end of anything. Like we have these, these impulses to mark that somehow or to have some sort of rituals around that somehow and, and, We've kind of, I don't know the right word. We've sort of weeded that kind of activity out of our society.
We don't have, you know, we do New Year's resolutions, but that's a really stressful tradition. , I don't think
It really
is.
anybody.
I know
we ourselves drastically. '
cause we wrote a list on the January 1st, so yeah. So I wanted to create this moment for people in this episode where it's like, , here's a little toolkit of some other ways you can approach . Going into the new year because Megan, has just walked us through how to close out the year, how to say goodbye to the year, how to honor and let go of and surrender to the things that didn't happen and all that stuff.
And so we're feeling, you know, a little bit more at peace with how we're closing out the year. And, when we do those things, it actually almost paves the way for us to, to walk forward into the new year. So, . What I wanted to ask you is how can we tap into the upcoming moon cycles, wherever we are gonna be at the beginning of the new year?
. How can we tap into those upcoming moon cycles? To set intentions for the upcoming year to maybe create some new habits that are more nourishing, that are more, uh, that have a cadence that feels a little bit more in line with
Mm-Hmm.
sustainable energy output and, you know, all of that stuff.
Yes.
are your, what are your thoughts on that?
We have a lot of pressure on the new year that we just have that one time to write our resolutions and then we don't revisit it until a year later and then are very frustrated ourselves if we didn't accomplish it, like or don't even remember what they were because 12 months have gone by and what I love with the moon cycle is you can begin again at any time . with the new Moon we have 12, and this year, in 2024, we're actually gonna have 13 new moons. So you get your New Year's resolution, your January one, your new beginning. You're going to get that 13 times, which feels so good . . you can break it down into such smaller pieces. So you're talking about, you know, we're letting go of 2023. At the end of a moon cycle, you are letting go of that cycle, which is about a month's time. we have to make room. For what's coming next through letting go and me, it's very tangible because it's a ritual that I follow I know I'm gonna come back to those
resolutions, I'm gonna come back to those goals and I'm going to make an assessment . So as we approach the end of any year, most of us have this sort of intuitive, it kind of feels like it's in our bones. It's this impulse to, reflect on, you know, all the things that happened for us over the last little while and let go of maybe things that don't feel good anymore.
But I think there's an even stronger impulse once we've done that. Or To set some intentions for what we want, for the things that we desire, for the things we wanna create. And I was hoping that you could help us today in shedding some light on how we can tap into, the upcoming moon cycles to set our intentions and, How does it work? What's the best time to do that? And how do we, What's the best way to approach it?
I think that is a beautiful question. Anytime, new to the moon cycle, they'll ask me to explain it and I always say that a new moon is like the new year. I. And what I love about the moon cycle is we have a new moon, 12 new moons. Typically next year, 2024, we will have 13 new moons, and it's like 13 New years, 13 times for you to have a fresh start, 13 times for you to come back to those intentions and your goals, and it allows you to check back in with yourself much more frequently. It allows you to take your big goals and break them down, and it gives you something to hold onto to let you know that you'll come back to your big visions. You can come back to your projects as creatives. And I, we are all creative. We have lots of ideas. We have lots of desires, lots of things we want to do, and many of us, myself included, I think, can get lost in all of the things that we want to do, that we get overwhelmed by all of those desires and intentions, and therefore we do nothing. So
Right.
at The New Moon, you're going to revisit all of your big dreams and desires. And then you are going to slowly hone down to what is the desire that's really calling to me right now. And you're going to focus on that for the whole moon cycle, which is about a month. And then at the end of the moon cycle, you're gonna go through that letting go process again. You're going to revisit all of your big dreams and desires and the current thing you're focusing on, and then you can ask yourself. Did I make the progress I wanted to make? Do I wanna continue moving forward on this? Do I realize this actually isn't what I want and I need to pick something new. And I think a month gives you enough time to really stay focused and give it a go and to see if you've made progress. what I love about it is as we gain more intentions and desires, which is human nature, we're always going to have them. As we continue to evolve, we can write it down and put it on our, I like to think of it as a shelf. Your idea shelf. Your intention shelf, you can put it on the shelf and let yourself know, I will revisit this at the next moon cycle. That way we don't squirrel so often. but again, it comes back to that ritual like you're talking about. We are able to, at the New Moon, get reflective, set our intentions as the moon starts gaining light, we are starting to take action on those intentions. The full moon marks our halfway point, the full illumination. This is where we celebrate what we have done over the last two weeks. This is where we release what isn't serving us, and then as the moon is going back towards darkness, we start slowing down. And as a person that loves to chase shiny objects, this is a wonderful way for me to reign that in. and remind myself, I still have two weeks. I've committed to these goals and I'm going to continue working on them. And I'm not going to start this new shiny object, at least for two weeks. I will revisit it. And I can't speak for you, Kate, but I know for me When I don't feel busy and I don't kinda have this undercurrent of, there's always something I, I need to mark off and do. It feels uncomfortable, but what I am realizing is that's, that's peace and that is space, and that is so necessary and natural. The constant undercurrent of feeling so busy that you can't give gift yourself the 10 minutes to sit in
stillness, that is unnatural. And this process has allowed myself and the women that I've worked with to just work our way back to what is natural. It's a remembering in my mind, we are, born knowing who we are. I believe we can think back to when we're children, the things that we love to do, our natural curiosity, and then layers get billed over the top of that. We lose that. the moon cycle is a beautiful way for us to continue to stay in alignment with our truths, with our goals and our intentions. And I think the more of us that can do that, the more beauty and peace and calm that we will have in the world.
As doers, we do forget the natural cycle of, there's a time when you're. Sowing the seeds in the garden.
There's a time that you're tending to the plants that are growing, and then there's a time that you're harvesting. And then there's a time where it's fallow and winter is happening and everything's resting, we somehow believe that we are above that or separate from that system and that we should always be in either sewing or, you know, tending or, or harvesting mode.
And we forget
about the rest mode. And I, this is one of the most powerful teachings. That I've gotten from you and this moon work. Is, you know, if I'm ever feeling like this last month cycle, even for me, I had some incredible serendipitous connections happen with people
reaching out to for collaborations and stuff like that, like mind blowingly great stuff.
And Then, uh, and I was like, whoa. We're, and I, my first thought was where we must be somewhere good in the moon. Like it must
be, we must
be, close the moon. And we were, we
it was totally, right around that time. And then, you know, a couple days went by and I sort of, you know, forgot about that.
And then I started getting really tired and grumpy and feeling like overwhelmed. And my dreams are never gonna happen. And
none of these things are, you know. And sure enough, where are we in the moon cycle? And it's in that, we're in that. And so it actually gives me, it reminds me
that it's that I'm, that I'm in a natural part of it's okay that I feel really tired and not full of strategic ideas and collaborative energy right now.
yes.
I'm not supposed to be in that mood all the time. It's a really good reminder of that.
Yes, I think that's exactly right because we aren't, we aren't going to feel good all of the time. We aren't gonna
be
we're not supposed to.
and We're not supposed to.
be, but it doesn't feel good to not feel good. Uh, but when we think of the moon phases, you know, with when she gets towards her darkness in the new moon and there's no light, the light always comes again. I think that's one thing that helps me too, because I go through and I experience, I'm experiencing it right now that it feels like muddiness to me.
Just kind of like I'm s sludging along and I, and I'm like you, I feel more tired and oh, well, all of the things I'm wanting to do on my heart ever happen. It feels kind of defeating and then this too shall pass. It's okay, let go. And I think it's good for us to completely stop thinking about our big dreams sometimes, the problems that we have, the stuck points that we have is a different frequency than the solution. So when we're stuck on the problem, solutions can't find us because it's a different wavelength. Sometimes we have to completely just turn away from that for a little while so that an answer can come if we recognize answers will come to us, you can just relax more. I think
and know, just chill out a little bit. Know everything is going to be all right and we don't have to control everything, which is an illusion anyway, right?
for somebody who's, who's new to this kind of exploration or new to this kind of activity, is there a simple thing that's tangible, that feels accessible that they could do going forward? Like to start this new year and this new set of 13 moons that we're about to have?
The first thing I would tell them is, I wanted to give you the dates for the New Moon and for them to write it down and then find it on their calendar. So you might have to push pause a couple times and come back. But for 2024, we have January 11th, which is 1 1 1. That's so fun. January 11th. February 8th, March 10th, April 8th. May 7th, June 6th, July 5th, August 4th, September 2nd, October 2nd, November 1st, and then December 1st and December 30th. So mark
those down
And we're gonna put those, if you're driving right now
and you're like, oh no , I have to write that one, don't worry. I'm gonna put them in the show notes, for this episode on kate shepherd creative.com. So don't worry, you can, you can go back and get the, those dates.
So just know that those, that's your new moon, and if you can commit on that day is ideal. But let's say either before on that day or after that day that you would schedule yourself, it would be so awesome if you had a couple hours. But even if you would do one hour for yourself, mark it out like a doctor's appointment.
Like that is your time.
put it in your calendar
And I have moon calendars too that has this all marked down. But here's a routine that you could do. Find a quiet space, wherever that would be if it's in your home, um, or a library. But just find a space that you can be uninterrupted. I like to have a candle, 'cause lighting a candle can signify the beginning of something. Do a small grounding, uh, meditation. You could find what, you could Google it, you know, grounding meditation, or you can do something very simple, which is please let me be right where I am right now. And I ask that my critical mind exits this activity and I call forth my higher self. And you could take three deep breaths and just stay in that space until you feel completely relaxed. And then you do what I call a gratitude , free, flow. So for about three minutes, you just write everything you're grateful for, big, small. And if you need motivated, open up your phone. Look at photos, because we tend to take pictures of the things that we want to remember, and this gets you in a space of gratitude. I believe that when we can start in gratitude, it helps us to move forward to call the things that we're wanting, and also recognizing how blessed we already are. Once you have done that, you're going to do big dreaming. I This is your before I die, bucket list dreams, and you are going to just go all out. If you say, I wanna win a million dollars and I want to live on the beaches of Hawaii and paint the rest of my life, there is nothing off limits here. So I'll give you a couple of journaling prompts that you could do. Wouldn't it be amazing if, and my daydream looks like And you're just going to answer that.
And if you can do all the five senses, what do, what does it feel like? What do you hear, what do you smell? And you'll notice that your critical mind's gonna come in and say, that's just not realistic, but you just. Not right now. That is not the how is not the point, right? And then you are going to start zooming in a little bit more and you can ask yourself these personal life questions. How do I want to spend my energy? It's a huge question for me. An example would be I want to spend my energy painting, hiking, writing poetry, playing board games, having good conversation, those sorts of things. What are three things that you love about yourself? Because we're always wanting to improve ourselves.
We must honor what we we love about ourself. What is something you are doing really well, and what are the signs that you are living in alignment? How do you know that you're on your path? Then you can go into your professional life. What is the mission of my work? What kind of clients do I want to attract? What kind of projects do I want to work on? And is the work I'm doing currently in alignment with my core values? These are bigger questions, and that's why you need to come back to them if you can't answer them. This is not a, a shaming activity. This is, Ooh, that's interesting. I don't even know. And you might not have an answer then, and it might come later and you're going to revisit them every moon cycle and you will gain more and more clarity. I find even in my business, I end up painting myself into a corner even though I'm really in control of a lot of things. How am I spending all my time on this project that I actually It's not really what I wanna be doing. And that's okay. We, that happens. This is your opportunity to take your head out of the sand, so to speak.
Look around and see where you're going. I. Then you're gonna write down your core values. I believe our core values are what our truths are. They are our foundational beliefs. they are the pillars that make life worth living, whether that's your family generosity, giving back to your community, your creativity, you get to decide those. And then you pick one that you really wanna focus on for that moving cycle. Like for this one, for mine is, is health then you're going to break it down even more, and you're going to choose one personal and one professional goal that are in alignment with your core value because it all comes together. And this is when I like to visit that shelf of project ideas, all the things that I'm wanting to do and to get done. And I have to ask myself what is really resonating with me right now? And some things are time bound and some things are habits. Drinking four glasses of water a day, right? Would be a habit that would be ongoing. Kate, you and I are both writing a book. And I just need to get my final products, I guess, ready to publish. Everything else is done. So that is also a time bound thing. Um, some projects are going to take years, some might take a month, and you just have to figure out what's calling to me right now, and then give yourself that month to really work on it, and then you do it all over again.
Beautiful. Thank you first of all that I like. I wanna just put that on my phone. I'm gonna take a snippet of that recording and just have that, and I'm gonna actually listen to that. That'll be my ritual. Every new moon for the,
for the next 13 months as I'm gonna listen to you. And maybe So for the person, 'cause you know, who is probably a lot like you and me who are overachievers and have a huge list, like my dream goal list is, you know, I can see the, the shelves buckling under the weight of my, you know,
all the things I put on there, all the things I wanna do.
Oh yeah.
How, how do you address that with, within the context of kind of planning out it's, I love that we have an opportunity to do a new thing every month rather than kind of like this year I'm gonna, that's really great, but even in the month, how do you know you've picked the thing? How do you know what voice to listen to when you're doing that?
How do you know which is the thing to focus on? How do you know? How do you know in your body? what are your indicators that
Sure. Well, and the first thing that I do wanna say is, even though I teach this and practice it, I, I don't always know either. you know, I am, I'm still learning. And I would say for me that I just have to really get quiet and. A yes for me feels like excitement and there might be fear there, but it's the type of fear that is, I know I'm pushing myself a little bit outside of my, my comfort zone a no or a should, feels more anxious. and it feels more like very time-bound and it must get down, get done now. And so I would guess feeling into my body is one of the big things that I do.
And I, I like the question, does this feel like allowing, or does this feel like pushing?
. Do I feel like I'm making this decision out of guilt or pressure from someone else? Or does this feel true to me? And I. Knowing we were having this conversation, I was really thinking on what all of the Moon has taught me. And I think when we go to make choices and we wanna know, am I making You know, quote unquote the right choice. Or am I making the, you know, the true Kate higher self sole choice? Or am I making the, you know, small ego fearful choice? We wanna do it when it's a really big decision. Should I leave my job when we haven't even been practicing it on the small choices?
a hundred percent. it's like it's a muscle, you know? It's a muscle You have to exercise. And that is why I started teaching the activating intuition and creativity. It's the online workshop. I do it once a month in the
lead up to the full moon.
there. It's beautiful.
and we And Oh yeah, you've done it with me. That's right.
Yes,
it's wonderful. Everyone needs to do it.
Well, I won't, I wish everybody could do it because it's, it is, and it's different every month, but it is such an amazing opportunity to, I give you exercises to practice these things because you do need to begin to recognize what those things feel like in your body.
You There's a lot of. Misunderstandings around what intuition and what that inner voice is and sounds like and how it works. And I think a lot of people think there should be like this light coming off it and it should be really obvious and it, no, it's much more like feeling around in the dark and, but understanding what those yeses those
nos feel like.
So that's,
Instead of this idea of, is this right or is it wrong, is it good or it's bad, it's more information.
wE might say a yes to something even that you, even at your gut level feel probably a no. But you talk yourself into it and it ends up. as playing out as that was not a great choice. That did not work out. But then if you can learn from that and remind yourself, what was I thinking right at the time when I was asked that question
and how did it play out? We
talk a lot about in my, in my membership about taking evidence and it's really just about being curious about yourself, noticing your own patterns. Following that little whisper. One thing I would also like to say with the moon cycle and the ideal times for things that I have to watch is I don't wanna get into the should of my
own creation.
I should be doing this.
this.
so this brings me to something. I'm so glad you brought this up because. So that, formula for how to, uh, I, how would we say it? That formula that you've just given us for New Moon ritual,
Yes.
you know, that we're gonna do every month. I'm thinking about the, what comes next.
So the, the things that you can do to integrate it into your life in a way that feels light and juicy and. Curious as opposed to a heavier should or
stress and anxiety and, 'cause there's two really different energies that can come out of setting an intention, right. And then bring into your life.
So I wanted to talk to you just about the in integration and, and progress.
start small, . So maybe this new moon, if you could be as simple and small as possible, let's say it's, it is your health, what is one health habit that you know could help you? Let's say, we'll go back to the water. Drinking a glass of water, right? And you wanna set a goal of drinking, I don't know what it'll be.
We'll say four glasses of water, and then just keeping track of that for yourself through an entire moon cycle. Keep it so simple. It almost seems ridiculous, but noticing that you are committing to something for a full month. Notice how you might forget. Notice how you might go a few days and like, oh, I was committed to this and I missed it.
So I guess I'll just give up, come back, come back to it, and just stick, stick with it and give yourself, give yourself grace. Um, I think the biggest thing is just, just start noticing our patterns and then what one small degree of change can we do. Or another thing too, if you, when you get to. The third quarter moon, which is a great decluttering time.
Here's something very simple like you see the third quarter moon and you know, I am going to declutter something, whether it's a drawer or I'm gonna go into my living room and pick one thing that I don't need and I'm gonna put it in my garage, Um, simple things like that. Because we have to build. It's a practice.
You wouldn't just turn paleo overnight. Most people aren't gonna quit smoking overnight. We're not. And I think when we can give ourselves grace and just try one little thing and make it so ridiculously simple, it's almost like that's not even a big deal. But it is. And then it builds.
And it builds.
I'm thinking about, how can this be different than the typical New Year's resolution energy, and I'm, I think you also talk about checking in at another.
Point in this moon cycle
absolutely. I think it's checking in frequently. I think it's important for us to check in with ourselves a lot. Right. And one thing I do wanna say really quick before I forget, we talk so much in my membership about daily joy Everything I think in life is this, uh, duality. The duality of dreaming and wanting to move forward and being very present and having the joy at the same time. and for the check-in points, the New Moon is gonna be your really big. Bucket list. You're zooming out right at your whole life kind of time. Bringing it back down into, okay, what can I focus on for this month? You get to the first quarter moon, so it's about a week. You're gonna stop and look and see, okay, how am I doing on this project? I said I was going to get started on what do I need to make massive action this next week? What is something that I can do to make a lot of progress? Then you get to the full moon. This is your celebration time, your release time, and then you're going in right to the waning moon. So you're losing that light again and you're just kind of clicking away on what you said.
You are going to start at the beginning of the
moon cycle, the full moon when you release, and this is the giving gratitude. So that week you could really focus on how can I give back? And it doesn't have to be financially, it can, but could you give someone your time? Could you give someone a smile? Could you send someone you haven't talked to in a long time? You know, a handwritten note. And then when you get to the third quarter, which is your last week of the cycle, look back, what did you commit to that you made progress on? Can you write it down? When I'm feeling like I'm going nowhere and I'm going backwards, which happens a lot, I stop and think, what have I done right?
Up until this point, I didn't used to have an art business. I didn't use to be a Moon cycle coach. You didn't used to have a podcast. So we do have to remember to look back at our progress and on that third quarter, Now you're starting to release and let go. This is a time, if you wanna get, um, like literal, you can clean out your email and declutter a closet.
You are closing that moon cycle and I like to do like have sage and I will light my sage. I'll do it actually usually on the new moon or right before, and I'll light it and I'll just walk through my art studio and out loud I say whatever comes to me, but something general. Thank you for the opportunities that came my way. Thank you for all of the individuals that purchased my artwork, or you know, thank you for my family, those sorts of things. And then I will say, I make way for the new opportunities that I don't even know are coming.
So I'm thinking about the shape of the month for the person listening to this going, okay, I'm gonna do the new Moon thing. So we were, we started off saying we're gonna start small. So for 2024. To keep it really simple, we're just gonna be doing New Moon. Like that's the big commitment that we're making.
But if there's somebody who's like, but I actually wanna do some of these other things, you, I'm, it's sounding like there's almost like four opportunities ish to do a ritual of some kind in a month. Like, what do you think is a manageable, should we just stick to the one new moon one, or what do you think is the most
that's a really good question. I I think you could even just sticking to the New Moon, making a commitment that you're gonna revisit your goals at that time and do some self-reflection, journaling, if you wanted to break it down one more. Yes. I think four times is great because a moon cycle is almost a month, and each, um, between each phase is about a week.
So you have your new Moon to your first quarter. That's about a week. So your new moon is your intention setting and you're planning, you're reflecting and you're planning moving forward. It's like you are planning your road trip where you wanna go, and then as the next day you're, you get in the car and you're starting to drive. And then once you get to the first quarter moon, it's like you, maybe you stop at a, you know, a pit stop and you're deciding, are we gonna still take this route to get there? Or do we need to reroute a little bit? Do we need to make some changes to our plan? And then you get to the full Moon is your halfway point. Again, that's a celebration time. Um, and it's, it is like a release time as well. We can get lots of emotions during that time. And then you've commit, you've, you're committed, you're gonna hit cruise control. You're going to your destination for, you know, the next week, and you hit the third quarter moon. And then there's that last, that last final week at the end, you have reached. Wherever you said you were going to go and now you're going to decide your next trip,
I love the road trip analogy. That's gorgeous. So I can totally see it now. It makes a lot more sense to me now. Thank you.
Yeah.
sharing all of this with us today. I, I really appreciate it all so much.
Oh, well thank you. Thank you for what you're doing and I just, I hope your listeners will give themselves so much grace. Because life is so hard and it's so fun and beautiful and messy and confusing, and sometimes clarity and sometimes not. And if they can just hold on and find whatever it is that works for them to give them some sort of ritual, um, and to know to keep going.
Yeah. And to give yourself credit because
Mm-Hmm.
actually are doing way better than you think.
I think we often don't stop to tell ourselves that. And uh, and. So many of these, like if you found yourself listening to this and nodding and going like, oh yeah, that makes sense. That's because you already knew it,
not because It's
some brand new thing. And so remember, give yourself credit like you're amazing and you just, sometimes we just need to remind each other of these things. So thank you for everything that you reminded us of today.
Thank you, Kate.
Thank you.
for this podcast. Keep
going. Thank you so much.
it's it's definitely an anchor for me and I don't know what I would do without it at this
point either, so
thank
you, .
I appreciate that so much.
Beth has brought a lot of really important. Magic into my life. not least of which is the almost constant reminder that we can't always be in a season of growth. Incorporating Beth's teachings into my day-to-day rituals and routines and habits truly has had a profound. Impact on how I run my life. It's made it much more sustainable. And I love that Beth reminds us in this episode.
That every month. Is a chance to start again. And in fact, every day is a chance to start again. I know this time of year can seem. You know, ripe with potential and possibility. And we want to just have a brand new, clean slate and conquer the world with all of our hopes and dreams. And that's wonderful energy. But truly being compassionate with ourselves and gentle with ourselves means acknowledging that there are going to be times on the journey where we need to rest and there are going to be other times on the journey when we need to release and let go. And there are going to be other times in the journey when we need to revisit our big plan and tweak it a little bit.
Maybe we didn't, we don't want to be going where we thought we wanted to be going. And that's okay too.
And having this set of rituals that we build into our lives for ourselves tapping into the cycles of the moon, remind us. When it's time for bright, full moon energy. And when it's time for waning energy, more inward focused energy. And how to make room for all of it. So if you take one thing from this episode today, I hope.
It's the inspiration that if you're going to make one lasting new years, Quote resolution this year. That it be to receive her offering about the new moon rituals and commit to doing them with yourself every month.
Put them in your calendar today. She's given you the dates. Put them in your calendar today and make time for yourself to do the exercises she gave us. on those new moons. And then to have faith. To have faith that it's all unfolding exactly as it should.
The next activating intuition and creativity workshop takes place online on January 25th. Everything you need to know to sign up for that is on Kate Sheppard, creative.com. If you're a Patriot and colorful community member admission to that workshop is always included in your membership. And even if you're not ready to join at that level.
it takes a lot to put together this show. And I really rely on the support of my Patriots. So even if you need to join at.
One of the more introductory levels please know that I appreciate every single dollar that comes in every month to help me keep the lights on and the mic on.
And I work hard to create content to make it. , of great value to you. So I hope you'll consider signing up for a Patrion membership this year.
So that I can keep creating all of this beautiful content for you and others.
I hope to see you on January 25th and the live workshop. And for now take care of yourself. And have faith.
Part 1 (Ep. 55. Dec 22) Embracing Transformation: Crafting Year-End Rituals for a Purposeful New Year focuses on how to harness the power of ritual to close out 2023. In this conversation, Megan Sheldon and Kate Shepherd discuss the power of ritual and ceremony in closing the year and setting intentions for the new year. Megan offers practical ways to invite ritual into your life to integrate the past and move forward with clarity and openness.
Part 2 (Ep. 56. Jan 5th) Lunar Alchemy: Cultivating opportunities for Growth with Intention will be released in January. Moon Cycle Coach Beth Suter (episode 11) will guide us through a set of rituals we can turn into habits for aligning with the rhythms of the moon to grow in our lives with intention and clarity.
Megan Sheldon, a ritual and ceremony expert, joins us for a deep dive into the significance and transformative power of year-end rituals for acknowledging emotions and shaping intentions for what is to come. We chat about the profound opportunity this time of year presents for bridging the past while embracing clarity and openness for the year ahead.
In this conversation, Megan Sheldon, Founder of Be Ceremonial, discusses the importance of ritual and ceremony in personal growth and reflection. She shares her journey to becoming a life cycle celebrant and the inspiration behind launching Be Ceremonial.
Megan emphasizes the potency of end-of-year rituals and the role they play in acknowledging and processing emotions. She encourages listeners to choose a word for the year and offers guidance on creating their own closing ceremony. Megan also highlights the community aspect of ritual and the power of coming together to share and witness each other's experiences.
In this conversation, Megan Sheldon and Kate Shepherd discuss the power of ritual and ceremony in closing the year and setting intentions for the new year. They explore the importance of personalized ceremonies and the role of ritual in fostering connection and vulnerability. They emphasize the significance of embracing the present moment and reflect on the past year to gain insights and choose words of guidance.
Megan introduces the Be Ceremonial app, which offers a variety of rituals and ceremonies for different life events. They highlight the transformative potential of rituals and the importance of building a community of ceremony seekers.
This episode is packed with specific information about how rituals make up ceremonies and how to create your own. She offers us four rituals each rooted in one of the four elements (Fire, Water, Air & Earth) and walks us through a ceremonies that are immensely supportive for navigating the complexities of time of year to help us with everything from how to simultaneously hold two polarities like grief and joy (Two-Sided Coin) to how to let go of specific difficult events from the past year (The Calendar Burn, and The Release Boat)
She shares the beautiful ritual she does with her husband (that you could also do with a friend or sister) on the last day of each year that helps her both stay deeply connected with him and herself and her goals and dreams.
She gives us a simple yet powerful prompt for something to reflect upon over the next couple of weeks to help us prepare to close out the year.
She also provides us questions to contemplate now, in advance of our actual end of year rituals and ceremonies that will make them that much more potent.
This episode is POWERFUL support for bringing more intention and presence into your life in a living, breathing way. I am not exaggerating when I say that this episode could change your entire life.
The other day, I took Maggie, my sweet rescue pup, for our usual stroll in the nearby forest. The trails were their usual brand of magical, the fog lending an ethereal touch to the day.
As I meandered through my cherished trails, surrounded by trees with moss dripping from their dewy branches, and the gentle symphony of the nearby river, I had a moment of profound appreciation. This place has become my sanctuary, where I can simply exist and revel in the splendor of nature.
Lately, I've found myself grappling with a whirlwind of emotions. The daily routines, the holiday rush, and the weight of global events have left me feeling a bit overwhelmed.
Yesterday's walk was particularly poignant. The rain mirrored my emotions, pouring down as I wrestled with feelings of frustration and a sense of being lost amidst the holiday chaos and maybe even life itself.
As the the rain kept falling, the trees kept treeing. The dog kept running. And I without having to really think about it, kept putting one foot in front of the other. I realized, it's okay to have days when everything feels a bit out of sync. So right there, in the midst of all these ordinary miracles; mushrooms growing underfoot, the ancient, stoic trees effortlessly sustaining all our lives, and the relentless rushing of water (how does the river always seem to know exactly where it is going? And with such purpose?) I allowed myself to have a good cry amidst it all. I let it all out. And not surprisingly, it did. It served as a gentle reminder that none of us have it all together, no matter how it might seem on the surface.
The other night, I had this dream about meeting Ellen DeGeneres. When I sat with it I was able to decode a pretty beautiful message from this dream. I talk about it inside this episode. Have a listen when you have 15 mins. (And if you know Ellen, please send her a note that I would love to talk to her on Creative Genius!)
There's an incredible two-part series—starting on December 22 - the first one is about closing out the year with meaningful rituals and intentions, with another one two weeks later with invaluable insights for making 2024 a stellar year. Make sure you are tuned in for those.
And if you hadn't heard, I'm hosting a special event on January 1st called "Liminal Lights." It's all about bidding adieu to 2023's baggage and setting intentions for the new year. I have a strong feeling it's going to be an incredibly powerful experience. Sign up below.
I want to remind you that it's perfectly fine not to have everything figured out. Life's journey is messy, but within that chaos lies a beautiful path of growth and discovery. We're all navigating this journey together, embracing the twists and turns as best we can.
Take good care of yourself, and let's catch up soon. Sending you loads of positive energy your way!
xoxo
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For over two decades, I've lived and worked nestled within the breathtaking landscapes of British Columbia's beautiful coastlines, infusing every piece of art and jewelry I've created with a touch of the magic that has been woven into my soul by living in such a truly majestic place. With years of experience and a keen sense of what truly resonates as heartfelt gifts during the holiday season, I'm excited to reveal my top picks for this year's celebrations.
Leading the collection are the iconic Fern Earrings, as spotted adorning the cast of Showtime's mesmerizing series, Yellowjackets. Beyond their celebrity association, each delicate leaf tells a tale of intricate craftsmanship, mirroring the resilience and allure found in nature itself.
In the realm of wearable enchantments, the Nurtured Pendants also featured on Yellowjackets, worn by the beautiful Simone Kessell who plays Lottie in the series. These pieces encapsulate a tangible piece of that ethereal wonder. Infused with love, each necklace cradles a hand-cut crystal, that I selected myself for its otherworldly qualities and transformed into a talisman carrying the very essence of the earth's most treasured gifts.
Then, there are the timeless Cedar Collection—earrings and pendants crafted with finesse to embody the essence of the mighty cedar that come in three sizes - one perfect for everyone. This collection evokes the comforting aroma and strength of cedar, inviting wearers to embrace a sense of groundedness and tranquility.
However, among these extraordinary offerings, might be the sought-after Pebblebelly Pendants that I create. These hold a certain unparalleled allure.
Sourced from beaches where orcas frolic and dance against smooth ocean pebbles, these pendants really do bring to life a tangible sense of that ethereal wonder one feels standing on these beaches. Crafted with love, each necklace cradles an actual pebble I have thoughtfully gathered. Each year I collect a small handful of these pebbles - no more than I can carry in only two hands for this collection. I conduct a beautiful ritual of asking the beach and the stones permission to take the stones to turn them into these one-of-a-kind treasures that stand as a testament to our capacity to truly commune with the elements.
The rarity of these handmade treasures lies not just in their craftsmanship but also in their scarcity. Often commanding waitlists and swiftly finding new homes once released, they have become living symbols of reverence for the sea.
Approaching the holiday season, these artisanal gifts offer more than mere material value; they resonate with emotions, tell stories, and forge a connection to nature's essence. Whether gifted to a loved one or cherished as a personal indulgence, these creations bear the essence of my artistic journey, making them truly timeless and cherished gifts.
In a world abuzz with fleeting trends, these offerings stand as testaments to enduring artistry and heartfelt craftsmanship—testifying to my steadfast commitment to capturing moments of wonder and beauty in wearable forms.
For those seeking to infuse a touch of ethereal magic or capture the essence of nature's grace, these artisanal creations provide an exquisite means to celebrate the spirit of the season and beyond.
FEATURES & BENEFITS🌍 One of a kind - My work is meticulously handcrafted and each one is as unique as your own fingerprints. 🌟 Ethically Handmade - Sustainable and utterly one-of-a-kind, my jewelry is more than an adornment—it's a statement of your values. 🌿 Connecting you to Nature - From forest-inspired earrings to seashell pendants, my pieces carry the magic of nature so you can have it with you wherever you go. 💫 Wearable comfort, exceptional quality, and timeless elegance — I designed this jewelry to be your everyday companion. 🌊 Water-resistant for your adventures, meticulously crafted for durability, and meant to be passed down for generations. 🌟 Unmatched Versatility - Equally at home with a pair of jeans as with a wedding dress, this is stuff that adapts effortlessly to your style. 🌿 Easy Care—Organic textures lend themselves well to natural patinas, these pieces get better and better with time. 🔍 Durable & Lasting—Rigorously tested for durability, each piece is a guarantee of longevity. Invest in jewelry meant to stand the test of time. |
As we approach the culmination of another trip around the sun, there’s a palpable sense of transition in the air. The end of one year and the start of another beckons us to reflect, release, and welcome new beginnings. It’s a time when many of us find solace in rituals that honour this transition, seeking to embrace the past and set intentions for the future.
Rituals at Year's End:
The end of the year often calls for reflection—a moment to pause and acknowledge the journey we’ve traveled. Whether through journaling, meditation, or simply sitting in quiet contemplation, this ritual invites us to sift through our experiences, acknowledging achievements, challenges, and the lessons learned along the way.
It’s also a time for letting go. We shed what no longer serves us, bid farewell to habits, relationships, or mindsets that hinder our growth, making space for new opportunities and fresh perspectives.
Embracing New Beginnings:
Welcoming the new year is like opening a brand-new chapter in the book of life. Many of us engage in rituals that symbolize hope, renewal, and setting intentions for the days to come. From creating vision boards to setting resolutions, there’s a sense of excitement in the air—a collective willingness to embrace change and chart a course toward our aspirations.
The Power of Community and Intention:
Amidst these age-old rituals lies a wonderful opportunity—an event that encapsulates the essence of this transition. On January 1st, I am hosting an online gathering, a space designed for reflection, release, and setting intentions for the upcoming year.
This event isn’t just about individual rituals; it’s about coming together as a supportive and inclusive community. Through an oracle card reading and a guided meditation, we’ll tap into our intuition and creativity, setting the stage for a word that’ll guide us through 2024.
But here’s what truly makes this gathering special: the communal sharing. There’s immense power in speaking our intentions aloud, in a space where everyone’s journey is respected and celebrated. It’s an opportunity to connect with kindred spirits, to share our hopes and aspirations for the year ahead, fostering a sense of belonging and support.
Honouring the Transition Together:
As we bid farewell to 2023 and step into the uncharted territory of 2024, this event serves as a beacon—a way to honour the rituals of the year’s end and the promise of new beginnings. It’s a chance to weave our individual intentions into a collective tapestry of positivity and growth.
Join us in this transformative experience, where we honour the past, set intentions for the future, and embrace the magic of transition in a supportive and inclusive environment.
Secure your spot on our website and let’s embark on this beautiful journey together.
Here’s to honouring the transition and embracing the endless possibilities of the new year!
To keep this intimate and grounded, I am limiting this to a small number of participants. So sign up right away!
With all my heart I hope I get to see you there,
What - Reflect, release, and set intentions for the upcoming year. Guided meditation, oracle card reading & community share.
When - January 1, 2024 1pm Pacific time
Where - Online (event link will be sent when you've registered)
Spots are limited for this intimate and connected experience.
In this episode we explore the transformative power of reconnecting with intuition, unlocking the secrets to artistic mastery through connecting with your inner child, and the profound impact of bravely following one's artistic impulses.
Artist Andrew Faulkner candidly shares his journey—from the creative doubts that plagued him even when his work was being published in The Wall Street Journal, The New York Times, The Los Angeles Times & The Washington Post to embracing the profound magic of honest, childlike expression in his artwork. This conversation offers practical wisdom on navigating creative blocks, embracing continuity in your work, and understanding the true essence of intuition beyond stereotypes and promises to reignite your passion for creativity and your sense of what is possible.
Discipline and Continuity: Crafting work with a cohesive narrative for deeper resonance.
Intuition Unveiled: Understanding intuition beyond stereotypes and cultivating its role in creativity.
Artistic Practices: Embracing digital media, dealing with creative blocks, and facing fears.
Childlike Expression: Balancing mastery with honest, childlike artistic expression.
Community and Sharing Secrets: The importance of community and sharing trade secrets in the creative process.
Finding Inspiration: Environmental influences, invented color spaces, and the Northern California influence.
Overcoming Challenges: Tackling creative block, fear, and unworthiness in the art world.
Art’s Role in Society: Reconnecting with healthy creative expression for personal and societal growth.
The Artist's Journey: Doubts and Discoveries
Discipline, Continuity, and Deeper Resonance
We delved into the significance of discipline and crafting work with continuity for a more profound connection with our audience. Andrew's insights on creating a cohesive narrative in our artwork are inspiring food for thought.
Unveiling Intuition: Beyond Stereotypes
In our conversation we challenge stereotypes surrounding intuition, emphasizing its role in artistic processes and have an honest conversation about what intuition IS and IS NOT. Andrew's perspective on understanding and cultivating intuition beyond conventional notions provides a refreshing take on creative inspiration and I think will really inspire you.
Embracing Creative Practices: Overcoming Blocks and Fears
From integrating digital tools to facing creative blocks and overcoming fears, Andrew's experiences offer practical advice for artists navigating the challenges of the creative process.
A Call to Reconnect with Creativity
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Kate Shepherd: welcome Andrew.
Andrew Faulkner: thanks so much for having me. I, admire what you do because artists live such an insulated life to be able to share these thoughts it's a great comfort to me. So thank you for having me to be able to share a little bit of my story.
Kate Shepherd: part of why I originally started this show was because as an artist myself the public for many years, would often be met with this You probably have this with, with dealing with clients sometimes this sort of like, oh, I wish I could, I wish I could be an artist. I wish
I could, you know, I wish I had that in me. I'm just not creative. And for a long time it made me really sad
Andrew Faulkner: Mm-Hmm.
Kate Shepherd: I sat with it. I was like, what is that about?
Why do I have such a reaction to that moment? 'cause it makes me feel really uncomfortable.
I don't really know how to deal with it. And after years of sitting with it, what I finally came to was realizing that wish that that person was having was actually creativity, trying to talk to them, saying, hello,
Andrew Faulkner: Right.
Kate Shepherd: I'm right here.
You wouldn't wish for me if
I wasn't inside you.
Andrew Faulkner: they want permission. to do it too. And maybe permission from an artist would give them that open door.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. And really, I mean, I remember the day that I said, you know what? Screw it. I'm gonna call myself an artist. I didn't finish the degree, I didn't do all the things that all the gatekeepers want me to do to be able to say that I have this fancy title artist. can I really just give it to myself?
Like I remember the
day where I thought that and did it, and there was just no looking back.
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah. Oh. I think there's a lot of pressure from society not to become an artist, and so I think a lot of artists deal with that in different ways. Some people are. Nonplussed by that, and they just do their own thing. They just are so passionate they can't do anything else. I, I have not been that person. I have had a creative spark in me forever, but on thought about practicalities of, you know, how am I gonna my college degree?
And, and, you know, I didn't need to make money. And, which is all, that's just life. I admire that have that burning passion, that they can't do anything else. And now I've kind of developed that because I got on this role and now I feel like I can't do anything else but art. uh, I'm doing what I was meant to do.
Kate Shepherd: Maybe just for the listeners who don't know who you are yet, what kind of artist are you now and how did you get there? What was your path in?
Andrew Faulkner: I am a abstract landscape artist and it, it kind of varies from representational to very abstract my work. a lot of people would say I'm a colorist because color really how I see. Landscape and painted work, and it's very important to me, and it's not always the same color, but it's, it's always kind of the, the lead actor in my work.
Kate Shepherd: You work with galleries, you are a successful
and established artist, and it's, it's, it's happening, so
to speak. wHat are the obstacles, self-imposed or otherwise, you know, a lot of them are given to us
by .The culture around us that stopped you for a little while. what was your journey? How did you get to where you are today with your art?
Andrew Faulkner: I did study painting. I went to a liberal arts college, in Connecticut, Trinity College. had a, a good art department with, brutish. Evil head of the department who ended up kind of torturing me but I had some natural talent and was kind of resting on my laurels.
So there was some justification for him pushing me harder. I, I just wasn't good enough to meet the standards of this very strict, art professor. And so I graduated with a degree in fine art, which, you know, had the requirements of art history, printmaking, drawing, color design, painting, mostly painting, And fortunately I had done summer internships drafting for architects. So I had sort of a marketable skill . And when I graduated I got, a job in Cambridge, Massachusetts, drafting for a large architecture firm. And that was, I. Good For me, it was sort of production work. It was being around creative things.
my dad was an architect and grandfather, uncle, brother, all architects. So I have that kind of in my blood too. And you might see some of that structural thinking in underneath my messy paintings. but that was kind of the beginning of my creative journey where it was . It was creative to a point, but it was very much producing other people's work and just kind of finding my way in the world and not really knowing exactly where it would lead, but, being a full-time artist was never really an option to me.
and for a lot of people my age, it just wasn't an option.
Kate Shepherd: I hear that a lot from people. I, I had somebody on the show last season who, is a, a writer and a TV producer and for many years she worked as an assistant director on sets of huge movies and with big stars and, but she was always bringing other people's work to life and she had a really similar story of what that eventually what you realize is. I actually don't. This is great. It's pays the bills, but there's, I have
something to say underneath this. was there a particular experience or phase or time in your life when you were starting to realize that, that you can remember looking back? Oh
Andrew Faulkner: I started, I started doing design for magazines and doing some illustration work kind of on the side this was I think the time of email . I got a postcard from an illustrator who was quite well known, who I really liked, and he saw one of my illustrations and he's like, what the fuck, dude?
is awesome. Why aren't you doing this? And and I just thought it was, I was just lucky to have this little spot illustration in a magazine and. I just sort of thought, Hmm, maybe I could do this. so I started doing more illustration actually sort of became a thing for a while.
Um. When I, I started my own graphic design business and I was also doing illustration and I ended up doing work for the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal and LA Times and a lot of big papers. and that made me feel like I had something creative to share and, um, still I think. Being a painter wasn't really on the table, I also, there's something I like about problem solving.
You know, as a graphic designer, you're a problem solver, and so when someone calls you for an idea for an illustration, I. A good art director won't tell you what to do, but they'll say, here's the story, read it. We'd love to see something in your style. and, you know, just make it clever kind of thing.
And um, so I've always kinda liked that and sometimes I'll even self assign myself a series, with, you know, sort of an assignment that I'm solving.
Kate Shepherd: Like currently with your landscapes? You mean
like you'll, So, tell me more about that. What does that look like?
Andrew Faulkner: well. I am currently developing a series of work for a show I have at Pamela Walsh Gallery in Palo Alto called Electric Light. I am always influenced by many artists, but for color, . I really love the work of Richard Mayhew and Wolf Con. Those are two of my favorite kind of wild colorist artists, and they use almost neon color in some parts of their painting, and then in contrast to some subdued color. But, had done a couple of pieces, landscapes that using pinks and violets and, and neon greens, you know, as part of the palette I loved them, but they weren't for everybody kind of thing. 'cause it's like you kind of have to wear sunglasses to look at them. but, I started to think that this could be a really exciting series landscapes. just looking at the palette and looking at, . How we can inject this recognizable electricity into a landscape that, you know, still looks like me, but it's sort of like you've got blacklight posters on in the background kind of thing.
So, that has been interesting because each new piece that I do, I have to make it. mesh with all the rest in some way. It has to have that note. It could be just a, a dark painting with dark purples, but then like a bright pink splash of light along the horizon or something like that. So, um, that's been interesting.
Stay.
Kate Shepherd:
One of my many callings in life is to do jewelry. So I'm a silversmith and I would be in Granville Island public market, which is like the heart of art in Vancouver. It's the biggest tourist attraction, and I think 11 million people come through there every year trying to buy art and buy something Canadian. It was one of my, I think it was my, one of my first years in that market. And, this European gentleman came up to my table and took, you know, he was very thoughtful. He looked at all my work and at the end he said, congratulations, there's beautiful continuity here.
Andrew Faulkner: Wow.
Kate Shepherd: And I realized that, that that is actually an important thing when you're creating a body of work. I was doing it intuitively. 'cause I think I just jet, I, I I, I know the feeling of needing that harmony of that continuity, but is that a challenge, do you think? Has that been a challenge for you to Mm-Hmm.
Andrew Faulkner: It is, it's a challenge I've given myself because my work without that can go be all over the place. Like especially for a show I'm a little bit deficit, you know, in terms of like what I'm excited to paint, so I might . Walk in and see some flowers and I'm a landscape painter, but I wanna paint a still life, you know, or, or whatever, you know.
And and I think it's great to explore, but then I always appreciate shows where you have that continuity. You can see that there's a thought out. It's almost like a thesis, you know, like, I believe X and here's what came out of it.
Kate Shepherd:
I feel like that even just in my own, I mean, I sculpt, I paint,
I weave, I make jewelry.
I, I, can't stop myself from doing all those things. And even in my painting. There're these, there was a series of paintings that came out of me earlier this summer that I was like, I, they brought me to tears.
I was like, these are the paintings I was meant to do my whole life.
Here they are. They're finally here. I was waiting, you know, waiting for you. And then the next week I'm like, oh, but now I need to paint owls and like, it's all I could do. Like, what?
So even I think as we. As we, I, and I feel like we're sort of, um, servants to the intelligence of creativity or the energy of creativity.
Like it's this force that wants to move through us and in order to serve it, I do think sometimes we have to put ourselves in a particular channel, right? And that's kind of like,
today we're doing
this so that I can serve that energy
better. I.
can't do it if I'm all trying to do all the different things at the same time.
Andrew Faulkner: I, I agree and I think that, you know, having these shows brings focus to my work that then I can. Take with me for other works if you have to really look hard at things over and over again, then you can make progress. And I tend to paint so intuitively that I'm not even necessarily, I, I will do a sketch to begin with, but then I'm just, my mind turns off and I'm just like,
throwing paint at the canvas and, and just, I'm going on this journey and seeing where it takes me kind of thing.
Kate Shepherd: Tell us a little bit more about that. I feel like intuition, I mean, I teach a whole course on how to activate intuition so that you can, not only in your artwork, but so that you can live an, an easier life.
Because when you're tapped into intuition, it's really, it is magic. And again, so many of us are like, well, I don't have that in me, I'm so glad you brought it up when you're in your studio. What is your relationship with intuition? How does it speak to you? How do you hear it? How do you feel it? How
do you respond to it and, and what is your relationship with it
look like and feel like
Andrew Faulkner: I rely on it because, uh, even though I've had academic . training. I've forgotten a lot of it.
Kate Shepherd: that's probably for the
Andrew Faulkner: yeah, in terms of, you know, I know what a color wheel is, but I don't always know like, what's the opposite of this color or whatever. I, I just, I'm not thinking in those terms. admire people who really have a handle on that, but My intuition has served me so well that I rely on it. I don't hear a voice. I almost see the color being applied. Like I'm looking at my painting, what does it need, and it's, like a typo or something. It's, it's something that sticks out and also just knowing, because I work in oils, I can always paint over and over and all of that history, just texture looks better and better that I'm just not afraid of making mistakes. a lot of trial and error. I do my sketches, digitally with a, a tablet and a,
a software program. As a regular sketching practice. you can't really make mistakes, but first of all, you can command Z and go back 10 steps if you want, but also you can, instead of buying a whole
Huge tube of pink magenta. You know, you can just take big blob of that color and put it all the way across your painting and see what happens. You know, and, and tho
those kinds of risk taking have taught me that I need to do that with my analog work too. And My digital painting has informed my oil painting.
Kate Shepherd: The digital feels freer. It's like a playground to, I love how you, described it as being almost like a, something's off, like a typo or something.
' cause often that, that's how I relate to my own intuition. I'll I'll, be I'll be like, listen I listen, I need to make this decision about. I mean, it could be something big like, do I take this job or not? Or small, like, do I wanna go out for dinner with this friend tonight or not? I have to make a decision.
And, and I'll, ask myself like, does it, does that feel right? Okay. I've, I'm picturing myself going to the restaurant.
No, it actually doesn't feel right. And it's a be, it's a feeling of like something is off or not less than. 'cause I think a lot of people think, oh, well, once you're tapped into intuition, it's just this like, oh, this channel of information comes down to you and you just hear
this voice telling you what to do. It isn't like that
it's a lot more like feeling around in the dark. Is it this is it this is it this. And you get the ding, ding, ding yeses, and you get the, Hmm, no. Not so much. Is that, that sounds like that's true
Andrew Faulkner: Yes. Yeah, that is true for me. And it's, you know, it, it's varying degrees of obviousness, so sometimes it's like a typo. Sometimes it's like, there's something in this area. I don't know what it is, I'm just gonna try something else. And, you know, green doesn't really go here, but I'm gonna do it anyway and see what happens.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah, because then then you'll get more informa. Every step you take you, the feedback is more, you get more information and so
then you then, oh, that was the wrong step. That's still information.
Andrew Faulkner: yeah. yeah, and, and sometimes like in my work, I'll see like a little sliver of this ugly avocado color that was left there, you know, and against the other colors. It's beautiful. But it was like the worst color I've ever mixed
Kate Shepherd: there on purpose
Andrew Faulkner: no,
Kate Shepherd: it's perfectly there. Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, I love those moments
too. I believe that creativity is the intelligence that's animating the entire universe. So it's the same thing
that is telling a pine cone a. When and how to open and release its seeds is the same thing that is giving you those little yeses and nos and nudges when you're in your studio or at your canvas
or at your typewriter or in the music studio or wherever you are as an artist or creative person in the world. And I also see that we've cut ourselves off from expressing this. Intelligence and it feels like a
channel of energy. It's trying to move through us. And I mean, I, I've even kind of gone as far as to say that I think that's why humanity, I say we're glitching. I
say humanity's, glitching because we've become disconnected from this.
Like we're, the rational mind is running the show and we're going in circles and it's not a very comfortable or nice circle either.
Andrew Faulkner: I learned to draw from my dad when I was, six or seven we had a, country house in Virginia. We, we lived in the city and my parents remodeled an old barn in Virginia that we had no . tv, just radio, no phones.
You know, and I'm one of five kids, so the whole family really got away for the whole summer or for long weekends and it was boring for a long time. But you know, then you have to look around like what is there to do. And so I saw my dad drawing and he saw architect and did beautiful large drawings of objects and this and that.
And so I was like, okay, well there's nothing else to do. I'm gonna. Draw , and that's how I, I wouldn't have learned to draw otherwise because there was no technology, there's no TV or anything. We could listen to radio. That was pretty exciting. And I mean, this wasn't in the twenties either. This was in the, in seventies.
So, I think my parents deliberately wanted to take us away from it all and
slow things down. And everything is so fast now. So I think I. There's still a lot of creativity I see with young people and it's exciting, but I just wonder if they're hampered at all. if it's just more of a stretch to go get a sketch pad and some
colors and stuff.
Kate Shepherd: I agree with you, there's lots of different ways that creativity can come out. and I think, I mean, it happens whenever generations start to split. You see the split between this one and the next one. And I can't do TikTok videos the way that people even 10 years younger than me
Andrew Faulkner: Mm-Hmm.
Kate Shepherd: or even want to, like, I
actually have no desire to do that. But I think that the underneath it, the question that I'm asking is more about this thing that we do where we self-select out of having this gift, Because I feel like that intelligence that's animating the universe, that's, you know, painting through you and making little tomato seeds sprout over there and like this, there's, it's an aliveness.
There's this thing that's trying to happen and when we cut ourselves off from it, experience pain. And I actually believe that that's the main source of. Over consumption, depression, conflict like that is really the root cause
of, is that we've denied ourselves that we have this magical, radiant, ineffable, wordless, but very real thing inside of us.
how can we empower people to remember. That actually you have this, this thing inside of you, and it doesn't have to look the way so and so down the street says it should look and I decided before we went into this year that I wanted it to be about learning to see. That's kind
of the overarching theme
of the show. I love how you can look at that from a perspective of learning to draw, like
when you're drawing, you know, your brain wants to do the easiest and then, but it's not accurate at all when you
actually sit down and really look at what your subject matter is.
Oh, oh, I see how that, okay. You have to teach yourself how to do that.
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: also Think you have to teach yourself how to do that when it comes to seeing yourself as a creative being. what does that, what does that bring up for you?
Andrew Faulkner: Well, I was thinking about, the creative seeds within everybody and how, how do they sprout and then also about learning to see, I think it starts with education at a young age. You know, my wife taught third grade for 30 years, and now the funding for arts is getting really, I don't know how it is in Canada, but really going way down.
we gotta get people when they're young And then also learning to see, I think that opportunities in communities to see art it's studios or galleries or whatever that teaches people how to see. And that I think that can engender creativity from within.
Kate Shepherd: I mentioned to you, I think before we were recording, how your work literally stops me in my tracks every time I'm scrolling through Instagram and there's one of Andrew's posts that like, what? And obviously you have a, you know, you're in galleries and your work is doing quite well.
obviously I'm not the only one who has that experience with your work. What do you think, what do you think that is? What do you think people are drawn to
about your work? What makes it special and different?
Andrew Faulkner: Wow. So I don't think I've been asked that I'm very in touch with the child within me, I feel people can relate to that. So
a lot of my work is . Kind of a riot of color and very loose strokes, and also sometimes very paired down in terms of like number of objects and fields of color. I think those kinds of things appeal to people. The, the simplicity, color. Everyone says, I love your palette, but my palette always changes, so I don't know. I love your colors, and I'm not sure because it, it's always changing, but I think that I use very rich and dynamic color, so maybe that's what grabs people.
And on Instagram, you've got, you know, a two, three inch square or scroll through so you don't have much, uh, . Opportunity for nuance. So I think maybe the hit you over the head work gets more attention. I don't know. What
do
Kate Shepherd: Yeah, maybe I, I don't know. Well, it, it is, it's your use of color,
I would say. 'cause I have noticed that about your palette too. It does. It's not, it is very dynamic. I think it is your use of color, and I think there's a certain magic that happens when you have your level of mastery with understanding intuitively color and composition and all of the elements, all of the kind of like academic elements that go into art. But when that's. evenly Paired with this joyful, childlike honest expression. I think that's when real magic can happen, and that's I think why we say you do have to learn the skills, like you
can't just. You know, decide I wanna become an abstract artist and start throwing paint at the
canvas. and and you wonder why, why aren't people reacting to it the way that they are to Andrew's work?
Well, 'cause there's a whole lifetime of, of invisible things that are informing that, um, that seem very simple, but are actually very, very nuanced. And, and I think it's a, it's a great achievement to, to have stayed with your practice long enough to be able to create work like that.
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah, I, I'm excited to be doing what . I'm doing a, after working for architects and magazines, I started my own design studio in San Rafael, California. And, I had a design studio for 30 years, worked with. A lot of tech companies, including Adobe, and that was very creative and fun work.
But I was still doing drawing and painting kind of in my free time. I took a, a work workshop with Nicholas Wilton. I don't know, do you know his
work? That was about eight years ago. I took a week workshop with him in Hawaii and that sort of changed my life.
I had a lot of people on the trip saying, you've gotta quit your job, . You gotta do this. And they kind of pushed me along, to make this decision to just go full-time stayed friends with them all and some of whom I'm working in the same studio in Sausalito with.
Kate Shepherd: Community is so important.
I think that's, you know, there's a, there's this mis misguided belief that as artists we need to be independent, sometimes people think You need to even guard your techniques and your
secrets and it just, you all, you know, you have to be this like, and it's, it couldn't be
Andrew Faulkner: it's. it's.
the opposite. It really is. I try to share as much as I can because, you know, other people have done that for me. And, uh, that's, that's really how it works.
Kate Shepherd: the person listening to this who's, maybe considering stepping into more of a Career of being an artist, full-time. That's one of the first things I would say. I don't, it sounds like you're
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah,
Kate Shepherd: same thing, but like find your people.
Andrew Faulkner: find your people. I was working on my kitchen table before I got a little shared studio at mean, I had . Tiny little corner of the room to work in, but I just started one day a week and that's how I met other artists and eventually found a full studio and kind of worked up from there.
I wasn't sure I would ever take this plunge, I think it was the community that got me to do it.
Kate Shepherd: I wanted to go back to something you said a minute ago about I, I can't remember exactly the way you worded it, but it was about this child that you have inside of you,
, is that something that you've kept alive since you were a kid? Is that something that you went back and brought back to life? How? Because not everybody wants that, but
not everybody has it.
Andrew Faulkner: I've been very serious on this podcast, but I'm actually quite the jokester and very silly. So, um, that's a part of my childhood that I've never to shake, um,
Kate Shepherd: Good
Andrew Faulkner: and, and, um, and I love kids art too. I mean, I just love
it. It's just . Master work my wife who taught grade for 30 years would bring home this work and I would just go nuts loving it.
I just connect with it. I see something in my own work that's either random and off kilter. I might like it more, or if I see edges that are too straight and uniform, then I'll change it, I do a lot of scribbling on my work. you look carefully, of my paintings have a little stick figure chair etched into them, and it looks like a kid,
Drew it on, one time I had a show at, uh, Carlton at Lake Tahoe, and the manager of the hotel contacted me and said, I'm so sorry.
But it looks like a child has drawn with graphite a chair on your painting, and we are so sorry. We will pay for it. We will repair it and whatever.
and they hadn't noticed it was there in the beginning. I said, don't worry. That's part of the painting. So.
Kate Shepherd: Is that a nod to your, we can call it your inner child, I guess, if we want, but is that a nod to that part of you,
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah. And a little bit to my dad. He, he was an architect and then he had a furniture design studio for the last 10 years of his life. And, uh, we always seemed to have, my mom was an interior designer. We always seemed to have some Italian chair that she had ordered and couldn't return to Italy, so it didn't go with anything, but it would be in the house for whatever reason.
So I've always liked chairs, so
Kate Shepherd: I love that.
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: Can you remember a time when you had, inner vision, maybe not a visual, but a, but like a, an inkling of work you wanted to create, but you didn't have the skills yet, the in on the ground
skills yet to create it, and what, what that experience was like for you,
Andrew Faulkner: well, I always have that . I, I,
I think, yeah, I mean, I always have that. I think wouldn't it be great to do this one? One thing I struggle with is the human figure and putting figures in my drawing and, and my paintings, and it's kind of a signature. My landscapes are sort of simple and barren and open, and they're void of figures, which is good in a way because you're focusing on
It's an abstract and you're not like focusing on representation. but I love, like diebenkorn's figures, for example, in his, some of his work integrated. And so every once in a while I'll challenge myself and I'll add a figure into a piece. And sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But, I'm a, I'm definitely a lifetime learner.
Like I. Still watch videos of other artists, uh, demoing things. a couple years ago I got a critique. I don't know if you know an artist, Brian Sindle,
his work is beautiful. He does these really moody landscapes that are, a limited color palette, but beautiful.
I saw that he offered critiques for like $200 to critique your work. And what he does is he'll, he'll look through your website. And then he'll give you feedback. And, and so I, I kind of, I was at a point where I just, I kind of wanted someone else, and especially someone I admired to just give me feedback.
And I get feedback from all the time. But it's different when you're showing someone a body of work and someone respect he really earned his $200. He didn't know that I was like, already showing in galleries and selling my work pretty well. And so he was kind of harsh because my work is so different than his, he's like, well, I'm not sure I can even do this 'cause I'm not sure.
Like I. What I'm looking at here and what you want me to do and et cetera, et I'm like, okay, well, um, think about it. And, anyway, he thought about it and then he came back. He's like, I, I think I've got some advice for you. And so he, came back and he, he asked permission if he could use Photoshop to paint out and simplify certain areas on some of my , which I think some parts would be horrified by, but I thought.
It was a cool idea and I was up, I was up for it he gave me some great, feedback on certain pieces. But one advice really stuck to me is about harmonizing color. And he said, do you remember the old Reese's Peanut Buttercup? Ad on TV where it's, you got some peanut butter in my chocolate, or you got some chocolate in my peanut butter.
You may not have seen this, but I, I did. And he's like, I, you should put some peanut butter in your chocolate and some chocolate in your peanut butter basically mix a little bit of one color into all your other colors and that's gonna give you harmony. And that's improved my work. Immensely.
and that was only two and a half years ago or something.
Kate Shepherd: so how do you do that when you're sit, when you sit down and you're kind of squirting all your paints out, you'll take a little bit of one color and put it in everything, or what, what's your
Andrew Faulkner: yeah, well, um, it used to be, I, I, I teach a weekend workshop like three times a year, and I mix together something that I, I call sludge and it's got . Every color on the rainbow, it looks like a gray, but it's got, all the colors in it. , I, I go around and I put like a, tablespoon of sludge on everyone's palette and I ask them to just mix a little bit into all their colors, so then they've got harmony because all of their colors that they apply have a little bit of the other color
Kate Shepherd: But like a tiny little bit, it
Andrew Faulkner: tiny bit, yeah, and you can put more in some and less, I mean, you can end up with a big muddy painting if you overdo it, but
just a little bit. And in certain colors, like a light yellow, you want the tiniest bit 'cause it'll turn it into a green or another color. But for reds and browns and other colors, it really adds kind of an earthiness and a harmony to all your pieces.
Kate Shepherd: I feel like there's a wisdom in that that translates to sort of life itself, and I'm, I can't quite put my finger on it. What is the, what is the, what is the life lesson in that?
Andrew Faulkner: it has to do with harmony. So, I mean, you could be saying, you know, make up your mind, but listen to all ideas, to make a decision just be open. to
Kate Shepherd: Including everything.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, I really love that.
Andrew Faulkner: My Instead of less is more and more is more. Right?
Kate Shepherd: More is more. I've always, that's always been my philosophy
too., I wanted just talk to you about Creative Block.
creative block is something that all of us face.
we have different experiences with it. We have different relationships. Some people are horrified by it. Some people are relieved by it.
'cause it means
they get a break.
You know? what is your relationship with it? How do you experience it? What do you do about it when it happens?
Andrew Faulkner: I had that more when I was a designer. As a painter. I just, I'm lucky. I just, I. Almost never face that. and part of it is that I've been doing these digital paintings for 20 years, my, for personal work, I have 200 paintings that I want to actually paint as. A large oil.
So it's like there's always something. but if I'm hitting a, a dead end with a piece, I put it aside and start something new. when I was a designer for Creative Block, I would look at what other designers are doing and what I'm excited about. And sometimes that would inspire a design that wasn't a lookalike.
It would, it would start . As kind of a, a lookalike of another person's design. And then that was only the beginning. By the time I was done with it, it looked nothing like, you know what, what I was inspired by, and I do that with artwork too. I might, Not have a block that I don't know what to paint, but I might be at a crossroads with a painting where it's like, should I just paint over it?
Is it terrible or whatever, and I will get out my. Deepen corn, Hockney, Matisse books, you know, and I'll just look through. And then often something will be like, oh my God, I could do lily pads in the middle of this or something. Or look at that shimmer in that water. Like if I could do a shimmer with those crazy colors, know, that could really bring it back to life. and then it's like breadcrumbs, because I'll try that and it's like, that was stupid. That doesn't work. But, but it simplified everything else. And so if I paint over that, but I just change everything to these purples, then be great. So usually it's just doing something leads to doing something else,
Kate Shepherd: from where I sit listening to what you just said, the magic to me in that is this conversation that you're in with those other artists.
they're long gone,
but you're, but you're having an actual conversation with them through the work. And I just think that like, I get the goosebumps when I think about that. Like we're all part of this living, breathing song or ongoing conversation, and I just think it's, so
Andrew Faulkner: And they would love to know that that was happening in, you know, in the afterlife or whatever, you know, and. I won't be around forever, but what a nice thing to think that other people will have my work in their homes, like after I'm gone.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. And we never know. I think sometimes when we're alone in our studios. Especially for alone in our studios, we can think, well, what is, it doesn't, my work. Doesn't matter. It
doesn't, you know, but we don't have any way of really knowing the ripple effect that our, that our work can have in our own lives, but also space and time.
Yeah.
And we're responsible almost to those future people, to express what's in us
Andrew Faulkner: Well, yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it's talking about where you are in your life now, and, uh, so it's, in a way, it's a record of that.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
what do you, what do you get out of art? what does, as a soul and as a person with a deeply, you know, you're an awake person. You've, you've been in connection with this beautiful energy your whole life. It sounds like, you know, you're, you're, you're on, you're, you're,
switched on. what does making art give you, what do you get out of it?
Andrew Faulkner: It gives me a lot, actually. It gives me validation, I think I've known all my life that I have this in me and now I'm expressing that it gives me a form of expression for, whatever I'm going through in my life. it's a refuge, it's a place to express joy, and. a lot of fun and it lets me tap into that kid, I can, I revisit the kid every day, that's pretty amazing.
Kate Shepherd: That's pretty amazing. Yeah. I wanted to ask you if, if there was a specific project you worked on or a piece of artwork that had a particularly profound impact on you, either in the process of you creating it or when it was completed, or maybe even how you saw it impacting others, like, is there a particular experience you've had like that?
Andrew Faulkner: Yes, and I won't name names because you know, this is personal story, but I think that the family would be fine with me the story, had a visit during Covid from a woman who was battling cancer and she hadn't been out of the house for a year and she came with her husband both wearing double masks for a studio visit, and she said, this is the first time I've been outta my house, but your work really
Speaks to me and moves me, and I just really wanted to do this. I had put the air filter on and the windows open and I was just really complimented that she would wanna come and she loved this large painting of Stintson Beach. I think it was like 60 by 72, painting of the beach She and her husband loved it.
but it was too big for their house. And, but they loved it and they loved just looking around. We had a nice chat and they thought, they looked at a couple of prints 'cause I also sell prints. And so they thought maybe we, we, we have to think about maybe we'll get a print. unfortunately we just don't have wall space for that big painting we love.
on their way home, . They're living in Berkeley. They texted me and they said, we are moving our armoire into storage. We want the big painting, . I just I, I can't believe this. And so that was. So exciting. she unfortunately didn't win her battle with cancer.
And her husband emailed me to let me know, she had passed and he said that. She and I would sit in the love seat right across from that painting every night and just look at it. And I just wanted to tell you that , and so like, that's pretty much it for an artist, you know, like what more would you want as an artist? that I think is the most meaningful thing that's happened to me ever, regardless of art, but that art brought to me
Kate Shepherd: I'm thinking about the person who's listening to this, who's thinking, well, maybe I have also had that whisper in me all my life that I, that I could be an
artist, maybe .You know, maybe, you know, he followed, he followed it and it, it was true. Like maybe, maybe I could do that too. At the end of every episode, I always ask what I call the billboard question,
so maybe for that listener and also for any other listener out there who just like. There is this little voice saying to them, you have something special inside
of you. But for all the reasons we talked about before, you know, like all the, all the, what we think of the, the mean professor in school who,
you know, had his own dysfunctional stuff and was taking it out on you and, but, but created these really deep set of limiting beliefs inside of you where you believe you just can't be an artist.
If you had a billboard for everybody and, and you could put something on it where. When everybody read it, , you'd reach them, your message would, would reach them. What would you put on it?
Andrew Faulkner: I don't know if you know of the work of Joseph Campbell, he is a sort of modern day philosopher. He is not living anymore, but he was very much into mythology and spirituality. He said, , follow your bliss, which was kind of the key to life for him, and it has so many. Ramifications and for me has served me so well. I think making this leap from kind of a stable job as a graphic designer to become a full-time painter was really following that bliss.
What really, really you happy? Like, graphic design made me happy, but what really, really made me happy was doing art. if you're willing to do that, that's has the best chance of success. and some, like you were saying, you know, people ha feel like they have something inside them they may not know.
That, that's their bliss. But it's worth experimenting. And creativity can happen in so many ways and so many levels. if you don't have painting skills to collage and just play, you cutting paper and color and taping it together and see what happens.
Kate Shepherd:
It's reminded me of what you were saying earlier about when I asked you about how you interact with intuition and how you get. Answers is, it is just taking a step and seeing how does that feel right or wrong?
And I think we can apply that to our lives, right?
Like, oh, well, I, I can't, I, I have a story that I can't paint, but I really want to, okay, so I'll try. You know, then, then what? Oh, you really can't paint. Okay,
then I need a different teacher again, like all the different, you just keep it. The, the key is, and I think you also said this earlier, is to just keep moving.
You have to
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah, and do, do something, even the littlest thing, one thing I advise, you know, artists who just don't know where to start, they're on Instagram and they. See like a one of those a hundred day projects where you can just do a scribble a day for a hundred days or whatever. that's a great way to get, I mean, it, it seems like kind of a deal or a hassle, but you have to take time outta your day.
But it could be literally . Five minutes a day and take a picture of it and then you're done. And then see what happens.
Kate Shepherd: See what happens. Yeah.
Andrew Faulkner: Yeah,
Kate Shepherd: do the, do something, the
littlest thing and see what
happens.
Andrew Faulkner: what happens. Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: I love it. I love that. you mentioned that you teach a workshop a couple times a year and you mentioned, the galleries that you work with. if people are listening to this going, I gotta see this guy's work, I wanna find out how I can work with him, or, you know, learn more about him, what's the best place for people to go?
Andrew Faulkner: andrew faulkner.com is my, website and Instagram is Andrew Faulkner underscore art. My workshops are a little sporadic and disorganized. Right now. I do about three a year and I'm actually taking a group to Tuscany in April, next to April, and that's, that's full So I don't have anything
Kate Shepherd: Oh,
Andrew Faulkner: website about that. Yeah. Um, but,
Kate Shepherd: Darn.
Andrew Faulkner: I know,
Kate Shepherd: I was thinking maybe you might need like a podcaster
to follow you around and
Andrew Faulkner: I think, yeah, to promote it, I think that
we could, could need to happen. there's a lot about me and about, my, and, I'll, I'll quote myself on my bio. It says, after 30 years of a successful design career, I quit my job and got a real job as an artist
Kate Shepherd: I love that I, and I'm gonna include everything that you just shared in the show notes. So if you're listening to this as you're driving down the street, you can don't have to pull over to write it down. It'll all be in the show notes the website. Is there anything I should have asked you that I didn't ask you?
Andrew Faulkner: No, you, you asked me everything.
Now you know everything. You know all
my secrets.
Kate Shepherd: Great. Thank you so much for making the time for me today. Really appreciate it.
Andrew Faulkner: for having me.
I know firsthand how overwhelming anxiety can be, so I wanted to create something practical, something that could fit right into your pocket—a guide to managing anxiety when it hits hard.
I've put together a toolkit, a 35 minute audio experience that includes a set of strategies, and approaches that have helped me navigate those choppy waters. From simple breathing exercises (yes, they actually work!) to unexpected hacks like cold water therapy (trust me, it's a game-changer) and the power of movement, I've covered it all.
It is something you can save to your phone and come back and listen to whenever you need some support to get through a difficult time.
But it's not just about techniques. I explore the psychology behind sound-making, self-talk, and the profound impact of staying present in the moment. Believe me, I've learned a ton from these!
This Audio Pocket Guide to Navigating Anxiety (Patreon Bonus Episode #51) is more than a list of coping mechanisms—it's about empowering ourselves to face those anxious moments head-on. It's a reminder that, even in the whirlwind of stress, there's an arsenal of tools at our disposal. And with each practice, we're rewiring our responses, building resilience, and finding our calm.
So, if you've ever felt the grip of anxiety or if you're just curious about practical ways to bolster your mental well-being, I genuinely hope this episode has something valuable for you.
Join the Creative Genius Patreon and give it a listen and let's navigate these moments together.
Stay tuned, stay curious, and take care of yourself.
With love,
Kate
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This mini episode addresses the formidable force of limiting beliefs and their impact on personal growth and self-expression. Creative Genius Podcast Host Kate Shepherd candidly shares her own lifelong struggle with some of these beliefs, how she's performed acrobatics to keep herself small and held back her own innate brilliance. And the ongoing yearning to embrace and express her true self.
Kate shares how she gradually dismantled these limiting beliefs, taking courageous steps like applying for jobs she felt unworthy of and vulnerably sharing her art with the world. These actions led to transformative outcomes, from life-changing jobs to resonating deeply with audiences through her art.
The pivotal moment when Kate courageously identified as an artist revealed the power society’s perceptions had in deterring her from fully embracing her artistic identity, despite it being a part of her since childhood.
Reflecting on the societal conditioning around declaring one's true self, Kate contemplates the impact of the stories we tell ourselves and their connection to our identities and societal responses. She shares her ambition for the Creative Genius Podcast, aiming to empower others to embrace their creativity and spark a movement of self-expression.
INSIDE THIS EPISODE
The Power of Limiting Beliefs: Kate’s personal journey of navigating and chipping away at these beliefs that hindered her from embracing her true identity as an artist.
Challenging Societal Norms: The impact of societal expectations and conditioning on self-expression and the fear of being perceived as arrogant or unacceptable when embracing one's true self.
Empowering Creativity: Kate’s vision for the Creative Genius Podcast and her transformative workshops centered around activating intuition and creativity.
Invitation to Break Free: Encouraging listeners to challenge their own limiting beliefs, contemplate the stories they tell themselves, and embrace their truest selves as a way of serving both themselves and the world.
This episode serves as a compelling reminder of the power of authenticity and self-discovery. Kate’s journey highlights the transformative potential of breaking free from limiting beliefs, inviting listeners to embark on their own journeys toward embracing their true brilliance.
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Megan Sheldon, a seasoned End of Life Doula, Celebrant, and Cultural Mythologist, guides us through the profound significance of rituals and ceremonies in acknowledging life's transitions, especially during moments of loss and change. With her background and expertise, Megan shares insights into the transformative potential of these practices, offering tools and frameworks for creating personalized rituals. She emphasizes their role in processing emotions like anger and grief, discussing their historical absence in modern society and how they were once fundamental in ancient cultures. Megan's personal experiences, including recurrent pregnancy losses and the loss of a loved one, fueled her passion for empowering others through rituals, showcased by a poignant story of creating a meaningful ritual for her father's dying friend. This episode is a heartfelt exploration of how rituals serve as powerful tools for emotional healing and understanding in life's most challenging moments.
In this episode, Megan Sheldon, End of Life Doula, Celebrant, Cultural Mythologist and Founder of BE Ceremonial, an organization that supports people through grief and loss through bespoke rituals and ceremonies, takes us on a journey into the transformative potential of rituals and ceremonies. Megan, who has her Masters in Cultural Mythology, has helped thousands of individuals connect with their inner creative instincts to craft meaningful experiences by activating the power of ritual and ceremony to acknowledge life's moments, particularly amidst loss or change.
Throughout the episode, Megan answers thought-provoking questions that unravel the essence and importance of rituals and ceremonies, delving into the mechanics of their magic, empowering listeners to explore and incorporate rituals into their lives.
Megan shares her framework of creating ceremonies (her 1-5 ingredients), tools for building personalized rituals, examples of rituals resolving past traumas, to the societal absence of rituals surrounding significant life events like death and miscarriages. She delves into the lost connection to creativity, exploring how rituals and ceremonies were once integral to ancient cultures but have been largely excluded from modern Western society. Megan shares her perspective on rituals as a means to process emotions, addressing anger, grief, and other overlooked feelings, emphasizing their role in guiding us through life's emotional landscapes. She enlightens listeners on the mechanics of ritual magic and provides guidance for individuals seeking to incorporate rituals into their lives.
She opens up about how her own recurrent pregnancy losses and the loss of a close family member led her to turn to ceremony and ritual to make sense of and heal from those losses, and how that sparked a passion in her to empowering others to tap into the power of rituals as a means of authentically expressing and navigating complex feelings.
And she shares a deeply touching story about creating a ritual for her father's dying friend, a story that had me in tears.
Throughout the episode, Megan touches on various aspects, from the framework of creating ceremonies (her 1-5 ingredients), tools for building personalized rituals, examples of rituals resolving past traumas, to the societal absence of rituals surrounding significant life events like death and miscarriages. She delves into the lost connection to creativity, exploring how rituals and ceremonies were once integral to ancient cultures but have been largely excluded from modern Western society. Megan shares her perspective on rituals as a means to process emotions, addressing anger, grief, and other overlooked feelings, emphasizing their role in guiding us through life's emotional landscapes. She enlightens listeners on the mechanics of ritual magic and provides guidance for individuals seeking to incorporate rituals into their lives.
-Understanding and practice of rituals and ceremonies.
-The mechanics of rituals and their potency in guiding individuals through difficult emotional landscapes
-Megan’s 1-5 ingredients and a list of tools she uses to empower individuals in building personalized and impactful rituals.
-How you can begin to invite ritual and ceremony into your life
-Societal pressure to pursue constant happiness, leading to the neglect of negative emotions and how rituals can help us learn to sit with the uncomfortable
-Examples of transformative rituals designed by Megan, that have supported people to resolve traumatic experiences from their past.
Last spring, I was invited to an informal intimate backyard gathering.
The host had invited a couple of friends and asked them to invite. Other women who were doing purpose driven work. .
A lot of us have school-aged kids and it can be difficult to make friends and grow your community at this stage in our lives. And the host wanted to. Expand her own community.
I was honored to attend and I was a little bit nervous because. sitting in a circle. With a group of people you don't know yet can be a little bit intimidating, but I was yearning. For these kinds of connections. And so I went. The host and I became fast friends. And today we're lucky enough to have her as a guest on creative genius. ,
Megan is the co-founder and CEO of be ceremonial as a mythologist storyteller and celebrant. Uh, her passion is bringing people together through storytelling.
She's also the co-founder of seeking ceremony. Where she's convened hundreds of workshops and retreats and ceremonies. That span the life cycle. Everything from fertility and birth pregnancy loss, lifestyle and relationships. End of life grief Megan has a deep understanding of the potency that ritual and ceremony can offer us.
As a celebrant and end of life doula, she has helped people create ceremonies around moments of grief and loss in their life. That most of us have been very uncomfortable dealing with up until now. We talk about the ceremony shaped hole in our society right now. The lack of rituals and ceremonies surrounding losses like death or miscarriages in our society. And she talks about where to start. If you're wanting to bring ritual and ceremony into your life . We talk about how. Through ceremony and ritual, we're able to heal old wounds and actually free trapped parts of ourselves. she shares with us examples of rituals that she's helped people create. Some of them resolving traumatic experiences that happened 30 years ago. She shares with us, her 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, which are the ingredients for the formula. For making powerful, meaningful rituals for yourself and for your community. .
think my favorite moment of this whole episode though, is when Megan tells the story. Of when her father came to her, asking her for help. And crafting a ceremony for his dying best friend. I was weeping when Megan told that story, it was so beautiful. .
What I loved about her right away was her. Serious, but joyful approach to ceremony and ritual. I've intuited for a really long time
at when we submerge and push down Our creative side. With it go a lot of things that we might not categorize as creative necessarily.
And ritual and ceremony are one of them.
When I think of the word ritual.
And ceremony. They seem very loaded with a lot of cultural ideas ritual to me. Almost has. Scary energy around it. Like it's going to be some sort of dangerous ritual. Sacrifice involving blood and brains and a cauldron. and the word ceremony feels very formal and official. a wedding ceremony. or a funeral ceremony. Neither one of those field particularly accessible. And yet. What's underneath both ritual and ceremony. Are something we all yearn for to mark the milestones of the important things in our life.
I look around at our culture and I see how we're yearning to create rituals and ceremonies. But for many of the same reasons that we don't feel creativity is accessible to us, we don't feel these things are accessible to us either. Or we feel that we've forgotten how to do it. Or that there's nobody around to show us how to do it. Or that we might get it wrong.
I mean, many of the same objections that we have about accessing our creativity seem to apply to accessing ritual and ceremony
It is in our bones. As Megan says, to be ritualistic, to have ceremonies. And in modern Western life, . It's almost as if we've forgotten. How to.
Mark important life events with rituals and ceremonies and. Megan will walk us through what she's learned about creating ceremonies and rituals, including giving us some ideas and. Pointing us in the right direction for creating our own rituals that are as unique as we are. This conversation that you're about to hear with Megan
is it potentially life-changing invitation to bring the element of ritual and ceremony into your life. In a meaningful way that can have incredible impact on the rest of your life. .
Before I introduce you to Macon. . Aye.
Want to invite you to sign yourself up for the next activating intuition and creativity workshop.
These happen every month in the lead up to the full moon.
The intention of these workshops is to spend time together in community with others.
In a sacred space where you're safe to access this tender part of yourself that wants so badly to unfurl, but that maybe doesn't always feel safe to in the hustle and bustle of day-to-day life. Where all of your protective parts are busy, keeping you safe.
This is an hour where we sit together and through a channeled meditation that I offer.
I allow myself to be the voice of creativity. I let creativity speak through me to you. To help you uncover and activate it in yourself. the feedback I've been getting from participants. Who've taken part in this workshop is. Truly moving. I received a message earlier today from somebody.
Who. Was woken up in the middle of the night, unable to sleep and decided to go and watch the replay of the last workshop. And ended up. Uncovering something that had been holding her back for nearly 50 years. Even in the replay was able to access this feeling of safety and. Possibility to explore this And access what she feels is a new level of freedom.
When I read messages like that from people,
it's so powerful and moving for me. And it makes me want to just crawl into your computers and sign you up for all of the workshops, because I just, I know. How powerful and transformative these workshops can be. So if you haven't signed up yet for the next one, It's going to be happening on December 21st, that's a really busy time , for those who celebrate Christmas, that's very close to what can be a very stressful time. This is deeply nourishing gift.
You can give yourself that will carry you forward. . In ways that might. Transform your entire life. I cannot recommend this workshop enough. Everything you need to know to sign up for it is on Kate shepherd, creative.com. And just so you know, If you're signed up for the Patrion at the colorful community tier. You actually get access to these workshops on a monthly basis as part of your membership. .
This small act of signing up for this workshop and carving out this hour of time to give yourself. Could truly end up being. One of those moments you look back on as the moment that changed everything for you.
They're powerful. It's an honor for me to lead them and I really want to see you there.
Megan and her husband stumbled into ceremony after years of recurrent miscarriages and the death of a parent.
They didn't know how to grieve the mountain of seemingly invisible moments that surrounded the experiences that they were having. And our culture, we don't have prescribed. Rituals and ceremonies for many of these things that cause us so much pain. so they decided to craft their own rituals to acknowledge their grief in ways that felt meaningful to them. And they told their story through ceremony, and then they decided that they wanted to make these tools more accessible. To everybody.
They're passionate about helping people to reimagine the role of ritual and ceremony in their lives. They have an app and she teaches workshops and retreats. And actually Megan and I are co hosting a retreat. On bone island in British Columbia in January. It's a new year's retreat. I think by the time this episode goes to air, there might be one spot left. . There'll be information on how to sign up for that. In the show notes
megan is a beautiful human being. This is a beautiful and important conversation. And my prayer, my hope. Is that. You hear something in this conversation today? That. Is powerfully transformative for you and your life. As you're listening to this today, there may be somebody that pops up for you that is going through a difficult time, maybe a death of a loved one or a big life transition. a minute to send them a link to this episode There's probably something in it that they need to hear and that's why you thought of them
-2: I hope you enjoy my conversation with Megan Sheldon.
Track 1: Hello Megan.
Megan Sheldon: Hello
Track 1: happy you're here joining us.
Megan Sheldon: Yeah, thanks for having me.
Track 1: Thank you for coming. I know what you do, but, our listeners dunno what you do and I actually can't wait for them to hear what you do, meet a new group of humans, like say , at a backyard dinner party or something, how do you describe the work that you do in the world?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. And these days it's at kindergarten pickup , ____++++ can figure out what it means to them personally.
Track 1: One of my questions for you, and I'll get back to it in a minute, is what is ritual? Like, how do we define ritual and ceremony? before we get into that, I just wanna sort of set the tone for our conversation. I, you've probably heard me say before, I feel like humanity's glitching because we've cut ourselves off from creativity, which I define as gut instinct, intuition, inspiration, desire.
if you look at a lot of the ancient cultures, creativity and ritual and ceremony were all things that were deeply embedded in All of them, maybe like most of them for sure, but in our, they seem to be part of our DNA, like they seem to be part of, you know, our operating systems, the, the tools that we need to navigate human existence, right?
We seem to need these things, but the current iteration of this western culture that we live in, we've all but stripped all of those things out. and so I'm always coming at it from like a perspective of we're disconnected from creativity. But when I started thinking about the conversation that you and I were gonna have , there's this feeling.
I can feel that this disconnection we have from creativity is not separate from the disconnection that we have from ritual and ceremony. And why have we done that? I can't put my finger on it, but I'm hoping that you and I
can kind of explore that feel around a little bit of that, into this conversation.
Before we do that though, this is maybe a good place for, for us to ask you what, what are ritual and ceremony and why, why are they important for us?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. Well, just to jump back before we get into that, um, you know, you were talking about this, this idea of you humanity glitching right now. I went through recurrent pregnancy loss while losing, um, my father-in-Law to ALS. So it was a grief storm. It was a time of so much loss and anticipatory grief and ambiguous loss, this type of grief where you can't quite put a name on it.
And a friend of mine, shared with me that there's a ceremony shaped hole in our society right now.
Track 1: Hmm.
Megan Sheldon: As soon as she said that, that's, that's what I felt I was missing. you know, not only just around a miscarriage, but around reaching a due date. And what do you do on that day that you were supposed to have a baby and you don't, or when your father-in-law receives a terminal diagnosis, what do you do on that day?
You know, three years later when he dies? We have a little bit of guidance, but there's so many moments along the path that we are, we're lost. And for me, that ceremony shaped whole. , goes hand in hand with our, our disconnection from mythos. , you know, myth, religion is based in myth. so for me, I don't identify as religious, but I am, I am spiritual.
I am connected to something, you know, nature. there's no guidebook, there's no roadmap for how to create ritual and ceremony when you are so disconnected from your cultural roots, from any type of, body of knowledge. So you're, you really feel like you're on your own, for the most part, we do nothing because we don't know where to start. And that's what I hear with every single person that comes through my door or through our app, is where do I start? If I wanna think about ritual ceremony in a new way, if I wanna acknowledge these seemingly invisible moments that are happening every day, all around me.
Where do I start? And I think, you know, in talking about the definition of ritual and ceremony, one of our mandates, one of our kind of missions with be ceremonial is not to become what we have run away from. So we're not here to tell you what to do. We're not going to give you a script and say, follow this.
Here's the ritual, here's the ceremony. We're gonna give you inspiration, we're gonna give you ideas, a bit of guidance, but ultimately we want you to apply it to your own life through your own lens. Because a lot of us moved away from the prescriptive versions of ritual and ceremony because it wasn't necessarily applicable to our modern lifestyle, to what we're facing right now.
So when I think about a ritual, I think about it as simply an intentional symbolic action that hopes to create meaning. So if we break that down a little bit, it's an intentional, so it's intentional. You're not just doing it because it just is there. Right? You have our morning routines, our habits, the things that we fall into.
I often say that we fall into routine, but we step into ritual. So you are being intentional with your energy in some way. . The second part is symbolic. So you're, you're looking at symbolism, and this is where, for me, the creativity can really come into play.
There are so many different layers and levels of symbolism. There's . Personal symbolism, things that are meaningful to me that you would never know. You might come into my home and see this rock sitting on my table and not realize that this rock has three hearts on it. symbolic of each of my pregnancy losses.
And when I hold this rock, um, I can reconnect with grief I held 10 years ago. And it's palpable. This rock becomes a symbol for me. So it's a personal symbol, but there's also family symbols, there's community symbols, there's universal symbols. So I might go down to, you know, the beach and light a bonfire and, and release some things into that fire.
Um, words that I've written on paper. And that becomes that universal element of looking at fire as a purification. This idea of transforming something through that power of, of bonfire or lighting a candle. And that universal element of we can go anywhere in the world. And if you see somebody taking a moment and pausing and lighting a candle, you have a sense that they're, that they're moving through something, they're recognizing something.
So you've got an intentional symbolic action. The action for me is you are doing something even if you're not doing anything. So a beautiful example here in Canada is we have a two minutes of silence on remembrance day. So that idea of holding silence can be an action of not doing anything that becomes an action itself.
Uh, you might go down to the beach and take a rock and throw it in the water. That action of throwing it becomes part of the ritual. . And then the fourth part is the hope of creating meaning. And this is where I give people a lot of permission because I have tried rituals and they have failed. , my intention was kind of clear and my symbolism was there, the action was there, but it didn't quite do it.
It wasn't quite something that I necessarily wanna repeat again in my life. the hope of creating meaning is we, we can't go into something knowing what's gonna come out of it. All we can do is try to create the conditions, for us to move through that and experience whatever we're gonna experience, especially if we're holding a community kind of ritual.
Um, in the community is gonna experience something different. We can't prescribe what their meaning is gonna be. So if we think about rituals holding those four kind of elements of intention, symbolism, action and meaning, then we start to get somewhere, you know, for the, the Wikipedia definition is using words like rigid and repetition and religious.
So we're kind of moving away from that and moving into this fluid, uh, mentality of it. A ritual is what you need it to be,
and then if you take a string of rituals and pair them together in a way that tells a story, that's when you get a ceremony. . So ceremony often follows a rite of passage. this kind of traditional idea of, you know, we were talking about looking back in culture across time and a traditional rite of passage follows these different stages where you're separating from the past, you're letting go of something you're releasing, and then you find yourself in the midst of your ceremony where you're kind of in that liminal space.
You're neither here nor there. And you do something to acknowledge the present moment. You know, where are we in this very moment? How are we, how can we acknowledge through ritual, here and now? And then the third part of the rite of passage is how are we gonna incorporate what we've learned and carry this forward?
So this often takes the shape of a legacy or an intention that we're gonna set and manifest for the future. take this traditional rite of passage structure, we can then start to play with it and think, okay, if I'm gonna create a ceremony and I'm gonna string together these two or three or four different rituals, what's the story that I want the ceremony to tell?
What is it gonna take me through? How are we gonna what was, what is and what will be?
Track 1: we're missing that, we're missing that it is such a huge part of, , again, I'm going back to my question about how are these things, humanity's glitching, we, we, we know that like things are not, this is not the world that is possible for us or that we even all really want.
This feels to me intuitively, like, so I have so many little alarm, internal alarm bells going, this is such a big piece. This is such a big piece. If you were to walk through the forest every day, on your way to, let's say you had to walk through the forest on your way to school or on your way to work every day, and every day there was this like hole that had been kind of eroded from a root that got stuck there. And every day you tripped and you fell into this hole, and it really hurt.
And you kept falling into this hole every time. It might be useful for you to say, stop before you go on your walk that day and go, okay, why do I keep falling into that hole? Like, how does that keep happening? Oh, because I'm not paying attention when I, okay.
So I know that today when I walk that path, I'm gonna be looking and I'm not gonna fall into that hole. And I feel like we've fallen. We keep, we, we continue to fall into this hole of not having these things in our life, of not making space for this thing in our life. I wonder if, if you think it's useful to. Ask and, and explore a little bit just to create some awareness so that we don't keep doing it. How did we do this? How did we get to a point where we've, where we've shut down this, this really important thing, or where we, where we've created, uh, barriers to it for ourselves. We, we limit ourselves. We don't, we, we have not invited this aspect of humanity into our lives.
How did we do that?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. And there's a lot of different things at play there. I mean, we, we look at our individualistic culture here in western society, and ritual and ceremony has a role in, in self-care. Um, ultimately for me and for for many ritualists. Ritual is about a community care. How do we come together to move through these times of change together on our own terms, but as that community, and we've really lost a lot of that, I think, you know, for especially those who have moved away from religion or have moved away from their cultural traditions physically or, you know, um, spiritually or mentally.
So when we go through something where, you know, where is that community gathering? And most people know ceremonies around birth, marriage, and death. That's kind of the, the three things that people are familiar with ceremony. And for the most part, most of those ceremonies are fairly prescribed, right? You, you're given the wedding script.
You're given the funeral script. This is what you follow. You might personalize it a little bit, but we've lost that ability to actually throw out the script and reinvent something that's purposeful in that moment and symbolic to the, you know, our unique experience. So there's that, that individualistic culture.
has harmed us from acknowledging these as a community. looking at the fast-paced modern world of just move forward, push things down, don't acknowledge them, don't get stuck. In generations before, you know, people could get, get swallowed up in a lot of things. And so the, the antidote for a lot of people was just to, you know, push it aside.
It's not, you know, it's not personal, it's business. Just push things down and, move forward, get over our grief. I think many of us were sold this story that grief follows these kind of neat and tidy five stages, and then you get to the end of it and you have closure or you, you know, you're over it.
we're given three days of bereavement leave. A lot of the, the problems that we face right now in life and the glitching, the ceremony shaped hole, a lot of it stems from our inability to talk about and focus on death and dying and grief. as I've stepped into this space of being an end of life doula and a funeral celebrant, and helping people acknowledge all of these invisible moments that surround the grieving process, you realize that.
A hundred, 150 years ago, we used to see death all the time. It was right in front of us. Right. Or the parlor room in the home was where somebody's body would be after they died. And we would spend time with their body. We would, acknowledge the grief on different levels, physically, emotionally, spiritually.
would come together as a community and we would have our own moments to grieve. when death got taken out of the home and medicalized and put into , the hospital setting, we, we lost touch with it. And so we weren't often with people when they died or if they were, we didn't want to be close to them.
We didn't want to touch them. We became really fearful of, of death. And in doing that, we lost a lot of the rituals that actually support us through our grief. things like bathing a body after somebody dies, you know, spending time with them. not as soon as somebody dies these days, you rush to the phone and you call like, get, you know, help me, what am I supposed to do?
And somebody comes and picks up the body and takes it away. Whereas those hours, those days following a death is some of the most sacred time for our mind to catch up with our body and realize this is how, this is part of the grieving process. So in taking these difficult experiences and trying to sanitize them, we've robbed ourselves of the things that we naturally knew how to do.
And we talked at the beginning that, you know, we're innately ritualistic. And I, I believe that ritual is in our bones. I'm not here to teach people how to be ritual beings. I'm here to help them. Remember, because we have this in us. It is not complicated. It does not need to cost a lot of money. It does not need a lot of special supplies.
There are things at our fingertips that we can draw on, acknowledge these moments of change, but most of us just are, we've been disconnected from that. So we don't, we don't know where to start.
Track 1: the theme of this whole season of this podcast is learning to see, when you're learning how to draw, your brain will default to the version of things that are easiest, safest, whatever, you know, fits its kind of definition of what seems like the safest thing. Whatever priorities it has at the moment, that's what your brain is gonna show you and it will show you those things and it'll block everything else out.
it takes a discipline and practices to, to learn to see what is actually there. The same thing happens when we practice rituals and ceremonies. they help us. It seems to see things as they actually are to see that death is a part of life.
Because I think we're all, we've all kind of told ourselves somehow that death is this thing, but it may it, but not, not to me, like that's not. It's not gonna happen to me. You know, like on some weird level we we're, and we're always trying to stay really young and there's like this real aversion to death do you feel like in your experience, ritual and ceremony has a role in helping us to learn how to see things differently? Like can it, can they help us learn how to actually completely shift our perspectives?
Megan Sheldon: Well, it's interesting you were talking about, the artistic process, uh, and creativity. , if I think of the times that I'm creative in life and whatever medium that shows up through, I'm trying to express something I'm feeling right there. There's an emotion there. And when I think about ritual and ceremony, there are so many emotions in our life that deserve to be acknowledged and recognized. We have found ourselves living in the pursuit of happiness, right? There's this cultural belief that we should always be happy, that joy is the ultimate pinnacle of existence. And that's just not the case. We're, not meant to be happy the the time. in pursuing happiness at all costs, we don't know how to be with our anger. We don't know how to be with our grief, our sadness, our frustration, our shame, our guilt. All of these emotions that we've deemed negative. We we either minimize and push aside, or we allow them to fester and they become something else, something unrecognizable.
Ritual and ceremony allows us to see, the root of the emotions that we're holding. If we think about a grief ritual that brings us that moment to acknowledge what was, what is, what will be. we're going deeper. We're going into those layers of the emotions and saying, okay, what is it actually that's here?
And in our app, we've launched all these amazing rituals around anger. And it's phenomenal to me to have these conversations with people lately of being like, oh, like how do you express anger? Like that's been something that we've been trained, especially as women, to not feel, to not express, like anger is something that we just need to turn around and we can, we can be sad, that's okay, but anger is something that, you know, we're, we're, we're not invited to explore.
So what happens when we turn that over on its head and say, okay, like, what are some rituals that are gonna help me express the anger that I feel? Because there is a growing anger, whether it's around climate change, whether it's around what's happening in the world right now, whether it's, you know, what's happening in, in my day-to-day life.
So rather than taking that anger and suppressing it or transforming it into something a little bit more docile, how do we express through ritual, that anger and allow that power, that energy, that kind of life force to come through us. In that process. the creative action for me is, it's coming up with a ritual.
It's thinking about, okay, there's this anger here. What are we going to turn, you know, what can allow it to come out in different shapes and forms? And one day I might choose one ritual and another day, something totally different. And you might come in and say, okay, that one doesn't work for me, but here I'm gonna take this and I'm gonna add my own spin on it.
I'm gonna add my own personality. And then suddenly it allows you to see what you're really feeling. And only when we acknowledge what we're holding, what we're feeling, can we move through those emotions. wE can get stuck in our emotions and when we get stuck in them, that's when those re repetitive behaviors happen, We get kind of stuck in generational trauma. We get stuck in, the same conversations over and over and over because we haven't moved through it, right? Where it's like that light at the end of the tunnel. We have to move through the ugliness sometimes the difficulty, the challenges of that emotion.
And most times we kind of get close to things like anger and guilt and shame, and we think, Nope, not for me. this is too hard, too scary. I'm gonna back away from this tunnel and I'm just gonna stay on the other side. And so we don't get to get to the other side of the tunnel where we've actually processed and moved through and acknowledged what we needed to, to get to the other side of that emotion.
Track 1:
We had a guest on, I think she was in season one. She's a forensic psychologist and she does a lot of work around trauma and processing. And she talked about, those experiences when they're undigested and she talked about them as digested. She called them trauma balls and just, they sort of sit in your gut, like imagine if you just ate
Piece after piece of bread, and they just remained undigested in your gut. I mean, eventually things would stop working the way they were supposed to. You'd start to feel crappy and crappy. You're carrying around all this stuff that you don't have the facilities to carry around and processing, whether it's through ritual ceremony, whatever ways you choose to support yourself actually helps you to, and your psyche and your whole system process and then put away.
'cause when they're sitting in your gut, they, your whole system doesn't know where they live. But if it, if it's like, oh, I've processed that. I've felt that that goes here in my, in my internal system, it still lives with you. That that thing didn't, you know, that thing didn't go away. You're not, it's not about making those things or experiences go away or completely resolve them.
They're a part of you,
but they're a more resolved part of you and they get to live in a place in you where they're not. Running the show or they're not taking all your attention the way they would if they were a loaf of bread. That was just, you know, undigested in your gut trying to walk around with that.
Megan Sheldon: I had a woman reach out who had an abortion 30 years ago, and she had never told anybody about the experience, and she wanted to finally create a ceremony to acknowledge. it .
And so we worked together. , I talked with her and then I, I sent her a bunch of ritual ideas and I said, pick the ones that are, are meaningful to you and then expand on them. Allow them to become what you need them to be.
And she ended up sharing back her story with us a few weeks later. And for her, it was a life changing experience. she was finally able to acknowledge something that she has been holding onto that kind of trauma ball for 30 years. It's been inside of her with no way out, no way to feel validated or seen, no way to move through it.
Well, she ended up creating this beautiful labyrinth, in the forest near her home. And along the way she wrote herself notes that she'd wished she'd, heard from other people. So she thought about all the voices that were either inside her or in the people around her at the time. And she wrote down either what they did say and, and burned that, or she wrote down what she wished they would've done or said.
And she created her own healing circle through this experience. And I gave her a little bit of guidance. I gave her some ideas, some inspiration, but ultimately she created her own experience. She created what she needed and it transformed her life. This, you know, this one hour of one day, 30 years in the making.
Another beautiful example was I worked with a community of motherless daughters. So these were women who lost their mothers at young ages, and they were all about to turn at some point in the next year or two, the age that their mother was when their mother died. They knew this date to the second, their entire life, every ounce of their being and every fiber of themselves knew that this date was coming.
Nobody else knew. You know, they often shared with me that even their husbands, their, their, you know, friends, nobody knew that this day was coming up. And so what do you do on that day? What do you do on the day that you turned the same age that your mother was when she died? And then what do you do the next day when you now have turned one day older than she got to live?
Where's the guidebook? Where's the, you know, where's the acknowledgement there? And so we work together on, again, understanding the framework of ceremony, understanding the basis of ritual, giving them some ideas, pointing them in the right direction, and then allowing them each to choose their own rituals to create a ceremonial experience that that was intentional and symbolic and, and meaningful to them.
A group of people can all take the same three rituals and the ceremony story is going to be so different because we put ourselves into that experience and we reflect our own, our own lived experiences, our own values, our own beliefs. So yeah, it's been quite a, an amazing creative process to see how we can take these simple ingredients.
And I often say that the ceremony pot, ceremony is like a big cooking pot. And the rituals are the ingredients that we throw in. So I can give each of us the same ingredients, but we're gonna cook them in different orders in different ways, and they're gonna simmer for longer or shorter. And ultimately, we're all gonna make our own different and unique meal from that.
Track 1: What do you, I love that we're talking about ingredients. What are ingredients for rituals?
I feel like my favorite ingredient for ritual is fire. Like, I feel fire is a really powerful ingredient for ritual.
What are some of the other ingredients for rituals or, or what are some of the most powerful ones that you see and use in your work?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. So the way that we built be ceremonial was with these ingredients in mind. And when I work with individuals or families or communities, I come back to it and I, I call it the one, two, three, four, five. And it's just, it's for me to remember, it's for them to remember. Um, there's so much permission to deviate and go off of this, but I, I love these kind of simple reminders.
We talk about the fact that, you know, where's the guidebook? Where's the roadmap? Well, this is a bit of a, a roadmap. So the first thing is really distilling your, your ritual or your ceremony down to one intention. If you try to make your ritual or your ceremony do too many things, it may not do any of them well.
that's not to say you can't have multiple intentions, but if you can get really clear on why are you doing this ritual, what you know, what is the purpose of it, what is the hope of it? And if you can distill that down to one word or one sentence, it can really guide the rest of the experience. So oftentimes I'll work with families and they think they want a certain kind of ceremony, and when we get clear on their intention, we realize this, this ceremony that you're planning is not what you want or need at all.
The best example is a lot of times people think they need a celebration of life after a loved one has died. And ultimately when we get clear on their intention, it's probably something closer to they need time to heal. They need time for quiet, for reflection. So a celebration of life is not always that, that same conducive environment to healing and reflection.
So instead, we might create a healing ceremony, you know, a few months before a celebration of life, and give the family an opportunity to come together in a more quiet, reflective space and do something that is a little bit more private, a little bit more personal, a little bit more tender before they move into a more public arena where they're now having to be with their grief and support the grief of others as well.
getting clear on that intention is paramount. number two is the idea of holding polarities. And I talked about it earlier a little bit, how we have this pursuit of happiness and joy and gratitude where, you know, we're in this gratitude filled world. Just be grateful. But what that can often do is this, this idea of toxic positivity. holding polarities is thinking about two things that this ceremony is holding that seem in tension with each other. They seem like polar opposites. And then finding space for both to exist. And a beautiful example of that is my husband and I decided to get married and his, his father had just received his terminal diagnosis.
the family was coming in from Sweden and my family here. We decided to have a very small family oriented, wedding ceremony on the beach in the middle of to Feno storm season. And I wanted to carve out space for grief. And I had so many people say to me, it's a wedding.
Why would you want grief to have any room at this wedding? Like, no, no, no. Focus on happiness. You're the bride. You, you know, you shouldn't be sad. Luckily and listened to that intuitive nature within myself. Like, no, like there is a grief here. There is an elephant in the room, and if we don't acknowledge it, it's going to feel inauthentic. So within our wedding ceremony, we created a grief ritual to acknowledge the grief that we were all feeling, that this would be the only time our two families were together intact. So we held space for those polarities. Number three is this idea of a rite of passage, the past, the present, the future.
What was, what is, what will be thinking about moving through a ceremony in these kind of different chapters or different stages. So you think about a ritual that helps you release the past. You think about a ritual that helps you be present in the now, and then you think about a ritual that helps you set intentions for what will be or, or carry a legacy forward. The fourth one is what you were talking about a little bit. It's the four elements. Um, different cultures around the world who identify different elements. You know, there's some cultures have five elements, some have metal and wood but for me, I take the fire, water, earth, and wind and air, as my four elements.
And then ether is the space between. So sometimes there's that fifth element of, of things that connect us, but thinking about the role of water, the role of fire, the role of earth. The role of air, how can you integrate one or all of those? And my go-to elements are fire and water always. so when I'm struggling a little and feeling a little off balance, I think maybe I need more air, maybe I need more earth.
Maybe that will help kind recalibrate me during this time. So I will intentionally go into the forest and do a breathing ritual to help ground me. Or I'll sing, I'll do something that allows that air ritual to be acknowledged.
Track 1: Hmm.
Megan Sheldon: And then five is the senses. So. Thinking about your taste, your smell, your sight, your hearing, your touch.
Thinking about the different ways that we experience this life and how can you bring in a ritual that through the power of scent might transport you back to a place that you've once visited or through something that you hear, maybe you play a favorite song. And that audio experience transports you and reconnects you to that moment.
thinking about the five senses in a, in a creative way of, you know, what is it that I'm trying to, again, coming back to that clear intention, and then how can I draw on my sensory experience to help bring out that intention?
Track 1: Thank you so much for that. It's so helpful to have a formula, cause I think we intuit those things. We know we what we, I wanna burn something, but like, when it's in, when, when it's in that context of everything you just shared, I just feel like now you can go and pick and choose from those.
It's almost like you have a toolbox, right?
Megan Sheldon: Well, it's like learning to draw, right? You can be creative, but you need the tools the paper and the pen and maybe some skills that you've developed from different people, some tutorials, some, some lessons, and we're, we're learning from each other.
I have a master's in cultural mythology. So years ago I was studying all of these things under the context of myth and story and how cultures move through these times of change. And I was so fascinated by it. this idea of. of myth and logic, mythos and logos, our whole world is built on these two pillars.
mythos is the, the world of creativity and, and make believe and wonder and awe and magic and all of these beautiful things that we can, you know, we can't pinpoint. They're not tangible. And then logos is the logic. It's the idea of, okay, here's the things that I can prove. Here's the, here's the research here's the structure.
Here's that kind of more masculine sense of, , the guide, the framework. And ultimately we need both. We, we look at the way that the healthiest societies thrive, they have a very strong connection with both mythos and logos. They have both pillars, you know, up in their society and, and in their beliefs in their day-to-day life. our Western society, we have fallen into this place of logos where we have to prove things. , and the creativity and the myth, and , the storytelling, all of that is, is a nice afterthought, right? It's, it's a soft skill. And so we are lopsided, we are in a lopsided society where, we have lost touch with all the beautiful wonder that comes from holding up that world of mythos, that world of magic.
And so for me, ritual and ceremony, yes, there's a logic to it. Yes. There are scientific research journals that show the power of ritual in our mental health. And, and you know, the, the dopamine release when we go into cold water and all of, you know, there is the science that's there, and then there's the magic and the wonder and the unexplainable parts of all of this, which, you know, especially working at end of life, I meet people all the time who they believe in something, but they don't know what it is and they often feel embarrassed.
They're like, oh, like, I know what I know. I can't prove that that's not what it's about. It's not about proving things. We have to kind of hold these two pillars up for ourselves so that we can find our own balance.
Track 1: So how can we start to address that? I think that what you just said is a really important point. I recently lost my dear stepmother at the end of August. She passed away. my dad, who's a very sort of logical scientific, you know, like, he used to tell us that we, we weren't allowed to get carsick because it's not scientifically proven that you could be carsick.
It's just all in your head. He really had these beliefs. And so we've been, trying to support him and his loss of, his wife for the last 25 years. And. I feel I've been really feeling her with me. They, she wanted me to have her, her diamond engagement ring, which was her prized possession.
And I've been wearing it on my hand. I haven't taken it off since, since I came back from her celebration of life. And I took a picture of it the other day. I was at soccer watching my son and I, I took a picture of it to send to my dad because I felt her with me watching my son play this game. I felt her like not, oh, I felt her.
Like I felt her. She was there and I hesitated. It was a real experience for me, but I hesitated to even tell him that. 'cause I know he doesn't believe it. But I told him anyway and he was like, you know, crying and like, I know, I feel like we had just had this conversation a few weeks ago about how he doesn't believe in any of that stuff and she's just gone and she's gonna turn into some other animal now and her cells will, you know, very scientific, I guess my question is how do we begin to. dip our toe into that world of the magic, that world of the unknown with each other, because , I don't know where we go, but I know that we don't just disappear. Like I, I can feel her presence with me. How do I create language around that that doesn't make me feel like I'm being silly?
Or how do we shift that? Do you know what I'm asking? Like
I'm having a hard time asking the question, I guess maybe, but Yeah.
Megan Sheldon: I think, and then another version of that question that I get asked all the time is, how do I introduce rituals to my family member or to my friend, or to my client who is resistant?
And my answer is, until you have a strong connection and relationship with ritual and ceremony yourself, it's almost impossible.
To convince somebody to do it for themselves because we all learn by example. , my father, who, you know from Edmonton, small town. and I have his, his permission to share this You know, of a certain generation, , not, very logos oriented, there's, in, in his mind there's not much point in talking about what happens when you die because it's just, it's nothing. Right? There's a, a very clear version from him six or seven years ago, , he was given a terminal diagnosis. He has survived it.
I think in that experience of, of facing your own death, you know, he was given a few months to live and then he had this radical surgery and, and survived. it's shifted something in him. recently his best friend was dying and he called me up and he was on his way to a lunch with all of his tennis friends.
They've been playing tennis together for the last 40 years, the same group of men. And he said, you know, I'm, I'm going to this lunch. and I know it's just gonna be, you know, it's, it's the, the man who's dying, it's his birthday lunch, and I know that everybody's gonna do everything they can to avoid talking about the fact that he's dying.
He ended up dying three weeks later. So everybody knew this was the last birthday, this was likely the last time they all gathered as a community of men. And my dad was so worried that nobody was gonna do anything, that it was just gonna be a regular lunch where we just pushed down those feelings.
So he called me up and he said, I wanna do something, but I don't know what to do. Where do I start? And I said, okay, dad. Well, what is it that you think is needed? And I listened. I gave a couple of prompts and a couple of thoughts and questions, and ultimately he came up with his own ritual and he went and he found in his old locker, this old tennis racket from the 1950s, and he brought it with him to the lunch.
And in front of this group of men in their late seventies and early eighties, he proclaimed that this was Brian's tennis racket and we were all gonna pass it around. And we were gonna share something of meaning that Brian has brought to our lives, something that he's done, something that made us laugh, a funny memory or, that he has taught them.
And so, one by one, this group of 12 men passed this old tennis racket around and they shared what he's meant to them. And I told my dad later, A lot of this movement is often around a living funeral, a living wake. This is what these men were doing. They were letting Brian hear before he died, how much of an impact he made on each of them, and the tennis racket.
It, it was the symbol, right? The symbolism was not only meaningful to my dad because he had been given this from somebody that he loved and respected, but all these men now connected with this tennis racket, right? It held something meaningful for each of them. The intention was to elevate this lunch, not just to a regular lunch, but something meaningful because it was the last, it was the last of these lunches that would look like this.
The action was moving it around from person to person without a lot of prescription. He didn't tell them what they had to say. He actually even said, you don't have to say anything. You can just hold it for a few minutes if you want. And then the meaning came, and like my dad could never have predicted how meaningful that was to everybody involved, but most importantly to Brian, who later shared with him that he felt like that was the missing thing that he had needed before he died.
This was the thing that he, he didn't know how to create for himself and my dad in a fairly simple way. Right. It didn't take a lot of planning. It wasn't something that he, you know, ran through a script in his head, but that ritual became this beautiful bond. As we think about the creativity, the, the ideas that we can kind of unlock within ourselves, it doesn't have to be big and complicated.
It can just be that, that meaningful action.
Track 1:
There is something about objects, there's an elegance to, and um, the gift that they give us, the physical object, the tennis racket gave them all permission for it not to be just them. It was like they were now a part of something. 'cause if you're, if you just have to go around in a circle and share what you're feeling, like you don't know, is it just me?
Am I out here on my own? Am I, but that created a, a way that connected them all. It was a thread that ran through them all. And it was almost like a safety
net for them. Like that they were all almost held by that object.
Megan Sheldon: It takes courage to go first, right? It takes vulnerability to go first, and my dad stepped into that vulnerability. This was not something that was easy for him. He called me ahead of time because he was nervous. He didn't wanna do it wrong. That ultimately in our conversation, he realized he actually had what it took, and he, he stepped into that vulnerability, and by leading and showing them and leading by example and showing them what was possible, they then their guard was down.
Okay, well, Don just did that and shared, and, and cried a little. Didn't mean that they, you know, some, some men told, you know, raunchy hilarious stories and had everybody in stitches. That was wonderful too. It wasn't about having to cry and express a single emotion. Again, it was holding space for whatever emotion showed up that day.
I just love the simplicity of that. And I think if we can all start to acknowledge and recognize these moments that seem fleeting, these invisible moments that pass us by every day. If we can think about, okay, you my friendship just ended with somebody, what am I gonna do to acknowledge that end of a friendship?
Or, somebody that I know just lost their job. How can I help them through this time of change and not just say, don't worry, I'll get a new job. 'cause that's suppressing the process, the experience that they're going through. How can we look to ritual as a way to help them acknowledge all of these times of change that we face and not just those kind of big moments where we have that script in front of us.
Track 1: Mm-Hmm. because they all feed each other. Like you have to have the littler ones. They're almost practice.
I mean, I imagine creating those rituals for yourself in the little everyday things gets that muscle going so that when the bigger life events happen, you have this skill to draw from that can support you to create that for yourself and for the people in your community.
Megan Sheldon: Yeah, and that's, we've just launched our daily rituals for self-care in our app. And that's the mentality of it. It's like we gotta start flexing these muscles. We need to have a relationship with ritual on , an ongoing basis so that when something big or hard happens, yes, it will still be hard.
Yes, it will still, you know, bring up all these emotions, but we will have things around us. We will look around and be like, I've got this, I've got this. I can move through this. I can go through that tunnel and get to the other side of this emotion. I can look at somebody who's struggling and I can offer them some tools and say, okay, like we're, you're in, you're in the midst of it right now.
You feel stuck and here are some ways that we can move through this together.
Track 1: think this is a good time for you to tell us a little bit about the app and how it works and how somebody listening to this, who's going, okay, I feel the ceremony shaped hole in my life and I'm ready and I'm lost. I don't know how to, I'm not particularly spiritual or religious or, but that, but I still feel this, you know, but I don't know where to start.
How can your app help them?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. So, and there's a few kind of ways in, there's the idea of daily rituals. So maybe you're looking at, you wanna just start slow and gentle and think about a morning ritual or a bedtime ritual, or looking at rituals to express your grief or anger, joy, you know? And so you can pick and choose from a bunch of rituals and we invite you to make them your own.
So you kind of go through the app experience and you, choose a ritual. It's kind of like choosing a Spotify playlist. You choose your playlist, you go through it, and then you get to pick and choose the rituals that you connect with, and then we guide you through it. And you can follow our language, but we really invite you to then think about how you can make it your own.
What are the ingredients you can add to make it personal? So that's the daily rituals, those kind of singular events that happen. of the rituals in our app take five minutes or less. They don't require a lot of planning or a lot of, ingredients. We really wanna give people the tools to kind of build ritual into their day-to-day life.
And then we have the life ceremony. So these span, you know, from birth to death, all of these moments in between. So we've got, ceremony surrounding fertility and pregnancy loss, know, ending breastfeeding, all the moments that show up at the beginning of life around birth. And then we've got moments surrounding, into a new home or moving out of a home, going through a divorce, going through marriage, like going through, seasonal shifts.
So thinking about the solstice and the moon and how we can tap into the natural environment. And then a big part of the app is focused on end of life. That's usually where people come to us is through an experience of grief or loss. That's the ceremony shaped hole has been there all along, but they feel it the most when they're grieving and when the people around them don't know what to do and likely do nothing.
Or they're given a template script and they, Nope, that's not for me. That's not what I need or want. Can create a ceremony if you've received a terminal diagnosis, if you're looking at medical aid and dying, if you're creating a living funeral or a celebration of life, or scattering some of these ashes.
If you're looking for a place to start and you just want some inspiration, you wanna be guided through this process. Again, coming back to that 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, all of the rituals in the app, and there's hundreds of them, they're neutral, kind of a neutral palette. you can be religious, you can be spiritual, you can have strong cultural traditions and still use our app.
And if you have none of that and you're kind of guided by that logic mentality, um, you, you can take the rituals and, and, and fit them into your life. So you move through and you pick and choose the ritual that are meaningful to you. And you, you build your own ceremony and then the app guides you through that ceremony when you're ready.
You can do it on your own, you can do it as a group of people. we try to, again, give people lots of options to make it their own and, and not, not be prescriptive, we're trying to open that door for people and say, here's a place to start. you can also gift it to somebody that you know, so you can create a ceremony.
, if a friend of yours has had a miscarriage or a friend of yours is going through a divorce and you wanna send them something to show your support, you can purchase it on their behalf and then send it to them and then invite them to go through it on their own.
Track 1: It's so beautiful. How do people find that? Do they just go to the app store?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah, so our, our website is be ceremonial.com. you can create a web-based, of the platform of the app. So you can go to app.be ceremonial.com, or you can download the app in any of the app stores and have it on your phone. to set up account and you can access some of the material in there, and then you can become a member, unlock everything.
And our members also have access to workshops and courses. We do monthly gatherings, seasonal gatherings. We meet online and we're all becoming ceremonial together, really building a community of people who are wanting to step into this space and learn from each other, share our stories, and transform the way that our society is moving through these times of change and, and be that, be that beacon of flight and that beacon of hope for other people who might feel lost
Track 1: I love that so much. I wanted to ask you earlier, I never found the right moment, but I wanted to ask you if there's a particular ceremony. Or ritual even that you experienced or witnessed, whether you led it or were a part of it that, uh, has really, really stayed with you, that has maybe been like among the most powerful
Megan Sheldon: Yeah, so at the beginning of the pandemic, I, I was turning 40 my thirties were full of a lot of loss and a lot of grief. Um, lot of joy, a lot of gratitude, both sides of the coin. And I found myself in Tino, , 10 years after we'd gotten married and I was there and I wanted to acknowledge and release some of the things that I, I experienced in my thirties.
So I created my own little ceremony and then I wanted to be present in the moment. And I found my way in the cold ocean in the Pacific in the beginning of march and dunked down three times and then came out and set some intentions for what I wanted my forties to hold. And that experience kind of unlocked something in me, around my aliveness.
And so I came home to Vancouver and I started hosting weekly ceremony swims in the ocean. And what it's done, I think is it's, it's a community care experience. so we're, we're taking care of ourselves, but we're also taking care of each other. And every week, whoever wants is welcome to join us at the beach and we
We spend time walking along the ocean, the beach, choosing an object that's reflective of something that we're grieving. And then we come together and we share what we're grieving that day. And it might be something big, something hard. It might be something small that we didn't even realize was there.
we share that object, we share that grief, and then we release it into the ocean in a way that feels right to us. And we go into the ocean and we have the cold water experience, which activates that aliveness, that magic, that feeling of connection. There is nowhere to be, but in the here and now when you're in cold water, in the middle of winter in the Pacific Ocean.
That is the truth. And then we, we come back in and we warm up and we share what we're gonna carry with us for the rest of the day or the rest of the week, something we learned or experienced or noticed. And we share that not only to remind ourselves, but also to kind of, um, piggyback off each other and say, oh yeah, that I know this, that too.
Isn't that amazing? How, how the ocean made us feel that way or. So if I think back to, I mean, we've now had. Oh gosh, I can't even think about, you know, over a hundred of these ceremonies, if not more. A couple hundred. And if I think about the times when I've seen somebody who's shown up for the very first time to one of these ceremonies and they're not quite sure what we're doing, they're kind of like you with your great burn.
You know, my friends are, you know, friends of friends or people that have just heard about us. They show up and they're kind of looking at us a little suspicious, like, what is, what's happening here? And then they realize, and they spend time walking along the beach, and then you see them pick up the heaviest rock they can find.
Or they're dragging this giant log with them and they plop it down in the middle of the circle and they say, I'm gonna go first. And they share what they're grieving. And we've had people share that . They lost a child, um, that they lost a spouse, um, they lost a dog or a pet. We've had people share grief that they've been holding for 30 or 40 years.
We've had people minimize their grief and then realize, no, like I am grieving that today. It might be small, it might be insignificant to a lot of people, but to me it's important today. And we all hold space for that. We're not there to fix or solve their grief. We're just listening. So if I think back to some of the most meaningful moments, it's when that happens.
It's when a group of strangers comes together and holds space for each other through ritual, through ceremony. And , we're activating that community care. We're, we're not making each other feel like we have to go at this alone.
Track 1: I think that's one of the, I mean you, you mentioned it at, sort of, at the top of the show, how one of the things that led us to get to this place was this individual we're, we're simultaneously feel like we have to do it alone, we have to do it alone, but the way everybody else is doing it, right. Like, I have to get married the way everybody else is doing it, but I have to do it alone. I have to deal with my mother's death the way that everybody, I have to do the funeral. I have to do the, but the way, but I have to do it alone.
Like we're, and community and building community around these rituals and ceremonies. Is it it, you may not have those particular people with you when you do your big life ceremony, but you now know how to do it in community. And that's a really important skill that we're not really taught. We're not really taught how to be in this culture, in community.
Well, we don't really
we don't really
know how to do that very well. And so I feel like the work you're doing is, and as somebody who's participated in some of those swims with you, the work you're doing is really profoundly important and needed. And I just, from my own heart to your heart, thank you. I just wanna thank you for, for being like, I was so excited when I met you.
'cause I just felt like, oh, there's this like soul twin of like, you know, we're, we come at it from such different ways,
but I really appreciate the work that you're doing in the world and I think you're an amazing human being.
Megan Sheldon: Uh, my fa one of my favorite quotes is, many hands Make for light work. And I feel that this is heavy work. I have people say it all the time, oh, I could never do what you do. You know, you're, you're with people who are, you know, grieving or dying, or somebody who's just died. Like, how can you, you know, you've got little kids.
How can you do that? And again, it's like, well, this is happening. And either we step toward it and we walk through the fire and we find ways through it, or we suppress it and push it down. And the alternative for me is just not, not an option. , we have to step into this space. There's a beautiful quote by Glennon Doyle that talks about the fact that we keep making circles, and we need to instead make horseshoes.
And so I think about where are all the circles in my life that feel closed off? And if I think about these weekly ceremonies, I've had people say, oh, that sounds amazing. I wish I could join. And I think, okay, let's just open up the circle and say, of course come.
And there is a place, obviously for, for closed community and, and for that safety and, and for that brave space to take shape and form. , but my invitation for everybody is to think about where can you open up a little bit and, you know, see somebody who is moving through something. Maybe it's grief, maybe it's anger, maybe, you know, and how can you step toward that and offer them something that you might be able to hold space for, you know, offer to go for a ritual, walk in the forest or a swim in the sea, or do something that allows them, and allows you in turn to recognize what you're feeling and holding and move through those emotions so they don't get stuck in us and turn into those trauma balls.
Because that's, that's happening far too much. And I, I see it at every twist and turn In my work, people have unresolved trauma. And when, when somebody dies, um, and we are all going to die. When that happens, those trauma balls get reactivated and it's, it's quite destructive for a lot of people.
Track 1: ABsolutely. There's two things that I do at the end of every episode. Well, one I do at the beginning of every episode before I even get in the call with you, I, I say a little prayer , I ask Spirit to speak through me so that it's not just Kate and the rational mind speaking and that it's this magical thing asking what needs to be asked so that what needs to be answered can be answered so that what needs to be heard can be heard.
I pull a card from my angel card deck.
Well, I went to pull one and five of them flew out of the bowl at me, they all fell on the floor. was cleaning them up. And, I was like, no, actually I feel like I'm supposed to read all of these to Megan and to the listeners, so I'll read them to you in the order that I pick them up.
Love, acceptance, flexibility, exploration, and surrender.
Megan Sheldon: We need all of them. They're all
Track 1: Right? In the context of the conversation that
we just had, , how do I open my heart up? How do I horseshoe open
my heart up to allow more ritual, more creativity, and even ceremonies. And people
in feelings. How do I open myself up so that I can, , not only live the life I was meant to live, but operate in reality as more of myself as, as, as the truest version of myself.
And in communion with the truest version of reality. Like, really see what's happening, really be okay with it and in love with it and, and allow it. And I just like, I feel like those, those things, uh, everything that you said and those things are like, That's
it. That's our formula.
Megan Sheldon: the flexibility is so important. I think that's the thing that most people are scared about. They think, and, , we didn't get into it today, but, , I do a lot of work on, on avoiding cultural appropriation and, you know, there is a place and a time for, for rigid ritual that is, you know, embedded in culture and passed down across time.
Of course there is a place for that. And there's also a place for us to create new rituals that, that serve us today. And being mindful of the cultures, around us is a really important part of that. And But
Track 1: last question that I always ask, and I'm gonna tweak it a little bit for this conversation, but it'll essentially be the same as the billboard question.
I ask it at the end of every episode and usually I say, you If you had a giant billboard that somehow was gonna reach all of the people who, and I usually say yearn to be more creative, yearn to have access to this soft, quiet, radiant, mysterious voice inside of themselves.
And maybe I won't change it from that, but who, who also would like to have more ritual and ceremony in their lives, maybe even more community of this nature in their life. But for a lot of the reasons that we've talked about, and even some of the ones that we didn't 'cause some, some of the stuff that we didn't talk about was the stigma around, like, I feel like there's actually a little bit of a stigma around ritual.
And even the word ritual
conjures up, you know, we didn't get there. But because of the, you know, for, for all the various reasons that somebody might self-select out of creativity, ritual ceremony community, if you could put something on this billboard that would address those objections in their heart and concerns that they had and would allow them. The possibility that these things were available to , what would you say? Like what would you put on that billboard?
Megan Sheldon: I think I would say something along the lines of, you already have ritual and ceremony in your life, like step into it deeper every time I meet with somebody, they all realize, oh, I, I do have ritual in my life. Oh, I, I didn't realize that's what it was.
Track 1: right.
Megan Sheldon: already there. now go further. Now go deeper. that's where the creative process can really be unlocked and can unfold. As I think about the way that I create ritual today, and it's such a creative experience, , whether it's for myself, whether, you know, I hosted a ritual for a community of pregnancy, lost people last weekend, 800 people we created at a Nature Mandela.
We, we chose all these different objects and we created art together to acknowledge our, our grief. It is a creative process, so the, the reminder that we already have what it takes, I think is important for people to hear.
Track 1: That's so beautiful. You're so beautiful. I love you,
Megan Sheldon: it's a long billboard.
Track 1: coming. It's okay. Usually people have like, it's like we, we, I should describe it this way, but usually people end up saying so much that we just say, you know, when you're driving down the highway and there's like 40 billboards. And they're just like down the side of the
highway.
It can be like that. You don't, there's no limit to your billboard,
Megan Sheldon: Yeah.
Track 1: I love it. Thank you for coming
Megan Sheldon: Thank you for having me. It
was lovely
Track 1: Oh, and oh, one more. One more thing I will ask you is where if people, so we've talked about where to find the app, but where else can people go to read more about your work?
Megan Sheldon: Yeah. So on b ceremonial.com I'm on Instagram and Facebook. Um, our, our B ceremonial, um, account is there. I'm also under seeking ceremony. A lot of the personal work that I do as a ceremonialist and end of life doula and celebrant, um, comes under seeking ceremony.
Track 1: Okay. I'll put all that in the show notes so you don't have to pull over and write it down. If you're listening to this right now, you can just check out the show notes.
Megan Sheldon: Wonderful. Thank you so much, Kate.
Yeah.
ATR2100x-USB Microphone-3: Okay. Were you crying when Megan told that story of her father? , . I was just picturing this older gentlemen coming to his daughter saying help me. I don't know how to create a ceremony for this. I want to create something here, but I don't know how, and I loved how patient and gentle she was in guiding him. , he already knew what to do, and I love how she guided him. To find that.
I just imagine all these old men sitting in a circle, sharing this tennis racket and. Being able to do the thing that was in their bones, which was love their friend and send them off in a beautiful way. Oh, my God. I'm going to start crying again.
I encourage you to check out the be ceremonial app. And Megan's work. And if you're lucky enough to grab the last spot on bone island in January for the new year. I can't wait to see you there.
And if you're not able to come up. . Please join me in my monthly workshop, activating intuition and creativity.
Watching people. Make time for and begin to activate.
A two way conversation with this deeply intelligent, unconditionally loving aspect of themselves. Is the most fulfilling thing I've ever seen or done or been a part of in my life. It's an honor to lead these workshops. And I hope to see you there. Everything you need to know is on Kate shepherd. Separate creative.com.
So I want to close. With this question for you.
How might your life. Transform. what might you be able to resolve or let go of from your past? to navigate with more ease in your present? If you were to invite in. The element of ritual.
And if you want support with that, please reach out to Megan directly. I know she would love to help you.
Are you ready to delve into a transformative experience that taps into your intuition and unlocks the boundless realms of creativity within you? Join me for my monthly workshop designed to ignite your inner spark and guide you through an exploration of self-discovery unlike any other, one where you will access and activate your intuition and creativity in ways you may not have thought possible.
A Gateway to Unleashing Creativity
Creativity isn’t just reserved for artists—it’s a pathway to reconnecting with your truest self, your intuition, and an abundant source of inspiration that resides within each of us. This workshop, built on the foundation of guided meditation and experiential activities, aims to help you tap into this incredible wellspring of creativity.
The Power of Intuitive Connection
Imagine stepping into a space where your protective barriers melt away, allowing you to explore the tender parts of yourself that often remain hidden amidst the chaos of daily life. These workshops offer precisely that—a safe haven to unfurl and explore your creative potential. Through guided meditation and interactive exercises, we pave the way for you to access a new level of freedom and possibility.
Testimonials of Transformation
The impact of these sessions is nothing short of remarkable. Participants have shared stories of breakthroughs that have been elusive for decades. Even in the replay, the depth of introspection and the newfound sense of safety resonate powerfully. These workshops have sparked transformative shifts, offering a nourishing gift that carries forward, often transforming entire life trajectories. (read some of the reviews here)
What to Expect
Each session is a blend of introspective practices, including opening and closing share circles, guided meditations, and a beautiful watercolour play activity meticulously crafted to deepen your intuitive connection. Bring along your watercolour or mixed media art journal, paintbrush, water, rag, favourite pen, and a cup of tea—it's time to embark on this creative journey together.
Your Path to Joining
There are two ways to access these monthly intuition workshops
Become Part of the Creative Community
These monthly workshops are included in the Patreon Colourful Community tier. Join us to deepen your creative exploration and unlock a treasure trove of benefits that enhance your own creative journey.
IMPORTANT
Your creativity matters, and this workshop series is designed to honour and nourish that part of you. It's an opportunity to pause, explore, and reconnect with your inner compass—a chance to rewrite your narrative, guided by creativity and intuition.
Join me on this extraordinary journey of self-discovery and creative awakening. Let's embark on this beautiful exploration together!
Yours in Creativity,
]]>The kids came by with their Dad before school this morning to pick up some particular clothes that Elvie had been asking for, for school today. Standing by the front door, minutes away from the first school bell, both kids ask me, “Are you coming today?” “Coming? Coming to what?” I say. “The Assembly” “What Assembly?” This is the first I have heard of it. “The Remembrance Day Ceremony” Cosmo says, his voice serious, hopeful and tinged with a tiny, vulnerable shyness peeking out from under his sweeping cool-kid haircut. “Are you coming? It starts at 10:50 and goes until 12. I have been working hard on our performance with my class. I want you to come.” Then Elvie, “Me, too Mama, we’ve been working on a really important song. Please come!” There goes my work day, I think to myself. Deeply, achingly aware of the gift it is to be wanted, loved, needed and included in invitations like this. Aware of how lucky I am to live a life free enough to even be in a position to make such a choice. The gratitude though, is mingling uncomfortably with the growing feeling I have been having lately of being consumed by life - this sense that I am drowning in a life that does not seem to have enough time for all of the things, not least of which me. Assemblies. Halloween Costume Parades. Field Trips. Fall recitals. Ice Cream Socials and Themed Hot dog lunches on the school grounds. Parents didn’t participate in all this stuff when I was a kid, did they?
I spent 20 minutes churning through her already upside down bedroom, under sketchbooks and piles of mint coloured linen and crinoline doll clothes, ballet uniforms, and other 8 year old treasures until finally I put my hands on her favourite softly-ribbed, cream-coloured knit shirt and the specific pair of stiff, black denim pants she wanted. Elvie’s class is closing the ceremony today and her teacher gave her instructions to wear black pants and red and white tops, for impact. Spoiler alert: it wasn’t the clothes that did it.
I got there right at 10:50 and found a seat on the first row earmarked for the parents at the back. There was hardly anyone else there. I wondered if I had made a mistake. Did my kids invite me to something parents weren’t invited to? Was I crashing the Remembrance Day Ceremony? The kids began to file in, a little quieter than usual; that muted giddiness they do when they don’t quite yet know how to comport themselves. An outer door out front must have opened because all of a sudden there was a steady stream of parents filing in, a surprising number of whom attended this very school when they were kids.
300 kids, 25 teachers and aides and about 80 parents, wet raincoats and squeaky shoes, packed into the gymnasium - a room that has probably not changed much since the 1950s when this school was built. The lacquered wood floors. The tiny stage with its rickety stairs on wheels. The droopy heavy black curtains. The wooden church pew style benches lining the walls. The steady hum of the yellow fluorescent lights. How many thousands of kids have trooped through here over the years, all being taught the same things?
Everyone had made their way to their seats. A teacher somewhere said “shush’. We were about to begin.
I knew I was going to cry. I always cry.
The new music teacher I had been hearing all about (who is also apparently a member of the Canadian Armed Forces judging by her marching band uniform) stomped a shiny black boot loudly on the floor. A more serious hush fell over the room. She guides the 12 or so kids that make up the school choir to the front of the room, they climb up onto the metal stairs, and open the ceremony with a song.
Next, the grade 6’s awkwardly take to the front of the room, nervously passing the microphone to each other as they offer us a reading of In Flanders Fields. Still no tears. Huh, interesting. Maybe I have finally reached some kind of limit with my heart always breaking at this stuff. Another song and then, projected up on one of those ancient pull down white projector screens - the kind that always has a dirty, frayed string dangling from the metal handle - a video called Highway of Heroes begins to play. Footage of fallen soldiers being repatriated via the big airbase in Ontario. Enormous military aircraft open their bellies to release coffin after coffin swaddled in flags, a twisted backwards ritual of lifeless babies being brought into a grateful world. Onlookers hold signs with messages of love and gratitude as the coffins are gently placed in hearses for their final journey along Canada’s Highway of Heroes, the stretch of highway that runs between the airbase at CFB Trenton to the coroner’s office in Toronto.
This is when the tears start. Maybe it is the universal mother in me who viscerally feels the pain with these invisible mothers for a moment. Maybe it is another, more selfish part that cannot imagine if one of my own children felt the call to service, or worse were ever forced into fighting in a war. I try to imagine the anguish the of the mothers of these people, whose bodies I am watching being unloaded into hearses from a gym in suburban Canada. Of course I can’t. But I am still devastated. My face is wet. My eyes are burning. I feel the uneasy side eye of the dad sitting beside me who hasn’t stopped checking his phone since we got here. Maybe he is uncomfortable with the sudden eruption of emotion beside him, I don’t know. I breathe into the wave of feelings, quietly relieved that I have not gone numb to it all. I compose myself. The video ends.
Then there is a shadow play (Cosmo is in this one). Somewhere backstage a light is turned on to illuminate the white screen that has been propped up between the dusty curtains. There is the sweet rustling of kids taking their places. A snare drum suddenly bangs, once and then again and again, the shots of sound lining up with the stream of silhouettes saluting the air before dramatically dropping to the ground. 11 year olds are goofy. But something about their posture, even through the screen, tells me they are trying to be serious, still, there is something oddly comical about how they fling themselves to the ground. A tittering of laughter flutters around the room for a moment. The grade two teacher reaches over to shhhhh the loudest in her class. There is a palpable softening in the room. Laughter. Inappropriate. Necessary. Wise. Now, through the screen we watch the dark outlines of our small people carrying the cartoon-like caskets they constructed over the past days in their happy, noisy classrooms using the remains of cardboard boxes that only last week delivered the neighbourhood’s Amazon orders; halloween costumes, Christmas presents, snowboard equipment. It was haunting. I wanted to clap. I wanted to weep. I was crying again. We we were asked to hold our applause.
Out of nowhere, a group of slightly younger kids appear. Taking their places at the front of the room each holding a gauzy, translucent silk scarf in alternating in blues and oranges. Holding the colourful fabric squares in their small, outstretched arms, they staggered themselves apart from one another in rows. I couldn’t tell if they reminded me of more of prayer flags or a chess board. Our 12 year old student MC announced the song we were about to hear was called Salaam Shalom, which means “Hello" in both Arabaic and in Hebrew.
Salaam shalom, salaam shalom side by side, we live salaam shalom
Salaam shalom, salaam shalom side by side, we sing salaam shalom
Children of Israel, children of Palestine
all want a place to live, a time to shine.
Now in this ancient sand, holy land
Time for the pain to heal, a time to mend and understand.
Sister brother, mother father
Learn a new dance, sing a new song, walk a new path,
Make a circle where we all belong.
The choreography for this song ended with the children moving from their chessboard formation into a circle where they sat crosslegged, facing each other, smiling. Definitely prayer flags.
AS my own children stand smiling on a safe, warm stage, twirling colourful swaths of fabric, innocently singing hopeful songs of oneness, kindness and inclusion, war rages on in Ukraine, Gaza and Israel and beyond. Children just like them are enduring unimaginable, impossible violence right this very minute.
I am now full on sobbing, the sleeves of my fleece soaked through. My eyes hot and red. My heart aches for the babies, sisters, brothers, mothers, fathers, grandparents and cousins. The knot of emotion that has been worriedly working its way throughout my system trying to find a place to rest, settles in my throat. The guy beside me is still on his phone.
It is unbearable.
My daughter’s class was last. They evenly made their way to the front and arranged themselves carefully on the stairs of the stage, joining the choir. The room quieted once more:
We are love, we are one
We are how we treat each other when the day is done
We are peace, we are war
We are how we treat each other and nothing more
And tell me what it is that you see
A world that's full of endless possibilities
And heroes don't look like they used to
They look like you do
Sobbing. I locked eyes with Elvie. I saw through my own raw, wet eyes a soft, heartbreaking look on her face. Confusion. Concern. Sadness. Understanding. Love. Compassion. I think somehow she already knows both how horrific life can be, and the truer truth under that, the truth she and all babies are were born knowing, the truth of our oneness. Via our seamless psychic connection, or maybe I am projecting, I feel her own heart asking, “But why? How can we keep getting it so wrong?” I know full well she doesn’t even yet know how just much we are getting wrong.
Walking home I was lost in thought and emotion. I stepped carefully around the cratered pavement of the tennis court behind the school, lonely puddles now overflowing with murky rainwater. I made my way through the soft, mossy sanctuary of the impossibly magical little forest that connects the school to the end of my beautiful tree lined street, I kept turning the question over in my head: how can we simultaneously “get it” and also “keep missing it?” I know the answer is complicated. Bigger than any number of words could lay out or explain. But it is also very simple. It is because of fear.
We have been taught to be scared. We have been taught to favour the rational mind to solve problems and in order to do so, we have submerged the soft, radiant, knowingness of love deep within us. It has caused us to become perilously lost in fear, isolation, violence, mental & physical illness. Humanity, as I so often say, is Glitching because of this. And make no mistake, we are in a downward spiral. We might not actually make it as a civilization.
But….
There is an alive, wise, benevolent, ineffable intelligence, running the entire universe. It breathes our bodies, writes poems, builds airplanes. It guides us with desires and gut feelings and middle-of-the-night ideas. It speaks to us in dreams. It forgives and loves and keeps creating regardless of it all. It may be invisible and unknowable, but I know you don’t need me to convince you that it exists. You might call it Love, Creativity, the Universe, or God. It doesn’t matter anymore. We have believed for too long that this thing is outside of us and have forgotten how to let it lead us from the inside.
Until we learn (or more accurately remember) to navigate life referencing this thing in us, this intelligence that makes us truly greater than the sum of our separate selves, we will always perceive a void - that is this thing’s way of making sure we never forget it. And the system seems to work, we seem to stop at nothing in attempt to resolve the void, it’s why I find myself sitting in a flickery 75 year old elementary school gymnasium, remembering other people’s dead babies today. But we have been looking in the wrong place.
While most of the world churns and jostles, spitting and choking, frantically swallowing as much stuff as it can, elbowing each other out of the way in a mad pursuit to finally find and own the thing that will make the void go away…..if you are paying attention you’ll see that there is a quiet but magnificent movement beginning. A rising. Creativity herself is returning to run the show. To guide us. The other way didn’t work. The void is the love. It has been pointing us home all along.
The infinite, wordless thing that beats your heart and grows your hair and burns in the stars you gaze at, as you stand on grass it is growing for you as it gently touches your face with its breeze, has a voice. It has never stopped speaking to you. It has the answers you seek. The alive treasures you most fervently desire. You can’t receive any of these gifts until you learn how to communicate with it. You must learn its language now. It is time.
Heroes don’t look like they used to.
They look like you do.
]]>Follow, Listen, Rate & Review (thank you!) in Apple Podcasts
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EPISODE SUMMARY
In this thought-provoking episode, we embark on a journey of self-discovery, exploring the complex and often elusive concept of our true selves. Kate and her guest Mary Ann Stancel an energy practitioner and meditation guide from Seattle delve into the notion of how we create the world around us, the personalities we embody, and the roles we play in our lives, including our jobs, families, and communities.
We question whether there's more to our existence and whether our purpose runs deeper than the roles we've adopted. The conversation touches on the inner knowing that something may be off, even if we lack the words to express it. For those who feel they've built a life but are uncertain about their authentic selves, the episode unravels the process of returning to our core identity, guided by curiosity and self-exploration.
Mary Ann gives us practical, accessible ways to engage in powerful practices like meditation to disconnect from the distractions of modern life and connect with something much deeper and more fulfilling.
Mary Ann offers us a spontaneous, guided meditation right inside this episode that listeners can keep coming back to! This has been added to the growing library of content on the Creative Genius Patreon. (sign up to access so many wonderful resources for sparking your creativity)
What We Talk About:
The Journey of Self-Discovery: We explore the concept of understanding who we truly are and the process of peeling away the layers of constructed identities.
Role of Curiosity: Curiosity as a vital force in the journey of self-discovery. We discuss the importance of inquisitiveness in understanding our authentic selves.
Simplifying Self-Discovery: We reflect on how to trust our instincts and make choices based on what genuinely feels right.
Meditation and Mindfulness: Mary Ann highlights the role of meditation and mindfulness in the journey of self-discovery and offers us a spontaneous, channeled meditation meditation right inside the episode introducing listeners to a powerful technique for moving trapped energy and enhancing their healing capacity! (the meditation has been added to the growing library of content on the Creative Genius Patreon)
Trusting Our Inner Voice: We delve into the challenges of trusting our inner voice, especially for those who've faced adversity. The conversation explores methods to untangle limiting beliefs and open up to a different perspective on life.
Unconditional Love and Trust: Mary Ann emphasizes the importance of unconditional love and self-trust, encouraging us to believe in our inner power and embrace the magic and love that life has to offer.
Ritual for Self-Empowerment: Mary Ann shares her simple yet power ritual for calling back personal power at the end of the day offering listeners a practical way to reclaim inner strength.
Join us in this illuminating exploration of self-discovery, meditation, and the path to trusting your true self. Discover the magic within you and learn to embrace your unique journey with unconditional love and trust in yourself.
]]>
EPISODE SUMMARY
A sweet conversation between Kate Shepherd and her son Cosmo about spiders and idea of how embracing change and taking calculated risks in life can be viewed as exciting instead of scary and lead you to your best life.
The chat between 11 year old Cosmo and his mum Kate Shepherd host of The Creative Genius Podcast highlights the spider's ability to venture into the unknown by climbing to the top of a tree, building a floating web, and letting the wind carry it to a new destination. This serves as a metaphor for human life - we can all choose to be willing to leave our comfort zones when we feel unfulfilled or in need of change and may very well be rewarded with more than we might imagine.
The wisdom drawn from this conversation emphasizes the importance of being brave and open to new experiences, just as the spider is excited rather than scared to see what comes next. It encourages people to trust that taking a leap into the unknown may lead to a more fulfilling and meaningful life. Nature's wisdom, as observed through the spider's behavior, serves as an inspiration for people to be more like children and embrace change with excitement and courage.
]]> Follow, Listen, Rate & Review (thank you!) in Apple Podcasts
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Episode Summary: In this inspiring episode, we dive into Dr. Heather Penny's incredible journey from a former third-grade teacher to a leadership coach, speaker, and author. Heather's midlife crisis became an opportunity to ask profound questions about her purpose and passion leading her to return to the truest version of herself. Her realization that there is an abundance of research on how women in our society are often silently struggle emotionally and even mentally, "spiralling down" but a distinct lack of research on how to reverse this trend - finding ways to resolve this downward spiral for women became the driving force behind her work. Including going back to earn her PHD in midlife.
Heather believes that everyone has their own clarity, confidence, and courage within, and her mission is to help people access these qualities and begin the journey of "spiralling up." She encourages us to embrace our uniqueness and learn the resilient attributes and practices needed to stop spiralling down when challenges arise.
We explore Heather's transformative approach to helping people unhook from the fear-based paradigm and tap into spirit, creativity, and intuition. She shares invaluable insights on how to balance pursuing dreams with daily responsibilities and challenges the idea of five-year vision planning. Her personal experience of teaching piano and its unexpected alignment with her business journey is a testament to her philosophy about how living an intuition led life is where it's at.
Heather delves into the importance of addressing deeply embedded limiting beliefs stemming from childhood trauma and how her coaching work speaks to the spirit within us. She shares her top three methods for reconnecting with one's intuition and leaves listeners with a poignant allegory about a girl and her bracelets.
We learn about the two forms of restorative rest our spirits require, often neglected due to inadequate self-questioning in our current culture. Heather reflects on a pivotal moment during a keynote speech that transformed her perspective on supporting intuition and creativity.
The episode concludes with a treasure trove of non-threatening questions you can ask yourself to initiate a conversation with your spirit. Dr. Heather Penny's remarkable journey and insights inspire us to embrace our uniqueness and lead a life filled with purpose, passion, and growth.
What We Talk About:
Rediscovering Your Inner Spark: Dr. Heather Penny's journey from a third-grade teacher to a leadership coach highlights the importance of reconnecting with your innate passion and purpose, especially during midlife crises. Heather's own transformation reflects the idea that it's never too late to rediscover what truly matters to you.
Spiralling Up and Unlocking Your Potential: Heather believes that everyone possesses their own clarity, confidence, and courage within. Her life's work is dedicated to helping individuals tap into these qualities and embark on a journey of self-improvement. She emphasizes that spiraling up is not just about preventing a downward spiral; it's about continuously growing and evolving.
Letting Go of Fear and Rational Thinking: Dr. Penny discusses the need to unhook from the fear-based paradigm and rational mind that often hinders creativity and intuition. This shift can lead to a more fulfilling and authentic life where you're in touch with your inner spirit.
Tapping into the Power of Spirit: Heather and her host explore the concept of spirit, something we all intuitively feel but struggle to articulate. Heather's work focuses on helping individuals connect with this inner essence, which can have a profound transformative effect.
Embracing Intuition: In a world that doesn't always acknowledge the value of intuition, Dr. Penny shares three essential steps to reorient yourself toward your own intuition. Her allegory about a girl and her bracelets offers a unique and perspective-changing insight into this process.
Restorative Rest for the Spirit: Heather highlights the importance of recognizing the rest our spirits need and how we often neglect this aspect in our lives. The right questions and self-reflection can help us regain the balance between rest and action, which is crucial for creative individuals.
The Art of Questioning: A list of non-threatening questions for self-reflection provides a practical tool for initiating conversations with your inner spirit. These questions can help you better understand yourself and your desires.
A Culture Focused on Longevity: Dr. Heather Penny's commitment to creating a culture that values longevity, creativity, and passion reinforces the idea that a well-lived life is attainable for everyone.
The Transformative Power of Speaking to the Spirit: Heather's coaching work, which speaks to the spirit within individuals, has a profound impact on personal growth and transformation. This highlights the untapped potential within all of us.
Nurturing Creativity in "The Rests": Embracing pauses and reflection in the creative process can lead to new breakthroughs. Just as music finds beauty in the rests, so can our creative journeys benefit from moments of rejuvenation and insight.
Unlocking the Unseen Potential: Heather's insights provide invaluable guidance for aspiring writers and creative individuals navigating their own unique paths to success. Her story is a testament to the power of persistence and self-discovery.
Dr. Heather Penny's journey and the wisdom she shares in this episode can inspire anyone looking to rediscover their passions, connect with their inner spirit, and lead a life filled with purpose and growth.
About Dr. Heather Penny: Dr. Heather Penny is not just a leadership coach; she's a trusted advisor, celebrated teacher, engaging speaker, and accomplished author. With a Ph.D. in Human Services and a strong global consulting background, Heather possesses the expertise to guide individuals towards their best lives. Her mission revolves around helping people recognize and harness their unique strengths. Through a wealth of experience, she draws out fresh ideas and actionable goals, igniting forward momentum in her clients.
Heather's extensive work in Educational Leadership is a testament to her commitment to personal and professional growth. Her coaching process is a catalyst for clarity, confidence, and courage, enabling individuals to engage more purposefully in their lives and valued relationships. Heather firmly believes that the world is enriched by the unique gifts that each person has to offer.
What sets Heather apart is her dedication to fostering creativity, passion, and growth. She aims to create a culture focused on longevity, emphasizing a life well lived. Heather finds her joy in Northern California, where she resides with her husband and two children. Join us for an inspiring conversation with this remarkable thought leader and coach.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Hi there. I am so happy that you are making the time to tune into this podcast today. Now there's so much content out there in the world that you could be choosing to consume. And choosing something that is intended to speak to and call out the deepest truest part of yourself is kind of brave. And I feel like it's one of the most important acts of bravery. That you could make. as you probably know, I believe with every fiber in my being that coming into relationship with this small, but mighty voice inside of ourselves is the thing. That will stop humanity from glitching. I'm really glad you're here because we really, really, really need you and what you have to offer. And if you think I'm talking to somebody else, I'm not, I'm talking to you. So I'm really, really happy that you're here. Welcome. And I hope you enjoy this amazing conversation today. It's with Dr. Heather penny. I love talking to people who are smart, right? There's something really wonderful about talking to somebody who's smart. And I know I'm smart, but I'm smart in a kind of different kind of way. I'm intuitively intelligent, smart. And Dr. Heather penny is that, but she's also academic smart. And she has one of those incredible minds. That's able to hold facts and statistics and patterns and big picture. And what I love about her and what I think sets her apart from other people who might be doing work similar to her leadership, coaching and personal coaching. Is that , she comes at all her work with this beautiful marriage of that academic knowledge. And it's really rooted in spiritual intelligence. And we'll talk a little bit more about what spiritual intelligence means.
Heather in her academic career found herself studying this phenomenon of women and how they were spiraling downwards. We are. Culturally conditioned to kind of put ourselves last and what the implications are. Of that. On society as a whole. We have amazing conversation about why we do that. why we try to mute out or shove down the soft, quiet voice when it's trying to speak to us .
But rather than continuing to study that downward spiral, Heather had this sort of light bulb moment that she realized w she really wanted to do was orient her entire life and put her energy. Into helping us spiral up instead of studying why we were spiraling down, which I think is a really wise. Perspective, heather's work now is about helping people partner with their own creativity to be able to live the life they were meant for. If you've ever found yourself, doubting yourself worth or wondering. If the world actually needs what you have inside or would care about what you have inside. This episode is an absolute must. Listen.
She's one of those people that has this rare ability to kind of get in past our defenses. And resonate with the part of ourselves that really needs to hear it and come alive. And that is. Powerful. And it's a gift and I feel so grateful that Heather gave that to us today. Before we get any deeper into this episode with Heather. I just wanted to say for those of you that tuned in to the last episode, with Martha and tole. And heard a weird track. That was just me talking and sounded a little bit glitchy, please, please forgive me. In true Friday, the 13th fashion, we had uploaded the wrong file to the podcast platform. And, uh, I think it was up for about an hour or so before we realized, and we fixed it right away. But if you started that and got frustrated and abandoned it. Go back because that episode with Martha is wonderful. She's an author and book critic for NPR. She has a huge extensive resume. She's really, really an accomplished woman. And she has an extensive wealth of experience. Writing and working in social justice she's always known. She was, a novel writer, but for 20 years she faced rejection after rejection, after rejection. But she stuck with it and she tells us how she did that. And the gifts she learned from all the rejection. And how now on the other side of that, what it feels like to be celebrating the first anniversary of her. Novel, which was shortlisted for a Gotham award. . Her second job was on the way and she's already working on her third. It could feel like a desert of pain when you're dealing with rejection after rejection for that long. And you start to question your dreams. Am I crazy? Why am I doing this world? Doesn't seem to really want this, . How she dealt with those voices. And, and now what it's like on the other side, looking back, it is a wonderful listen go back. And, and listen to that one it's not one to be missed.
What I love about our guests today, Heather penny is how passionate she is about normalizing this conversation about spirit. You know, how's your spirit doing? That's not a question we ask each other, but if we did ask each other, we would know what we meant. Like we all, we might have a different word for it. God or universal intelligence or soul or gut or. Inner child, whatever we call it. We all know kind of what we're pointing to when we would ask that question, but it's not talked about, we don't ask each other that, and we're not even really taught how to ask that of ourselves. And part of Heather's work is about normalizing this conversation about that soft, quiet wisdom inside of you. It feels like and wants and is doing right now.
. You know, we here do the thing you love and everything else will fall into place. Well, what happens when the thing you love doesn't really seem like it will make logical sense on paper from a career perspective, or maybe it's weird or new or different, and you doubt whether or not the world would want it. We talk about that. And Heather has so much to say about that, that I think is going to really reach in and possibly flip the whole script of how you look at your own creative offering.
And while Heather and I come from different angles, her more from an academic and coaching leadership angle. Our life's work and dedication is to help as many people as we can find that part of ourselves.
on that note, I want to remind you that I'm holding the monthly workshop, activating your intuition and creativity, . This workshop is designed to help you in a really practical, tangible, connected way, access, the soft, quiet voice inside of you that has all of the answers for all of the things that you're wondering about the directions that you might need. It is activating your inner GPS system, waking it up and doing it in a really beautiful, colorful, nurturing soulful environment. I really would love to see you there. And people who've been coming to them have been loving them and giving me really beautiful feedback , which you can read if you go read the reviews on the website. But the most important sign for me that this is something that's so needed is that they're signing up to do them again. So if you haven't signed up to do that workshop, it happens once a month in the lead up to the full moon. Everything you need to know is on Kate shepherd, creative.com. That's S H E P H E R D. So you can head over there and find out when the next one is and sign up for it.
And if you are a creative genius patron. These workshops, along with everything else. Bonus episodes meditations. Uh, worksheets journal prompts, all kinds of really beautiful goodies. These workshops are included with all of those things at the colorful community level. Find out more about that on patrion.com/the creative genius podcast.
Kate Shepherd: ____Heather, it's
really
lovely to meet you. Thank you for joining me.
Heather Penny: you Kate.
Thanks for having me. This
Kate Shepherd: One of my favorite things about this job is that I get to meet the most incredible people all over the place doing really powerful work. I was preparing for For this interview, I was kind of blown away by some of the stuff that you're doing and the way that you approach things.
And so for the listener who doesn't know who you are yet, I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit about work and where
you're coming from and what's driving you to do the work that you're doing in the world?
Heather Penny: I started out as a teacher, little third graders, so I always like to say that because my mindset is really on how people learn and grow. And it's our little kids, you know, our little, our little teachers that I got to learn from As I moved forward in my career, I was in it for about 15, 20 years, give or take.
As you look at working at university level, getting my master's in leadership education and stepping into that space of training teachers, I just kept learning what it meant for human beings to learn and grow, and I loved that. What I began to do is this shift in my life, and it was midlife shift, you know what we call midlife crisis, and I try and call it midlife opportunities, , to stop and really ask myself.
What is it that I'm about? I started realizing I'm made for more. I'm just not sure what that is. So I started interviewing all these different spaces and places, and it's places that I should have liked. You know, I was really into nonprofits and education and kids and at-risk communities.
These are all my heartbeat of . Probably my desire to save the world or think I'm saving the world . And to to step in that space and realize it was not cutting it for me and starting to feel that what's wrong with me, a terrible question to be asking because when I start asking what's wrong with me, it's a shame-based question.
Of course, I'm saying this all looking back, but in the heat of that moment, I'm like, all I can figure out is what's wrong with me. So I keep interviewing. Walking away
going,
like this job and I'm afraid they're
gonna offer it to me. ,which is not
the way you want to step in,
which is telling me
there's a significant shift happening in my life.
I just didn't know how to orient. I'd never heard of coaching. I went to a coaching class, the instructor was phenomenal. I went up to him and I said, Hey, can I hire you as my own coach? And we worked together for over a year, and it was during that time where he was like, what do you think about coaching?
And I had never even thought about that. And when
I started realizing. The path that he'd helped me get through, helping me access my own clarity, my own confidence, and my courage. I
began to realize that's what I
wanna offer other people. So I, I. Said yes, but of course my
biggest fear is will anyone hire me
Do I have anything good to say? During that time, I went back and got my PhD thinking, you know, education was always like, well, if you're not sure, go get more education. It was kind of my thinking. So I went back and I focused on, uh, human services and public service leadership and what I was focusing on my dissertation.
I realized I want to start looking at this, what they were calling a social phenomenon. Of women spiraling down, particularly in the ages of 18 to 25 and sociologists were saying we don't know what's happening. It's just a significant drop. Being a mother of a daughter who was I think turning 15 at the time, my alarm bells were on.
As an educator, I was seeing a significant gap. We were losing our females and they were younger and younger. I had too many questions and I realized I don't wanna study the spiraling down anymore. There's tons of literature out there on it, and we need it. Thank goodness we have it out there. Depression, anxiety, and everything else.
But I to start studying what would make a spiral up. So my dissertation focus began to be on, I'm gonna go interview women in the uh, age group of 30 to 50 years old. So it's kind of where I was at and I had a little bit more clarity on my 18 to 20 something year olds, which I struggled with depression and anxiety, and nobody could tell me why, and I didn't know why.
I just somehow white knuckled through and got through it. But I think we can do better. So when I started doing that research, that's where a ton of information came out of what we can do to spiral up, and that's when I knew this is what I want my life to be about. And so my coaching, that's the heartbeat of my coaching and it's really a lot of my own personal life experiences.
And then out of a love for my own daughter, what happened in, I've been in the field for at least 15 years, opened my own coaching company. It was very successful and I'm still very successful today, and I don't say that
with I say that with . Kind of wonderment, sometimes , but also a, a huge relief that I think I'm doing what I'm made to do.
You know, when you're successful with
something, it's because you're doing what you're made to do. So that's why I then wrote the book, the Life You're Made for, because I believe everybody has a life they're made for. And then what I began to realize is my research was not just gender specific. It was for all humanity.
It started out with women. it's now across the board, I work with both men and women, I've created an allegory around it. I've created this style of coaching where I come alongside people and said, you may not know this yet, but you have your own clarity within you, your own confidence within you, and your own courage within you.
I wanna help you access it. So that you can begin the spiraling up and one day you won't need me. , you will learn the resilient kind of attributes and practices and skill sets that you
need. That when, not if, when you start spiraling down, you know how to
stop it. But we're not gonna just plateau. We're gonna stop the spiraling down and then I'm gonna give you practices and coach you along with that to begin what it looks like to spiral up.
And this is what I think is really missing in this conversation. Our world is,
We have a tremendous amount of conversations around the negativity of that, which again, I wanna say with respect and value to all the researchers out there that have really taken the time to assess this, I wanna join the conversation and build on what they've offered us in our society and say, all right folks, let's
Start talking about everything we know about this, and we do have an issue. What can we
start doing to spiral up? And so that's, when I wrote my book, I wanted people to feel like they had a coach in their corner to really assess. Um, there's six chapters on clarity, six chapters on confidence, and six chapters on courage for people to feel like they can figure out how to access those spaces within 'em.
And it's meant to be like a journey you take with me. And I have an e-course with it. I have a coaching companion on,
I
apologize. That's a
huge long answer to your question.
That's kind of where I started and where I ended up and I had no idea it was gonna take me. I just knew that I was dealing with a, a passion for a
significant issue that we have in our
society right now.
Kate Shepherd: I feel like everything you just said is why I felt like it was such a yes to have you on the show and have this conversation. Like I feel like there's so much alignment between, I'm saying humanity's, glitching because
we've become disconnected from creativity and
I, when I say
the word creativity, I'm referring to. That ineffable intelligence that's animating the entire universe. You know, your, your gut feeling, your inner knowing, your inspiration, your desires, your that, all the things that make you,
you, the inner wisdom and also
the molecules that are vibrating together in the
desk that I'm sitting at holding, you know, telling them to stay a table.
Like I, I get the shivers every time I say that.
Because it's all
connected. It's all, you know, but we've, we've disconnected ourselves from our,
I mean, and if you look at that as our operating system, we've kind of gone over here and said, well, No, I have to be, I have to look like this. I have to sound like this.
My life needs to be this shape. I need to marry this kind of person. My relationship needs to fall into this kind of shape and category. and of course we have to have,
to operate. Otherwise, it, it is chaos. But we've, we've gone so far down that road of the rational mind running the show that we've literally forgotten how to reference this.
Heather Penny: Mm-hmm.
Kate Shepherd: Inner self, like
ocean of, and I'm, and I fall prey to it too. I often think
I'm made for more, but I'm not sure what that, that was very familiar to me. You know, how do you help people, who have that feeling? 'cause I think a lot of us have that feeling I made from more, but I don't know what it is. And then there's a whole other category of people who have the feeling but couldn't articulate it.
I made for more, they're just sort of depressed. So for the person, and I guess I wanna speak to both of them, but for the person who
can articulate,
I made for more, but I don't know what, how did they begin to find that?
Like how did you do that?
Heather Penny: Yeah. Okay. So
help,
me keep track of those
two populations.
cause I have so many thoughts.
I wanna talk to both and I'm afraid, I'll forget the second one, for me,
Keep in mind that I was probably in my forties,
so I have a little bit of life experience under me,
I would say I had two significant
kinda Disorienting moments in my life. One was in my twenties, which the research was showing that a lot of women were struggling with this disorientation of identity. Then the other one was in my midlife, in my forties. Part of it had to do with, um, I chose to get married and I chose to have two beautiful kids, and I chose to start weaving my life and career around.
Those commitments that I valued. So I didn't get to take a straight course on my career. I had plans, Kate, I had plans, but when we choose these other things and I wanted both, and I think that's the scary myth. I think it's both true and false that you can have your cake and eat it too.
part of me having what I wanted, Which was a family life and my career
necessitated me getting more creative about it. And one of the things I started realizing is, and I'll speak to the really, that identities shift
in my forties, going,
okay, I've lived long enough now to realize
what I'm not good at and what I am good at.
So he, let's start, this is me talking to myself, , he, let's start telling people.
Kate Shepherd: start,
Heather Penny: When you're interviewing, yeah, that's a good fit for me. No, that's not a good fit for me. And we talk so much about finding our voice in this world and I think I had that good girl syndrome of
What do you want me to do? Let me tap dance for you.
Ta.
I could do a lot of things and that's how we survive and we thrive to a measure for a while. 'cause we need the experience. There's a shift that happens in our midlife where you're like, I'm done tap dancing. I don't wanna sit there and give the finger to the world , because I don't wanna be an angry person either.
But there's a little bit of anger that starts rising up that goes like, I've had it, man,
but I've seen so many women get stuck in that space where I go, okay, that's a little alarming. So use the anger for a small point and this, I'll say this to the listeners,
don't be afraid of it. Use it for a little bit to reorient and then say, I wanna still move in with love and light and compassion and truth and transparency and authenticity, That just means that I get to use my voice in a cleaner, clearer way. So as I started really making that commitment, and this is what I call my true belief, my false belief is I can't speak up. My true belief is I need to speak up and I need to be really clear of what I like and I don't like, and then I let, need to let the full weight of my truth and who I am fall and I need to let people deal with it.
That can be the last piece. That can be very hard. People are gonna be disappointed when I say no. I was told even recently, I don't think you're a
fit. I'm telling you, I was like, what? I could feel myself going to sales mode. What do you mean I'm not a fit?
Let me, lemme start tap dancing. I could feel myself going head.
You do not need to be a fit for everyone. So I'm already recognizing, and I think that's the piece where I wanna say in my early twenties, you're just kind of overwhelmed and ambushed by a lot of emotions that you're not sure why you're having them in your forties. I wanna say. We have a little bit more life experience.
And then as is my coaching, this is more my coaching, speaking is I begin to start defining what that is. So this kind of goes to your second population. I think I remember what you said, Kate, where the second population, if you don't know yet, there's flags of
you're overworking, overbuying, over drinking.
Oh, and I say all this with some, all my fingers pointing back, overeating over, over, over, over. Overworking all these. addictions we might turn to, or even good stuff like working. We tell ourselves, well, at least I'm not getting high every night. You know, I'm like, okay, my tendencies are overworking and overeating.
Know that these are your flags,
so clearly you're trying to avoid something. What the world is telling us now is you're feeling bad. You know what? There's something wrong with you. Here's a pill. And I wanna say this really carefully because man, I so love our science community, and I so value the gifts of antidepressants and the things that an anti-anxiety, med meds that they've given us.
So I'm not saying never. I'm saying there is an other option. And even if you're on meds, I'm like, take the meds man. I will sit there and I will be your biggest advocator for that. And ask better
questions like,
Track 1: what might I. be good at
Heather Penny: instead of what's wrong with me, what's right with me, what is it that I want to do more of, and that I've learned about myself that I'm no longer willing to participate in, and what is it that gives me life and gives me
joy?
Kate Shepherd: For the person who's sitting here listening to us and thinking, okay, I could ask myself that question, and I have dipped my toe into asking myself that question before, and the things that I love and I'm good at are not a thing that will pay for my kid to go to college or. The mortgage this month, or even groceries these days.
Like I guess I, I feel,
Heather Penny: Yeah. It's not
Kate Shepherd: I, I mean, and I think you, it's not, and I, and I feel like you and
I share this very strong belief. I think
that's the cornerstone of both of our work in our, in our own way. That, that we, that That each person. Contains within them a unique essence that's them, that is a, that is very needed by the world.
that is put in them to make a difference in the world. Each
person, and some of some of them are like really obvious, like, oh look, I became a science researcher and I came up with a cure for like, you know, and they're passionate about research and science and it's obvious when they, or, or the kid that's just really great at music from the time that they're little, they're writing symphonies and they're, that it's What it, most of the time it's not so obvious and we, we go through this, um,
dark night of the soul, the spiraling
down, know, in our, in our twenties where we are trying to shove down what that essence is because we can't see how it fits in the outer world because the outer world, let's face it, the current outer world that we've co-created isn't designed by
Creativity or, or in inner intelligence. It's designed by the rational mind and it's not designed to, to listen to intuition and to follow your
heart so there's a certain amount of like
unhooking from that paradigm to then learn to trust that
that's really
hard.
Heather Penny: It is. Yeah. Yeah. I, I'm sorry I'm beating you to the question, but I think, I think I know what you're asking.
we have to hold this tension of we have responsibilities and we can't stop dreaming, but we can't live out of the whole dreams and we can't live a hundred percent of the responsibilities.
And I would say that
we just captured the tension of adulthood.
it's not either or, it's living in the responsibility and it's living in, I still get to dream
I was always a real career person and I remember was teaching at full faculty at a university.
Okay. For me, that was a prestigious place in my career path to get to, for me to. Choose to resign and stay home with my, I think, uh, five-year-old and seven-year-old at the time, I just saw that they needed me and I also felt like I was getting less and less interested in work.
It wasn't like I was like, oh, huge sacrifice. I'm gonna leave work. Mm. Everything was starting to come together.
I, my mind wasn't on work anymore. It was on my kids. They looked like they were having a ball, and then I realized, This is my only chance to be with them, and they only have one mother. You know, again, this is not a conversation on if you should stay home or work or anything like that.
It was just what felt right for me in that moment. And I think one of the questions I ask people as they're just trying to take that one baby step, I wanna say,
what's What's best option today? Not five years from now, not the, the, the ideal option that's gonna set you up for your career.
So as I pulled back, I started doing that and I was really probably completely embedded in them, probably five, six years.
I teach a little bit here on the side, but I didn't take anything full-time with that. Then when I began to realize this, we needed more income and we were, we're living in Northern California and prices everything were going up for everything The kids needed more and.
So I just said, what's my best option now to return to full-time faculty was not the best fit for me or my family.
It also wouldn't pay the amount of money that I thought it would pay. So I'm asking practical questions of what's the amount of revenue I need to bring in and what's gonna best serve my quality of life? My kids were at the age where they needed to learn piano. I I played piano,
a lot of other kids in the neighborhood wanting to start to learn piano, and I'm like, all right, I'll start teaching piano lessons.
That ended up just hugely growing, but I was really protective of, I only do it Mondays and Wednesdays after school. My kids are joining me. I probably had, I don't know, 30, 40 students at the time. We'd pull my piano out in the backyard. We'd have these huge recitals.
I.
That was not my career path plan,
you know what I'm saying?
But it was my best option. And there were days where I'm like,
I can't believe I'm teaching piano to this little third grader over here when my colleagues over here are doing these thesis, thesis and dissertations, and they, they look so brilliant and accomplish. And I'm like over here going, okay, everybody here's middle C.
You know? I also realized I own that and said, it's not forever it, it's
my choice that I'm doing
now, and it's, it fits all those boxes it brought in. Twice the amount of money of my
faculty position, if you could believe it, because teaching just doesn't paid a whole lot. and it was less time and I was able to do full control over it, and I learned a ton about entrepreneurial skills.
At the time. I didn't know that I was gonna be owning my own coaching company one day, but that's what it was preparing me for and
I got to have a blast with my kids and their friends.
So I thought, well, I'll just do a couple PL lessons. That was my best option then. It ended up being like a five,
six year journey where I had a huge piano,
business and loved it.
And then as soon as my kids phased out, I'm like, okay, everybody, I'm done. I mean, and I'm so sorry. Neighborhoods,
if you're watching or listening,
I just said, and I'm done teaching piano. Like, eh, that's it. And then that's when I went back and I thought, well, what's my best option now? I want more education.
I wanna get my PhD, I wanna study what I wanna study on. I wanna hire a coach. I wanna start looking at working again. I wanna revisit my career. And this is where the challenge is. Sometimes when you take that circuitous route, when you go return to your career, it's not what you want anymore. You've changed too much.
I changed too much. I was like the faculty academia world. Might as well be corporate America for me. It was not an inspiring place to be of growth and development. It was a lot of politics. It was a lot of intensity and it didn't pay a whole lot, and there's a pressure to research and all these different pressures that I'm like, yeah, I don't think that's me.
I think some people really buy into it and love it
and it invigorates them. For me, it was making me begin to spiral down. Then I started looking at like nonprofits and stuff that made my heart beat and I go, I don't think I can ever return to this office nine to five
anymore. Like, What I did spoiled me for life over here.
So then I began to realize, oh, I think I made to do my own company and I think I can do it outta my own home. And I think I can make this work and I think I can build the revenue I needed. And during that time, being able to say, and I get to trust that it will come. So my mindset, this is where we can get sucked into.
I can't go get a doctorate. I don't, I don't have the money for it. I don't have the time for any of that. Those are the false beliefs for holding me back, but I'm like, no, I, I get to start exploring what's next for me and this is my next best option. That's it. My next best option in front of me. Then the day after that, there'll be another one, or the year after that, there'll be
another one. I think our mistake is we try and look too far out.
I had no idea what I was gonna
research. I had no idea I was gonna be a coach. I had no idea that I was gonna work with private coaching and personal coaching and work all over the world and work with corporate America. I had no clue. There's no way I could have written a year vision
plan, which is why I kind of have a love hate for those vision plans.
'cause I go,
if you're living off more of intuition and you're trying to say what's the best option for me today? Now, what's the best option for me tomorrow? If you're living at more of that space and you're trying to recreate and reinvent yourself, a five-year plan is outdated within a week. ,
it's it, especially for those of us who are creatives
because we are learning and growing so much, and so I would say, I think there's an exploratory period where you get to enjoy, I call it the buffet line.
You just go and you just start putting stuff on your plate and then you realize, I do like cream spinach. I don't like sweet potatoes. I do like, you know, roast beef. You start realizing what you like and what you don't like. Then you're able to take that and then I would say then you're ready for a five-year plan.
But giving yourself that permission to just explore for a little bit. And that's what my doctorate did for me. It allowed me to explore and return to my academia roots without returning to the agenda that academia had for me. And that was important for me to redeem, that I didn't just throw everything out.
in my research I had studied that when we move into the right side of the brain, That's when we get more clarity.
So I started doing more painting and drawing in my twenties mainly 'cause a therapist told me, here's what you can do to start finding the words that you don't have to express what's inside of you. So I began to paint and paint, paint and this is the painting that I hold. I hang in every office that I have throughout the last, gosh, 30 years now.
And it's showing me that I of of a. A, um, very loving, caring, being that is protecting me and watching me and leading me and guiding me because I'm a person of faith. I believe in a higher power, which I call God. So I'm partnering with this creative force out there that I believe loves me and has a creativity that is embedded in me.
So therefore, I get to take my place, rightfully in this world that says I have the right to co-create. And. When we live with that true belief of I get the right to co-create, and the only reason they say co-create is because
I believe there's a force that's creating
with us that we're not on our own.
Kate Shepherd: Not
Heather Penny: So we get to join that force, whatever you call it. If it's love or light or universe or source, you know, that's irrelevant to me. The point is, is that you're not alone. There's something that gets to pull something out of you or your inner wisdom or your true self. These are all phrases that I love , because I just feel like
Once I began to trust that I had something to offer to this world, and I got to have it pulled out in me, it began to give me the permission I needed to
begin the exploration.
Kate Shepherd: I'm thinking about the person who who doesn't even believe that that's how it works.
Who doesn't believe that the universe loves you? Who doesn't believe that the universe has your back or that you're
plugged that it's inside you? Like they're they. They have this feeling of, I'm built for more. They have these intuitions. They wanna paint, they wanna write, they whatever it is that they wanna do,
but I. They just don't believe that that 'cause, and I, this is brings me to something I really wanted to talk to you about, which is, I think a lot of the stuff that you do with your coaching work around changing beliefs, it is so hard to change
those deeply embedded beliefs.
Like if you came into this world, I mean, and I'm, I'm speaking about me right
now. I came into this world into a very traumatic childhood.
Heather Penny: Mm-hmm.
Kate Shepherd: I look
around the life that I've built for myself now, and I kind of can't, she kind of
shouldn't be here. I should probably be, you know, I don't know by the grace of God I ended
up with the, you know,
um, but so there is
a part of me that actually doesn't, 'cause I, I think about like, well, why isn't I know what I wanna do and why isn't it happening?
Or why isn't it? And I know I have this block and it's around this belief.
So what do you do if that's your, like, that's
pretty deep. That's
like a deep
root. How, how do you get at that one?
Heather Penny: yeah. Great question. all of us come to a reckoning in our life. That's the only way I can describe it.
At some point, we've begin to realize instinctively life is no longer working for us, and I've worked enough with humans.
To say confidently every single human has come to that crossroad.
It's what we do with that crossroad, and I try and normalize it as much as possible that when they step in that space of just so much disorientation and life's not working for me, and I keep trying to do the stuff that I used to do before and it's not working anymore, then I, I like to really show people that I believe that we're a whole person.
We are of course, the body that we're very aware of in our society, particularly North America, and it particularly is women. We
are all reminded that we are living in a
body as women. Okay, We got that one.
Kate Shepherd: We
Heather Penny: We get it.
Mine is also the other one
I think we get heart is also another one I think that we're doing a lot better on as we talk about eq.
I believe there's a fourth component of who we, who we are as humans. And I call it the spirit and it's the spirit of who we are. And typically people go, huh? But then when I just start describing it in a negative point of view, 'cause I worked with a lot of . At risk children, abuse children, everything else.
Um, I say, have you ever seen a child with a broken spirit? And most
people go, oh, yeah.
That's what makes it drive it home. And I say, yeah, there's something else that transcends the mind, the body and the heart. I don't know what to call it, but for the sake of the conversation, I call it spirit or soul. I think as we mature and get older in life, we begin to realize there's a force out there. And as I begin to get more comfortable with just , Gently laying on the table. I have never
had one person say, that is ridiculous.
I'm very careful that there is no religious or theological construct or any kind of proselytizing I'm doing.
There's nothing I'm trying to win them over for. It's, it's a gentle truth acknowledgement that says, Hey, have you thought about this? And now I'm very comfortable talking about it. I don't just put it out there. I just let it be in that really sacred space of when everything feels like it's not working.
I say, have you thought more about this force out there? And even I've, I've even talked about it in using Star Wars. The, the force for
good and the force for evil. And I'm like, we see it. We know it. This is what's affecting our spirit. And when I do the way I access people's spirit, this is a great
example.
I did a keynote a couple months ago
and it was all of these nonprofits.
There's about 60 nonprofits in the room and they were all working for child abuse. Nonprofit agencies and at risk and foster care and adoption. So a pretty cool select group of people that are just like on the front lines are unsung heroes.
And I know the burnout rate is high. I just said, Hey everybody, we're gonna take a couple minutes. I'm gonna ask everybody what you're
inviting in and then we're gonna talk about what you're rejecting. So I just had them write down in the room 'cause I wanted them to, to see each other and know. Then I had them just yell it out.
And I'm telling you, I still get chills every time I talk about it. They're like freedom. Hope we we wanna invite in. Love, comfort, kindness. This wasn't a religious space, you know what I mean?
What are they speaking to? They're speaking to a spirit and they're trying to grab onto something beyond themselves.
Hope.
It is transcendent to the human person. How do we describe it? Mind, body. Heart. We don't really describe it. You talk of the spirit. There's a whole nother conversation that we are instinctively having let it be had and respect the fact that it's gonna look
unique for everybody else. Nothing needs to be attached to it.
Then I said, okay, what are we standing against? What are we rejecting? And they're like, despair,
scarcity, hate, defensiveness. Again, I just get the chills talking about it because I just said, this is, this is who we are in this room. This is who you get to know each other to be. You get to stand in that space and just saying it out loud.
You get to hear the spirit in this room, and now your best
self or your best spirit
is connecting to the spirit next to you
and these people you didn't even know I said Now, trade business cards. When you're having that really crappy day, or you've had super hard conversations with five abuse cases that you're thinking, I don't get paid enough for this, and this might derail me and I don't know how to let this go.
You go call two or three of your buddies here because they're in the same game and they're gonna know how to stand with you, and they're gonna know also what to help you reject.
So now what are we speaking to? We're speaking to the spirit of humanity.
Which is that conversational space that I don't think we're good at yet in America.
I think we can get better at it.
I wanna be that voice that just normalizes it and just lets people experience it for themselves. Oh yeah. All of a sudden my Hope Meter was on zero , which who assesses their Hope meter? None of us do. We're just trying to get white knuckle it through life. But I'm teaching them to start making this assessment of, well, how does that make you feel?
Did it make you feel more energized when you walked away from that conversation? Did you feel more intervi energized, or did you feel
more drained? That's really a spiritual question, and I'm not saying this is a spiritual question.
I'm letting them start to access their inner wisdom, their inner intuition, and then I help 'em get concrete.
I have recognized when I sit down with someone and I don't care how amazing this conversation is or this person is, when it goes past
that hour and a half mark, I can feel myself getting drained. At first I was confused. All it is is my introvert side.
My introvert is, is on overload, and
now I'm like, I've taken it all. I can take, there's nothing more. I can take it. I'm overly saturated, overly stimulated. Maybe a little bit of my sensitivity side too. So that's once I know that about myself, yeah, I set my meetings up and then I also have to be
very strategic.
I can only do one a couple times a week. Because my coaching and the work that I do is a lot connected. These are things that we start learning about our
spirit. So when I say, Hey, how's your, how's, how's that energize you? How did that make you feel? These are questions that as I'm working with people and I'm coaching them, I'm getting them to kind of raise that antenna or that that space or their spirit that is probably atrophied because we don't have a conversation around it.
I would venture to say, and really hypothesize that. How much of our depression anxiety is around the fact that we don't know how to ask this question, and then
we go, take this. I'm feeling really bad. Well, our wonderful doctors and our scientists are doing their best to access it, but I don't think it's a mind and
body issue as much as it
might be
a spirit issue.
Kate Shepherd: I feel like that is
like
when I have the image of humanity glitching and I'm talking about depression and overconsumption
and just what we're creating in the world right now, I. Uh, and I say that it's because we've become disconnected from creativity. I think that's synonymous for, you know, spirit of what you're, it's that soft, quiet voice that, and it's about
what you were saying with your painting.
It can, that can speak
to you, but it doesn't speak to you through words. It can't, it doesn't
actually have language. It doesn't. So it will speak to, with
Ds and gut feelings and yeses
and nos and like, I don't want it be faculty anymore. I wanna teach piano. Like
that feels good. and, and I was very lucky.
And I think
that this is, um, it's a little bit of a strange thing to say when there's a lot of childhood trauma or chaos or violence or whatever in your, in your childhood there,
a a lot of us tend to develop this deep connection with this spirit part of ourselves because it's our refuge, right? And so I've always had this
Beautifully deep
connected, like it speaks, and I'm like, I heard you. I'm going like, pretty much like a lot. My intuition
It's really good. I can, you know, um, but I realized that we don't, we don't all
have that and we do need that and my perspective is so connected to my intuition, it's hard for me to imagine somebody who doesn't have a. Deep connection to that soft, quiet voice. When you're working with people and you're trying to kind of point them to that part of themselves, what are your kind of top three pointers
for them to get to know that aspect of themselves so that they could realize, oh my God, this thing has been in me all along.
Oh, there it is.
Heather Penny: Yeah. Oh gosh. I love that you asked that
what I have found that is the most non-threatening connection to assess the state of your spirit is, um, a story.
And so it's what I use this allegory I use in my chapter book as I introduce the clarity and the confidence and the courage. But it's a very simple story of this little girl. Who loves playing outside and she's alive and she's free, and someone gives her this beautiful bracelet and she loves this bracelet.
It makes her feel valuable and cherished, and she's got this beautiful giver in her life. As she gets older, she gets more and more givers and more and more bracelets, and she stops doing what she loves, which is running outdoors to go on her tire swing, and then she stops spending time. Under the stars and, and living in nature.
Her spirit begins to disappear. She begins to disappear, and she starts doing everything she needs to do to balance these bracelets that are going all the way up to her shoulders and making sure that that's her focus and her energy is being spent on those bracelets. Now, the challenge of this, and this is the adulting bracelets from either good or bad.
When we choose responsibilities like jobs and families and commitments and, and, and, uh, kids and friendships, when we are choosing some of these responsibilities, that's a bracelet. What we have to do is start recognizing, am I managing the right amount of bracelets and are these the right bracelets I wanna on, and do I need help taking some of those off?
And when's the last time I visited my tire swing? And by the way, what is my tire swing? And it's when she spent time under the stars that she heard a voice on the win. That said, take off your bracelets. It's not who you really are. So what this then is this allegory is trying to get people to recognize there's bracelets here,
We have the choice to put them on or off. There's a tire swing that everybody has and it's waiting for them and make them come alive. And I'm telling you, I've heard so many different types of tire swings and it's awesome. And then there's the time on the stars that we need to really hear that voice in the wind or inner our inner wisdom or God or that, you know, universe, whatever it is that is
Pulling at us that says, I think I made for more. And tire swing and under the stars represents two forms of restorative rest, which is what our spirit needs. The tire swing is an active rest,
painting, hiking, gardening, doing something you love.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah.
Heather Penny: star time is a form of contemplative rest, which is journaling. . Staring at the stars, literally staring at the stars, whatever it is that you need to do to just decompress the spirit, the human spirit needs these two things, and I didn't realize I had to describe that or explain it until I spoke at an event and.
there was probably like 300 people in the room. And literally I was talking about rest. And this woman raised her hand and interrupted me. , I've never been interrupted at a keynote. And I'm like, well, now I'm curious. What So I'm like, yes, and she goes, what do you mean by rest?
And I talk about it in my book, and that was years ago. But the fact she asked me that, it really hit me that in North America, we
really. Have not defined
rest. Well, and when I say rest, they're like, people think, oh yeah, I get my eight hours of sleep. It's like they drink their gallon of water a day.
There's this like checklist. I'm go, oh no. It's much the human, the human person is so multifaceted and so complex. It's not just about getting sleep. It's about really looking at what's the state of your spirit. Even as I ask you that
question, you can feel that that's such a foreign question that we ask,
Kate Shepherd: Mm-hmm.
Heather Penny: and it can be also very scary and vulnerable.
So I wanna respect it. So that's why I use the allegory. And now I have clients still jump on the line. They're like, Hey, he, I need help with my tire swing today. I think I've got too many bracelets on. What what they're doing is having a spirit related conversation and is their body and mind and heart involved?
Of course it is. But now we have that fourth component that's joining the conversation and letting them assess things in a very non-threatening way, but more importantly in the way that's right for them. And I'll say, I don't know. Let's talk about what is your tire swing? I don't know. When's the last time you, you felt at peace?
When's the last time you felt like you weren't striving? When's the last? These are questions I ask. When's the last time you had the most energy? When's the last time you felt like, uh, you were exhaling? And then they begin to describe what it was, and if they really can't remember, they've just been so disassociated
from their sense of self for so long.
I'll take 'em back. Their childhood, the tire swing. You know, the little girl in the tire swing. So, We get there eventually, but it takes work and as their guide, all I'm doing is helping them go inward to access their inner clarity, confidence, and courage, and giving them that permission and that respect that they have it within them, but no one's
asking 'em the questions at helping
them access it.
Kate Shepherd: I love that. I wanna ask you, I ask this question in every interview, It's, I call it the billboard question. 'cause there, you know, there are more people that you're not gonna get to work with than you are gonna get to work with in
this lifetime. So if you had a magical billboard
that you could reach the hearts of all of these people out there who know that they are made for more,
not sure what, not sure how, not sure if they're even good enough or if it's really true
but they would read these words from you, and it would land in their heart. They would really hear you. Their spirit would hear you and begin to wake up. What would
you put on that billboard?
Heather Penny: I think I would call them
into the action and into their sense of self and something like , believe in who you are and what you have to offer is deeply wanted by this world.
I.
Kate Shepherd: thank you. I love that. I wanna tell you, I have this beautiful
little, I'll heart shaped bowl
carved out of wood,
Heather Penny: I
have one of those too.
Kate Shepherd: winners.
I put my angel cards in it and,
uh, I pull a card, you know, before I, I start every interview, I say a little prayer that goes a little bit
like,
help me.
Heather Penny: Mm.
Kate Shepherd: Say the thing that needs to be said so that what needs to be heard by my guest
and by the listener, and even by me can be heard and said, for the highest good of, of as many
possible people, and then I pull a little word out of the, out of the bowl. And the word that I pulled for our conversation was
expectancy, which I just thought was really, I, at
first I was like, like the first thing I thought was pregnant, right?
Like you think of expecting. Um, but she's opening, it's an angel and she's opening a gift,
a box, like a gift wrapped box.
And through our conversation that we had
today, kind of what
the way that made sense for me was just around like,
it's okay to expect that the universe.
Loves you and has your back and that you do have this
thing inside of you.
But I want, I want to just check
in with you to see like, what does that,
Heather Penny: I just love that. Yes. I am so in sync with you,
and I would say
the space within you is wanted by this world, and I think that expectancy is this sense of abundance, abundant thinking, and we've heard this a lot, but it's this awareness that. Whatever creativity is coming out of me, whether it's a new company venture or a painting or a book or anything, and I have a lot of creative projects I do.
I too have to battle with
that sense of is this really wanted and is this,
is this just wasting my time?
I think we're all haunted by that and I think I wanna normalize that. And I think this syncs up with your expectancy. Not only do you get to expect to create, but I wanna even take it one higher and say, you get to expect that it is not only needed and wanted, but it is desperately.
There is a, there is a space for you that only you can fill in this world. It might hit one person, it might have a ripple effect, it might hit thousands. We never know. We never know. That's the faith that I try and reach for in those days when I go, is anybody listening to me? Am I wasting my voice my time?
I had zero book sales this week. Is this even a book worth writing? You know, these are all questions I'm haunted with. And to be able to say, it gets to be whatever it is, and I am not
focusing on the numbers, but I get to just keep living in that true belief that who I am.
How I'm made is is desperately needed.
So as I continue to grow who I am and become more and more self-aware of my potential, I get to trust this not just serving me and me being more fulfilled and happy. I get to trust that it, it's going to be a ripple effect that's going to serve the world because I truly
believe we're all
connected.
Kate Shepherd: I, I a hundred percent feel that. I a hundred percent feel that. And I love that we're having this conversation out loud. 'cause I think for so long, um,
oh, sorry. Just one moment.
I have, I have another interview and she's early. Uh, sorry. I feel like For so long we've known that, like, I think you've alluded to that a few times here.
Like there's this knowing that we have, but we're not having the
conversation out loud. So we kind of just like sit with this feeling of like, I
feel like I have this other aspect of me that's not
being heard and, and so I, and I feel like
I've met like a sister or like a person on my squad or like, I just wanted to like
say that to you. What an
honor it is to connect with you and, and share this.
This This calling, I feel like it's a calling that we've both had to, to have this conversation out loud and to serve
that
in each other. And I wanna stay connected to you. I really, I
feel, I feel
a real kinship with you and I really appreciate
this time with you
Heather Penny: I do too. Kate, thank you so much. When we get
off this, uh,
podcast, I'll give you all my private stuff so that
you can text
me personally and everything else.
I'd love to
stay in touch,
Kate Shepherd: I would. Totally would love to stay in touch with you. Before we do that, before we go, uh, how, how can people find out, like I'm already like, oh my God,
I would love to work with this woman. She seemed ama So if you're listening
to this and you wanna
work with Heather, please
um, listen to what she's about to say.
'cause she's about to tell you exactly where to go
Heather Penny: Yeah,
Kate Shepherd: find all that information.
Heather Penny: I have, um, a large clientele now that I work with, so I only take a small amount of people that I work with personally, and I think that was the reason I started writing this book. I wanted to help put it out there. So I would say the best,
best
way to really get ahold what I'm doing is go
on my
Kate Shepherd: we're glitched. Are you still there?
Heather Penny: Are you here? Okay. The best way to really find out who I am, start with my website, heather penney.com. You'll get tons of free stuff. I give away blogs every week. Sign up for my weekly blog. I'll be telling you everything I'm doing. I've got a new book coming out where I'm gonna be speaking next, um, coaching groups.
I'm gonna be starting with other people that I'm coming across that are
like-minded, that I'm gonna do personal invitations to.
All these different things, um, are, are, are probably the, the weekly blog or the weekly newsletter is gonna help you stay connected with me in that. And then if you're ready to jump in today, but you're not able to get ahold of me and I'm not taking on clients right now yet, I'll be taking on some more a little bit.
You can start immediately with my book. And then what I did is I also created a coaching, a companion. I'll hold it up for those who might be seen, but. Book and it's, it's nice and lengthy, so it's gonna feel like a nice if you give yourself a good couple, about three months to read this, do a chapter a week.
It's set up to be that way. Then it's got a little, um, coaching companion, like a workbook that goes with it. That would be a good place to start. And I also am selling an e-course that goes with it. So you get me on a video like five minutes with every week. Do it with a friend, do it with someone else that is really wanting to have this conversation.
I'm setting it up for you guys to have the personal empowerment to step into that space and then come find me where I'm speaking, 'cause I'm doing more and more keynotes and workshops and conferences. And I would love to meet you guys. If, if you listen to this podcast, come up and say, Hey, I, I heard you on Kate Shepherd's podcast.
Just introduce yourself to me. I would love to give you a hug and just
say, thanks for coming.
Kate Shepherd: give you a hug too,
Thank you so
Heather Penny: Oh, you're welcome, Kate. Thanks for giving me the opportunity
of just talking with your audience and just sharing my heart.
Kate Shepherd: Oh, it's a joy for all of us.
Heather Penny: You're welcome.
Take care everyone.
Kate Shepherd: love
you
Heather Penny: I love.
You can find links to Heather and her work, including her book, the life you're made for on Kate shepherd, creative.com.
Under episodes, you'll find Heather's show notes page.
Connecting with this soft, quiet voice inside. Can guide us to the life that we were meant for. And I also want to remind you of my invitation to join us in activating your intuition and creativity workshop. It's an online virtual workshop that I hold every month. we're working to connect with that soft, quiet voice inside of ourselves. Learning how to hear what it says, how to understand what it's trying to express through us and learning. How to trust it and let it out. Everything that you need to know about it is on Kate Shepherd creative.com under work with me.
I love how Heather closed out this show. What we have inside of us is not only wanted, but desperately needed by the world. We don't get to know. Who or how many people are workable effect. But there absolutely is a ripple effect.
What might be available to us if we were to trust that. We really are all connected. And that what is inside of us? Is desperately needed by everything and everybody else in the rest of the world. trust in that ripple effect. And create from there.
A lot of us have. Deeply embedded, limiting beliefs. That are formed as a result of childhood or other trauma. and these can really impact our ability to create the life that we feel our Intuit might be available to us. It can feel a lot like being stuck in amaze sometimes. Through my work with activating intuition and creativity workshops. This podcast and the writing i'm doing i'm trying to help people come back into contact with that soft quiet voice that helps us navigate to the life of our dreams the life we're meant to live Heather and i talk about unhooking from the paradigm of fear and the rational mind that runs the show in our current society And instead how to tap into spirit creativity and intuition to live the lives that we were meant for This is a beautiful conversation as i was listening to it the image i had was of being on a great big adventure Without a map feeling your way around and stumbling upon a little hut where there was water and blankets for resting and maybe even an old wise soul to give you clues for the next leg of your journey It Really is how this episode feels to me So without further ado here's my conversation with dr heather penny
There are two ways to access these monthly intuition workshops
I can hardly wait to be in this workshop with you!
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Episode Summary:
In this honest and raw episode of Genius Moments, we dive into the profound world of creativity and the incredible impact it can have on your life and the world around you. In this mini-episode, hosted by a Kate Shepherd, you'll find yourself encouraged to unleash your creative gifts, express yourself authentically, and recognize the extraordinary power that resides within you.
In this mini episode
Unearth Your Creative Genius: This episode is dedicated to those who have felt a bit lost in their creative endeavours. Whether you're an artist, musician, writer, or creator of any kind, you may have faced challenges and doubts regarding the value of your work.
Navigating Creative Hurdles: The creative journey often involves hurdles, such as fear, self-doubt, and uncertainty. It requires bravery, practice, and resilience to express what's within you and to share your work with the world.
The Ripple Effect of Creativity: Your creative work can profoundly touch the lives of others, even when you don't realize it. Just as you've been moved by someone else's art, your creations can be a lifeline for someone in need, providing comfort, connection, and inspiration.
The Power of Gratitude: Expressing gratitude for the creative gifts that have touched your soul can shift your energy and deepen your connection with your inner self. Gratitude is the wellspring of your own creativity.
The Communion of the True Self: Connecting with your inner gratitude allows you to experience your true self, the radiant core of your being. This communion is what you truly yearn for, more than any external measures of success or achievement.
A Practice of Love and Connection: Challenge yourself to write a letter to the creator of something that profoundly affected you, even if they are famous or no longer alive. This simple act can strengthen your connection to your true self and create a ripple effect of love and light.
Why Listen to this Episode:
This episode is a beautiful reminder that your creative gifts are more valuable than you can imagine. By embracing your inner genius and sharing your creations, you can touch lives, bring comfort to others, and find a deeper connection with your true self. The practice of gratitude and connection explored in this episode offers a tangible way to rekindle your creative spark and create a ripple effect of love and inspiration in the world.
So, if you've ever felt uncertain about the value of your creative work or needed a reminder of the profound impact it can have, tune in to Genius Moments Episode 12 and be inspired to embrace your creative power.
Note: This episode includes a beautiful card reading. Here is a picture of the card Kate pulled for you
Stay tuned for the next episode featuring Dr. Heather Penny. In the meantime, take good care of yourself and keep making ripples of love and light in the world.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Happy Sunday to you or whatever day it -----------is of the week that you happen to be listening to this. Genius --moments episode. This is number 12 in this little series of mini episodes. These are little episodes that I create in between the bigger episodes, not every week, but whenever I feel. Called to say something every once in awhile, I have a series of thoughts that kind of bubble up. And there's this feeling that goes with them, that they need to be shared. They need to be said out loud. And so when I have that feeling, I sit down and I record you one of these genius moments episode. So I'm. Honored. And very happy to be sitting down with you and sharing this little moment together with you today. This episode is for you. If you have been feeling a little bit lost with your creative gifts. If you have something. In your life that you have always loved.
Maybe it's music or art or sculpture or architecture or basketry or poetry, novel writing, memoir, writing, whatever. Something. That you love. That you've been practicing and that you put out into the world. And you've just been feeling like, , no, one's listening. No, one's no one's watching. Why is it so hard to share my gift? There's the whole sort of set of hoops. We have to jump through to even honestly express what's inside of us. There's bravery required. There's. Mastery required. There's practice and failure. And.
That's just to get it out of us in the first place. And then there's a whole other set of hurdles that happens once we, once this thing exists and it's in the world. Around the sharing of it and the giving of it
It can be hard to trust that what is inside of us is actually needed or wanted by the outside world. You know, I often even just in what I described to you about my process with these genius moments episodes, I often feel the need to say something. And sometimes I think, God, I can't that's too vulnerable or that's too.
Specific or that's too. I don't want to sound like I'm preaching or telling people how to think or feel. But I'll have this feeling that, you know, I really need to say it. And so I will say it .
. And every single time. There are people who show up to let me know that it is exactly what they needed that day. And there's always this sort of sparkly. Sense of wonder both on their end and on my end. How could you have possibly known so accurately what I needed to hear and I didn't know. I was just honestly expressing this thing that was coming through me. And that is no different than what you have inside of you when it comes to your creative love.
I believe that you're hearing this podcast today because you needed to hear this. I believe that you're hearing this because there's some thing in you that the world really, really needs. That you've been holding back. And editing or curating or trying to make it perfect before you really share it. And the message that the universe wants you to hear today right now in this moment. Is . Please stop holding back. Please stop trying to make it look perfect or look acceptable or look a certain way even before you let it out. And just please, please let it out.
Please share the thing. I don't know if you're ever back in season two. I had one of my very favorite musicians. An award-winning Canadian musician, Dan Mangan on the show. He talked about music being like smoke signals, and what it feels like to be on both sides of it, both as a recipient of music as an audience member. , you know, listening to another musician and feeling really seen or heard or acknowledged by elder Eric and how profound and experienced that can be when a musician articulate something that you thought only you felt.
It really can save your life. I mean, people talk all the time about how that song saved my life. Right. There was a lyric in it and I just played it over and over again. And it got me through that time. And that's what art does. That's what the products of creativity dues they can, they can reach into our soul. And acknowledge our existence and, and remind us of what we're loved by. And he also talked about what it feels like to be on this side of it. You know, being the person who's creating the work and, and writing the songs that, then people. I mean, in his case, people tattoo his, his lyrics on their bodies. He talks about what that's like. That's a great episode, actually, if you haven't listened to that, go back and listen to Dan Mangan or go back and listen to it again. But no matter which side of it, you're on. The part of it, we don't have any control over is who our work reaches, how it will reach them when it will reach them. But we can be guaranteed that, that our work is going to reach people and it is more needed than we could possibly know.
And if you're feeling. That.
You don't know if anyone's listening, you don't know if. You're ever going to have your big moment. You don't know if you're ever going to get to a place where. You'll. Make a difference or your work will matter to somebody else. I want to let you know, you already have. If you've ever created anything. It already has had an impact on someone and we just, we just don't get to know. There's there's ways that you've touched people, that you will actually go to your grave, not knowing. And I think there's a certain beauty in that. Just, just trusting that the very fact that you expressed it means that it will have had an impact on someone else or will at some point have an impact on someone else. It's inevitable. It's the way it's like gravity. It's just a law of nature.
If you're feeling like what you're doing, doesn't matter or no-one's listening or it's not needed. I want you to do what my old friend Joseph does. I used to work with a really wonderful ceramic artist and jeweler at the Granville island public market in Vancouver. Which is sort of the heart of the city to me at Granville island is the heart of the city. It's of course a massive tourist destination. I think 11 million tourists go through there every year. And if you're lucky enough as I was for many years to be an artist to getting it, you get a little table. As a, they called us Dave vendors. You go in the morning and you set up your wares and you stand there all day and you've talked to people from all over the world. And you sell your work and it's a rollercoaster way of living. Cause you'd never, it's not like having a nine to five job. You'd never know. You know, there are days we used to call them. Zero days, days could go by where you didn't sell a single thing. And then there were other days. But you could sell thousands and thousands of dollars of your work and in a single day, and you just, you never knew what you were going to have, and it is a crazy way of living. And if you're an artist. Uh, in any kind or, or a self-employed person in any way, you know, the feast famine kind of deal that comes with that territory. At the market if you get to noon and you haven't had a sale, What can start to happen is you can start to, I feel like you almost get into this like energetic loop with it. You've kind of decided that you're not going to have a sale that day. And then you're somehow broadcasting that energy out into the world. And then you really do create that for yourself.
I don't know. I. It was a weird phenomenon that happened. . And you see, do you see sports teams doing this too? You know, they, the other team gets a couple of goals ahead. And all of a sudden the whole energy shifts and, and they become a losing team before they even have to be a losing team. I learned a lot about how to navigate that kind of energy from a really beautiful artist named Joseph . Joseph would make these really beautiful ceramic pots and every single one of them had a little lady bug on them. If you're familiar with Granville island, you probably know Joseph's work. And, and then he branched out into jewelry and he made these really beautiful silver pendants. And his work is really beautiful and celebrated, and he's an amazing character. He's funny and charismatic and people are very drawn to him. And whenever he was having a bad day, whenever he was feeling like. You know what nobody's buying my work. , and the thing that happens when you go through a little bit of a stretch where nobody's interested in your work, all of a sudden, as you think that's it. I've exhausted. My reach I've exhausted. My good work. All my good days are behind me. All my good work is behind me. I've lost my mojo. I mean, there's so many things that start to go through your head. And you got to get a handle on that. And I learned so much about how to do that from this beautiful artist, Joseph from the market. What Joseph would do when he was having a bad day. Was, he would leave his table and he would go to one of the little coffee shops that dotted the edges of the art market. And he would buy two lattes. And then he would walk around the market. And I think he would look around for somebody who he thought was also having a zero day or a bad day. Cause you kind of can see when someone's having a great day. Versus when someone's not having a great day in a market like that. And he would bring the two lattes over. And he would give one to that person and he would stand there at their table with them and talk to them until the latte was done. And then he would go back to his table. And I think I didn't study it scientifically, but I think every single time Joseph did that, the energy changed both for him. And for the person who gave the gift to. The, you know, that would kind of break the seal, whatever was happening with the no sale thing. It would break it and the spell would be gone. And then you could create yourself a good day. And I learned. So much about dealing with stuck energy from just that simple act of witnessing Joseph, do that. I wanted to share that with you and if you're feeling a little bit stuck, like your work doesn't matter, you're not sure if it's needed or even wanted by the world no, one's paying attention. It's not needed. Your best stuff is behind you. Why are you doing this? I'm crazy for continuing on with this dream. If you're feeling any of those things at this point in your life at all right now. . wanted to offer you a little practice. You could take with you into your week, this week. Think about.
Something that someone did. Said. Or created and they can be living or dead famous or not.
That touched your soul. That affected you. It could be a painting that you saw that gave you an experience. It could be a lyric of a song that reached into your soul. And pulled you out of a dark time. It could be a piece of jewelry that you purchased for yourself that had a profound impact on you because it meant something, it symbolized something to you. It could be anything. And then I want you to write a letter to the person who created that thing. Telling them.
Your experience of their work, telling them your experience of their gift. And if this is a person that's alive, even if they're famous and you think they're never going to get it, send them the letter. That's the gift. That's that's you. Bringing them a coffee, the way Joseph would have brought some water coffee. On so many levels. This will do so many things for you. It will shift your own energy around the value of gifts.
It will connect you to your inner gratitude, which is the wellspring of your own creativity. It's where it all lives and Springs from.
I promise you. That if you do this right, write this person a letter, write the creator of this thing that affected you. A letter. It doesn't actually matter if you send it or not. It's magical if you send it, but it doesn't really even matter. It's the act of writing. It's the act of contacting your gratitude. You could even sit there, write them the letter and then close your eyes and imagine beaming the letter at them. If this person is no longer living.
You'll notice if you do this, there's a little thing that happens when you sit there, you close your eyes, you imagined beaming this letter at them. And at a certain point in that imagination. You will find a little smile will bubble up from your heart. Wait for that moment because it's going to happen. It happens every single time. And I believe that the mechanism what's happening there when you feel that little smile is that, that means that that other being received your gratitude on an energetic level, in a plane that we maybe can't see and understand. That's where I believe that smile comes from. It's like, It's like message received. That's like the little thing, you know, sent and received sound. That's what that smile is. So do that.
And if you do do this.
And you feel brave enough post about it on social media and use the hashtag creative genius ripple effect.
You'll be amplifying the effect of your ripple effect. . When you share your story like that. In a public way. It allows other people who are seeing it too. Be awakened by your story. So you tell a story about how a lyric touched your soul. And then in reading it, I moved maybe to tears even, and then it reminds me of a time that I was moved by something. And then maybe I see you sending that artist a letter. And I think, well, I should send a letter to, and then all of a sudden we've kind of started this chain. Ripple effect. Beautiful. Beautiful. Ripple effect of, of love and light and gratitude moving. And that's how we move stuck energy. And that's how we remind ourselves of what we really are.
And the bonus sweet, sweet bonus of all of this is that that will inevitably remind you. That absolutely. Of course your work is needed. Of course you are needed. And wanted. More than you could ever even imagine.
When you allow yourself to access that part of yourself, that feels grateful that had that. Tender soulful experience. Experiencing somebody else's art, somebody else's offering in the world. You are in communion with this soft, quiet part of yourself. That. You're yearning to be more deeply connected with all the time. That's the thing you're yearning for. You're not actually yearning for. Success as an artist or a bigger house or.
A bigger salary or more vacations or.
More freedom or more time, or you're not actually yearning for any of those things. Those are all bait and switch. What you're really yearning for more than anything else is to be in communion with the soft, quiet, pulsing, radiant. Self, your true self, your capital S self. I call it. And when you allow yourself to write a letter from that place to somebody else you're writing from that place in you to that place in someone else. You strengthen that part of you, that you're inviting that part of you to take a large step forward and to stand taller within you. And ultimately. When we do that enough times, it begins to run the show of our lives. And that's when the real magic starts to happen. And that's what we're doing . Every month when we practice activating intuition and creativity in the online workshop that I do. We're doing another one on Friday. It's not too late to sign up.
You can head over to Kate Sheppard, creative.com and look for the online virtual Lovette. It's easy to sign up. If you, just know that that's something that you want to join in and be a part of every month. You can sign up for the Patrion because at the colorful community tier of the creative genius patron, My virtual workshops are included in your membership and right there is the cost of admission alone. And there's other bonuses that you get at that level too. So it's kind of a no brainer. , and this is exactly the kind of work that we're doing. I give you. Different ways of. Accessing this part of yourself every month that you can practice and bring into your life and have tangible experiences like that little smile that comes when you send the letter. That's something that you'll actually start to know how to do intuitively on your own by habit when we build those habits together.
So I really, really hope you join us. In that community and in those workshops
So that was what I wanted to bring you in this little mini genius moments episode. And the last thing I want to do today is , pull a card from my beautiful deck. This is a deck. Called. B you do you for you? I saw Jonathan van ness pole. Uh, a card from this deck for somebody recently. And. I was so moved by it. That I actually had to go online and find out who created this deck and order it for myself and it arrived the other day. And I really love it. And talk about ripple effect. It also made me realize that I actually need to get on the creative genius deck. I have been wanting to create a deck for us for a really long time. Inspired by the angel cards that I pull for every episode. So that's coming. I don't know when that's coming, but it's coming. I'm in the meantime, I'm going to pull a , card from this deck.
I am going to take a picture of this and put it in the show notes on Kate Sheppard, creative.com for this episode, just look for the episodes page on Kate shepherd, creative.com and look for genius moments. Number 12. If you want to see a picture of the card, I just pulled. It's a beautiful heart that has a. Like thick pen and ink drawing of a woman's face with her eyes closed. She's got big, thick, beautiful eyelashes. And she looks very peaceful and resting. And, but a little bit serious almost like she's deep in thought or deep in meditation. With her eyes closed and the words on the card are I find love everywhere I go. It's all around me.
That is absolutely true. You are the love, you are the ripple effect and there can't be a ripple unless you create it. So I want to remind you. That's why you're here. You're here to make ripples. So go out there. My loves. And make some waves. Then I'll talk to you again on Friday with our. Amazing guest. Dr. Heather penny. In the meantime, take good care of yourself. And I hope to see you at the virtual workshop on Friday.
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]]>Author Martha Anne Toll shares her journey of persistence and creativity. Despite fairly constant rejection, Martha pursued her love of writing for 20 years. She emphatically shares with us the importance of tuning into our inner voice the one that urges us to keep going when things get tough.
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Author Martha Anne Toll whose essays and book reviews have graced prestigious publications such as NPR, the Washington Post, The Millions, and who's recent book was shortlisted for The Gotham Award, shares her decades long roller coaster journey of persistence and creativity.
Despite fairly constant rejection, Martha pursued her love of writing for over 20 years. She emphatically shares with us the importance of tuning into our inner voice the one that urges us to keep going when things get tough.
We explore the significance of loneliness and yearning in creativity and the creative process as well and touch on where she is with her second novel, her passion for mentoring other writers, and the value in "the rests" of creativity.
Her writing reflects her deep insights, empathy, and her ability to connect with readers on a profound level and her wisdom and the learnings from her journey so far, provide valuable insights and uplifting inspiration for aspiring writers and creative individuals who are living their own ups and downs along the way as they preserve to find their own paths to success.
What We Talk About:
Martha's wisdom and journey provide valuable insights for aspiring writers and creative individuals seeking to persevere and find their own paths to success.
Embracing the Journey: Martha Anne Toll's Inspiring Story of Perseverance & The Creative Spirit
In the world of creativity, few stories are as inspiring as that of Martha Anne Toll. Her journey is a testament to the power of persistence, the magic of embracing one's inner voice, and the art of finding creative fulfillment even in the face of constant rejection. Join us as we delve into Martha's remarkable story and glean valuable lessons on how to keep your creative flame alive.
About Martha Anne Toll: Martha Anne Toll is not an overnight success story. Her path to becoming a renowned writer was paved with two decades of rejection, but during that time, she never lost sight of her passion. After receiving her law degree from Boston University School of Law, she embarked on a journey that would ultimately lead her to the world of writing. Her essays and book reviews have graced prestigious publications such as NPR, the Washington Post, The Millions, and many more. Her writing reflects her deep insights, empathy, and her ability to connect with readers on a profound level.
The Miracle of the Inner Voice: One of the most striking aspects of Martha's journey is the "miracle" that accompanies her every step of the way. She describes it as the little voice inside that whispers, "keep going." This inner voice is a constant companion that helps her navigate through adversity and rejection. Martha's story reminds us that inspiration is often found within ourselves, and we must listen carefully to that inner guidance.
Incorporating Writing into Life: Martha's commitment to her craft is awe-inspiring. Even when her writing career faced countless rejections, she found ways to incorporate writing into all aspects of her life. This dedication allowed her to continue doing what she loved, purely for the love of it. Martha's story teaches us that creativity can flourish when it's woven into the fabric of our daily lives.
Keeping Creativity Alive and Fresh: Creativity can wane during times of rejection and failure, but Martha found ways to keep it alive and flowing. She shares practical insights and ideas to help aspiring writers and artists keep their creative practices fresh, no matter how long it takes to achieve their big break.
Martha's Three Muses: Music, Discipline, and Memory: In her novel "The Three Muses," Martha introduces us to her creative muses: Music, Discipline, and Memory. These muses inspire her and help her maintain her creative spirit. Learning about these muses can offer valuable guidance on nurturing your own creative loves.
Starting in the Middle: One of Martha's unconventional yet liberating pieces of advice is to start in the middle of creative projects. Instead of obsessing over a perfect beginning, she encourages us to dive right into the heart of our creative endeavors. This approach allows for freedom and exploration, leading to unexpected and beautiful outcomes.
Paying It Forward: Martha's journey has also inspired her to give back. She mentors other writers, sharing her experiences and insights with those following in her footsteps. Her willingness to support and encourage others underscores the importance of paying it forward in our creative communities.
Embracing "The Rests": Martha's wisdom extends to recognizing the beauty in "the rests" of creativity. Just as music finds its magic in the pauses, our creative journeys can benefit from moments of reflection and rejuvenation. Her perspective encourages us to embrace these pauses as essential parts of our creative process.
Martha Anne Toll's remarkable journey is a source of inspiration and valuable lessons for anyone pursuing their creative dreams. Her story reminds us that persistence, listening to our inner voices, and finding creative fulfillment in everyday life can lead to profound success. As Martha continues to celebrate the anniversary of her debut novel and works on her second, her story serves as a beacon of hope for all creatives on their own unique journeys.
FULL TRANSCRIPT
You know they say what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. --And this is certainly true for our guests today. Martha and toll didn't start truly pursuing her life, long love of writing until her forties. And even then she lived through nearly 20 years of rejections before her big break as a novelist. Currently she is celebrating the anniversary of her debut novel. Finishing her second and partway through her third. She shares with us a peek at the many things she learned and gained over 20 years of anguished failed attempts and rejections from publishers. This episode is one you'll want to listen too closely. And maybe even twice the second time with a pen in your hand, because some of the things she says have the potential to be transformative moments. It really felt like.
A, masterclass in writing
We talk about how she found ways to incorporate writing and to all aspects of her life. So that even when her writing her wasn't taking off, she could still spend lots of time doing this thing that she loved just for the love of it. She tells us what she does to keep writing alive and fresh and flowing. She shares about the three muses from her book, the three muses and what they mean to her. She shares so many practical insights and ideas things that anybody who's aspiring to be a writer of any kind in any genre can do. Two. Really keep your practice fresh and alive and going. Even if there's a long spell before you get your own big break.
So the theme for season three of creative genius is learning to see. I have this really rich, creative, intuitive, inner life. And how do I pay that forward? Part of that for me, means helping to mentor and help others learn to see and feel with this super power we have inside of us that we call intuition or creativity. And so I started doing these workshops. In person at first in my studio, north Vancouver. But a lot of you, when you found out I was doing this. He asked me to take them online and offer them virtually, which I did. And the first one was scheduled for September. We had some minor technical issues and we rescheduled for early October. And it just took place and it was absolutely magical. My marker for whether or not a workshop is successful is if I make anybody cry.
And several of the participants emailed me directly afterwards to say, they had tears welling up, at certain points in the workshop. And that's my goal. We're looking to reach that part of ourselves. That is just so relieved that you've noticed it again. That the tears flow. So I really feel like this workshop is a must. They're included in my Patrion. I have a tier called colorful community. And inside that too, you get access to this monthly workshop. It's part of a package. You also get the bonus episodes and early access to episodes. The guided meditations, the worksheets, the journal prompts, all the things that I create.
For you to support you on your own journey to activate your intuition and your creativity. I want to share with you. If you'll indulge me and review one of the participants left the other day after taking the workshop, her name is Beth Suter and she wrote life-changing. Kate's creativity. Workshop is a must on caps, even as someone who is a working artist and does their best to make creating a priority. I can still get hung up in the ego thinking mind. Kate is an intentional and thoughtful teacher. Using simple art supplies and an easy to follow along exercise. She guides you to tapping into your own inner wisdom. It's amazing. What setting aside some time to get connected and listen to your higher self can do. I had so many aha moments of clarity during the workshop. What I love the most is this class is for everyone. If you have the desire to cut through the noise and get right to the callings of your heart. This workshop is for you. Kate is inspiring, loving, encouraging. You will walk away from the class, feeling lighter, joyful, and more tuned in with your intuition. I can't speak highly enough of Kate and her offerings. Thank you so much, Beth. And to everybody else who came to the very first workshop that we offered in October, I will be holding them in the lead up to the full moon. The next one is scheduled for October 27th. So if you haven't signed up for the Patrion yet now is a great time to do that. Or you can sign up for this workshop as a one-off, which you can do on my website, Kate shepherd, creative.com.
During this conversation with Martha, the margins of my notebook filled up very quickly. There are so many things that she said. That are profound. And illuminating. And really, really useful for anybody who's serving this creative muse inside of themselves, but who doesn't always know how to let it out.
Martha graduated from Yale college and received her law degree from Boston university school of law, her essays and book reviews appear regularly in NPR, the Washington post, the millions Los Angeles review of book. Point magazine as well as Lilly, the rumpus bloom, scoundrel time, music and literature. Words without borders Heck magazine washington independent review of books . She's been a nominator and critic for NPR annual book concierge since 2017. She has a humongous heart and a lot of really valuable insights For the aspiring writer Memoir novelist And aspiring artist i hope you love this conversation with martha as much as i enjoyed having it With her
Kate Shepherd: Martha thank you so much for making time to sit down and chat with me today. I'm really happy to meet you.
Martha Anne Toll: Thank you. Kate. It's such an honor and I'm really excited about what you're doing and I get that it, it's a lot of time in a really busy schedule, so I appreciate it.
Kate Shepherd: you. Yeah, I was saying in the pre-chat before we got started, how it creating this body of work as it's turning into, 'cause it's kind of growing beyond just the podcast feels kind of like a compulsion, it feels like a choice that I don't really get to make. Like it's kind of happening through me on its own.
And I think a lot of creatives have that experience with, with creating and
yeah, I'm excited to talk to you about
that, how that shows up for you.
Before we do that, I wondered if you would, well I was thinking what's a beautiful, 'cause you've, you've, you're a writer and your writing is just so beautiful.
And I was thinking, okay, what's a poetic way to ask you this question? So I came up with this. If you were riding an elevator up to a small little gathering of people on a roof with little fairy lights and a little roof garden, and you were in the elevator with somebody and you were describing what you do and your work and who you are, but you only had the ride up to the top to sort of let them know who you are, what would you, what would you tell them?
Martha Anne Toll: That's a tough one. well, I, am really interested in love and death and I'm really interested in memory and time. So I think all of my writing takes those ideas into account. I think they are wellsprings for all of us creative people. I think we're all creative, so I'll just say everybody, and I'm super interested in the, in the arts.
if you had to say, Well, and maybe you can't, I can't do this, but if you had to say you had to pick one kind of part of the arts, is there one that pulls you more than other? . Tell us about that.
Well, I had a deep background, a training in music. I studied the viola professionally. The viola is the alto voice of the string section of the orchestra, string quartet. also studied ballet as a very young child, and my book, the Three Muses, which I think we'll be talking about is deeply about ballet.
But I really, really feel that.
my voice is in writing. Writing is, it took me a long time to be able to say this out loud and to actually, get a book published, although I've been writing my whole life. So I would have to say it's writing for
me.
Kate Shepherd: you say you were writing your whole life, like what? What does that mean? Because I hear people say that, does that mean like you journaled or you would write po? Like what Or all of it? Like what does that mean for you?
Martha Anne Toll: Well, I was, so two things that really feel now why I became a writer. One is this insane memory, not only of my own life, but of everybody around me. So holding the memories of people in my family and, Friends and I just have like an incredible memory. , I do remember learning how to read. I remember that I struggled with the word half on a first grade vocabulary test 'cause it had that silent E but words were a huge part of the household that I grew up in.
My parents were really interested in words. My mother was a professional book editor and my dad was a lawyer who used words in his trade, but also was a really fine writer. There were dictionaries and encyclopedias. , I did journal throughout, probably into my early thirties. I'm one of four sisters we used to put on plays. I was the person who wrote the plays. I mean, I just paid a lot of attention words. I kept lists of vocabulary words that I was learning. Um, I remember where I was when I learned specific words. and then as in my career, I became a lawyer.
But that wasn't really an accident. Lawyers are very word oriented. My, my professional jobs in social and racial justice were all around the written word. A lot of, um, policy oriented work that required writing. So I'm, that's what I'm gonna really been writing my whole life. And I feel like it's surprising to me, but I, I kind of understand it now that I have always read like a writer.
I, I read a lot, but I've always, always want to know what is that author doing? And I, again, have this incredible memory for when I read which books, when, and that kind of thing.
Kate Shepherd: What's that like? I have a, as somebody with an, I could say a terrible memory, like I have a great memory for actually that's so not true. I have a great memory. Like I just know things, but like I can't recall the way that you can. So what's that like to hold all of that? Where do you put it? Where does it live in your
Martha Anne Toll: Well,
Kate Shepherd: do you
access it?
Martha Anne Toll: I feel like I'm gonna be writing the rest of my life trying to understand this and in many ways, um, my book three uses, which is about, a Holocaust survivor whose his name in the old country was Yanko. And he's standing in line with his family for the gas chamber. And his mother saves his life by telling the SSS officer that he can sing.
And so he sings and the SSS officer takes him out of line and he spends the rest of the war, singing for the Commandant. Of this concentration camp, which is the place where his mother and brother were murdered. So he's essentially singing for the murderer. He loses his entire extended family in the Holocaust and eventually makes it to America.
Music is completely fraught for him. , it's the means to his saved, but also the means to the killing of his family. And yet he has this role that he understands, which is, it didn't make this up. This is how real Holocaust survivors feel and felt, the role of holding the memory for the rest of his family.
He's the only survivor he has. He has some role. He doesn't really understand what that means for him, but he becomes a psychiatrist. And he falls in love with a ballerina who is American. , she's dancing in New York. He becomes John in the New country America. He doesn't realize that the ballerina Katja Semanova is actually deeply enmeshed with her co-creator and choreographer
and that is a very fraught relationship. It's abusive in many ways, but also she is, in many ways her choreographer's memory because he doesn't record any of his work. He's a generation older and ballerina's and ballet dancer's hold memory in their bodies. So I can't answer it for myself, but I can say that Katja held the memory of his work and her body.
She is a memory keeper. And John is also a memory keeper, and I'm still trying to understand this in myself, but I understood it enough to. Create these characters. and you know, writing is, can be very unconscious. I'm not sure I totally understood that as I was writing, but now I see it a little more clearly.
Kate Shepherd: , I think about you as the, as the vehicle for this. 'cause I think creativity has a, I see it as like an intelligent being, right? The thing that wants to make the choreographer create a dance. And the dance, the thing that makes the dancer wanna dance and the musician want, and the writer wanna write, and the painter
It's almost like something comes through you and you don't really, you could fight it, right, but that would hurt, right? Like that would cause you all the, so you, it it's almost like it's got a life of its own. And so as you were saying that, I was thinking
What is it trying to do through you as it brings this story and these characters to life? And, and you've touched on it a little bit when you were saying like, I don't, I didn't really know how that unconscious piece as I got started, but what does it feel like to give yourself to that phenomenon and where do you find yourself in it?
And how much do you control and how much do you let go? And what's that journey been like for you?
Martha Anne Toll: Well, first of all, I love the idea that your podcast is about creativity. And I deeply believe that of the 7 billion people on this planet, everyone is creative. I, I just believe that's part of the human spirit. And people express creativity in different ways. and the arts is obviously not the only way to express creativity.
All kinds of people bring all kinds of creative work to their jobs, to raising a family, to their relationships, to their friendships. These are all creative endeavors. I'm gonna say this in a, like a, a negative way, but I, it's the way I think about it. I didn't do great in ballet. I don't have the body for it.
And music turned out to be too. I felt that my ear advanced faster than my fingers and body. And I got to a point where I felt like I was at impasse and I always, and I knew, I played with a lot of people who are now professional musicians and they had something I didn't have, which was this call. And somehow I feel called in writing, which again, I didn't really understand, but I learned about it.
This is, here's the negative part. I mean, it was negative feeling at impasse. I basically had 20 years of rejections in fiction land I got this book , my debut book published. I was really in grief, I'm sorry, that's a big word. But that's how I felt. It was really despairing the interesting thing to me, when I would stand outside of myself was , well, I'm not giving up.
Like I would cry for three days and then I would keep writing. I'm like, what is wrong with me? Why do I keep doing this? And then I realized, I must really wanna do this 'cause the rest of the world is not acknowledging this but that's where I guess I understood this creative drive. I is something that I pretty much have to
Kate Shepherd: do feel
Martha Anne Toll: years
Kate Shepherd: is a long time to be getting rejection after rejection and I mean, you look at anybody's success story and it's, you know, we all have years and years and years.
There's very few people actually write the book and are like, oh no, what that, I just wrote it and there it is. But like, it's not the norm. But when you're living it on the ground and it's your day-to-day life and you're, you have to have a job and you have to pay the bills and you're . Try, your life is ticking by, and you're like, wait a minute.
My life is, is going by Time is passing me here. And like, you know, I've even had the thought not that long ago where I was like, well, if I don't hit it, you know, hit my dream soon. Like, there's not gonna be left much time to enjoy it. Like, all those weird things that go through your head about like, what, why is this ha, why is this taking so long?
Martha Anne Toll: had a full-time day job that was very engaging and very meaningful to me. And and I was raising two children. And so I felt like, I kept saying, I wish I had more time to write. I wish I had more time to write, but then I would say to myself, let's recognize that work is a place of affirmation.
And I absolutely understood in real time that it . We are affirmed at work. We are among the lucky few. So many people are oppressed in their jobs and or have, are not, don't have the opportunity for meaningful work. So I was incredibly grateful to have a place of affirmation, so that was very sustaining for me.
The other thing is, it doesn't make any sense because there's all this despair and self-loathing that comes with rejection, but there was also this little voice saying, you know, you're just gonna have to keep going. You know, this, this has meaning to me. I'm just gonna have to keep going. I don't, I still don't understand it, but I was like, you know, like a cartoon figure, like you get flattened and then like bounce back up and, and I was almost 65 when my first novel was published and I, I kept saying, I'm gonna die before I get a book published.
And I still feel this incredible sense of urgency about my work. I have a lot more I wanna write and, I mean, there was, you know, just so much despair and I'm like, what am I whining for? I have such a nice life and I love my job, and the best advice that I got was to get 100 rejections a year.
And I love that advice because it really switches the script and it normalizes rejection, which I think is very normal. It's very, very normal in writing land. I think it's normal in all of the arts, but it's also plenty normal in other things. I'm watching my adult children, you know, launch their careers.
It's hard. They're, they're qualified to do what they wanna do, but I see that it's really hard. We, you know, are obstacles all over the place for all kinds of people, so that's part of, I. It's some kind of acceptance. I think that things are gonna be hard, , and I feel like, you know, I've had a charmed life by comparison to most of humanity.
I do need to
Track 1: that
Kate Shepherd: formula of, of connecting with gratitude and realizing what you do have in this moment, whether it's charmed or not. Actually, there's always, I feel like I, when I look even in the dark times, there's always something good. There's always a gift. There's always,
and it is
Martha Anne Toll: Yeah.
Kate Shepherd: reframe, but you said something a minute ago about that little voice, that little voice that was like, get up.
That I feel like there's magic in that voice and we skip over that so often. It's like this miracle hiding right there in plain sight. Can you tell us more about your relationship with that voice? Because it's not just about getting, making you stand up with re when with rejections like that is always whispering to us in my experience and I, I'm curious, like what else has that voice said to you and how have you cultivated your connection with that
Martha Anne Toll: a couple of thoughts on that. I think that writing is, , like some people, say I write for therapy. Don't write because I need to use my writing for therapeutic reasons, but it is very meaningful part of what I learned was I could appreciate writing in whatever format. You know, I got really engaged in book reviewing and that allowed me to use my writing to put something out in the world and give people, you know, stuff about books that I love and it felt more outward focused.
So that, that was one very, very helpful thing. And the other thing was appreciating, um, The books that I was reading and trying to get more engaged with some of the, the authors. And I'm still still trying to do this of books that I absolutely love and, um, the little voice is hard to connect with. And so I guess what I'll say is the three muses in my book, three muses are song, discipline and memory.
And those three muses are incredibly important to me. I am kind of fanatic about discipline and so I talk a lot and I think a lot about work. For me, creativity is very bound up with work and I do feel that I have an understanding of creativity that is don't wait for inspiration to strike.
Honestly, inspiration is quite rare and very, very accidental in my experience, but it's also belief of mine. You know, people, great scientists who have made great discoveries, many, many of those have come by accident. You know, the discovery penicillin is, 'cause he was, had his Petri dish in the window and he noticed it was growing mold, or I just remember 10th grade chemistry the guy invented at the benzene ring, which is the.
Chemical formula for benzene, you know, it came to him in a dream. So I just do feel like a lot of these things are quite accidental. We often don't end up in fields that we expected that we thought we were gonna end up in. so I'm a a lot about work, about getting in the chair and writing , and I don't think it matters what writing I'm doing.
Like if it's a book review, or a personal essay, I think that informs my fiction and vice versa. So one way that that little voice speaks to me is get your tuition in the chair and work. So, not very romantic, it's how I
Kate Shepherd: romanticize it a lot. Like, and I, I feel like that's ego kind of like getting us actually away from it, right? Like that it is a very practical, like
it's just an energy that needs to flow and the best way to let it flow
is to just sit your
butt down and like you said, and do it.
Martha Anne Toll: and then I guess the other thing is this fiction that writers use, which I didn't realize I was doing, but it's actually very, very helpful about what's on the page is separate from, from you, like once a, a recently a writer describe this to me really clearly. I asked him how he wrote memoir, and he said, oh, once it's on the page, that's a character.
Then I'm distanced from it, I had this insight that kind of makes a lot of sense to me. When my older daughter was four, I looked at her and I noticed we, oh, she's wearing a red turtleneck. You know, it's funny, I, I have a red turtleneck and she's wearing jeans and I'm wearing jeans.
It's, she's really weird. She dresses like I do, and then I'm like, oh, I'm person buys our clothing. And it was like, it was my recognition. Here's this little person who's totally separate from me, but obviously we have a connection because she dresses like I do. And I feel there's some, I still can't quite connect the dots to creativity, but writing a book is a little bit like that for me.
I wanna be at arm's length from my fiction, but of course I'm writing it, so of course it reflects me and, but it's still like a really kind of almost voodoo, weird, mysterious thing that I don't quite
Kate Shepherd: How do. you, when you've got your butt in your, your tushes in the chair and you're sitting down to write every day, and is that what you do? Like I was, 'cause I was gonna ask you about your sort of daily,
Martha Anne Toll: I mean, when I had a full-time job, it was sort of, Really around the edges when I could do it. You know, weekends when my kids had left home for college. A lot of weekend stuff and a lot of just squeezing it in where I could. I do try to write in the mornings, but I've been lucky enough with three muses to kind of be on the road a lot and be doing a lot of publicity and that I will, I will say that has not been conducive to a regular schedule, but I try to write every day. But I'm also, I just, I also feel like, you know, you can also kill something that way.
Like, oh my God, I didn't write today. I am, I'm doomed for failure. You know, you just do what you can.
Kate Shepherd: Would you say that it's about listening to that little voice again to find out like, oh, today's a day. I actually want you to get up at four o'clock in the morning and write
because I have something to say at four o'clock in the morning today. But if you start getting up at four o'clock in the morning every day, just because once I told you it was a good idea, like you said you kill, like that becomes this formula that's like not rooted in the thing itself
anymore.
Martha Anne Toll: Yeah. I really want my mornings to write, but sometimes that can't happen. Or you're tired or you sleep in and then I'm like, okay, it's three o'clock. You could still get something done. You know? 'cause I'm, I am retired from my, I, I'm not literally retired 'cause I'm working full-time as a writer, but for my previous job and, and so my structuring my time is still, is still a challenge for me.
But I do think we need a structure. I do better in structure, so I do try to do that, but when I can't do it, I either try a different time of the day or I'm like, okay, today's not gonna work. But in general, I think the discipline of some kind of regular writing practice is really
useful.
Kate Shepherd: I'm really interested in writing too, and strengthening that muscle. I've always said I can't, I'm not a writer. My mother's a writer. My father's a writer, but I don't have it in me. And then the other day I was oh no, you're a writer.
You just are too scared to do it. and I, I, for me, it's not fiction. Like I hear loud and clear from you how fiction is, I think you said it's the air that you breathe. Fiction is the air that you breathe. Like it's your love. And for me, I feel like it's gonna be more like memoir storytelling. I don't, I don't know.
But I'm very curious about when a writer sits down to write, what do you, where do you start? What do you say to yourself? What's the, how do you get that
going?
Martha Anne Toll: Well, I have several sort of practical, suggestions. First is I feel that writing begets writing. So for me, I write in front of a screen. Some people prefer to write longhand, but when I'm in front of the screen, one sentence will tend to suggest the next sentence. And so my role for myself is I hope to be one sentence ahead of myself.
So I'm a novel writer and a novel is overwhelming. So I try not to think about the scope of the novel and like, will I have another sentence for this chapter? I'm, I'm revising my second book and I am very close to the end of this revision, and I am a little bit on an impasse. So one thing I do when I'm at an impasse is Skip to another part of the manuscript. I'm, I'm really big on don't, don't start in the beginning. Don't try to finish it. The middle is a better place to start because you're less pressuring to yourself about . You know, Oh. my God, is this a beautiful beginning and is somebody gonna be taken in by this?
Second of all, um, or third of all, I don't know where I am, so I, I, there are people I know who turn off their, who stop writing for the day with half a sentence because then they're sure.
when they sit down again, they'll able finish that sentence and that's enough to get them going. Which I think that's a really interesting idea.
I haven't had needed to do it but but I do feel like you only need to be one sentence ahead, what whatever the scale of the project is. And the other thing is there's this great French expression called, um, , which is the spirit of the staircase. And I do believe that when you're really at impasse, get up and leave.
Because sometimes on the stairwell down from your writing place or the stairwell down from your house, whatever, or you're in the shower, a solution will present itself. So I don't like that idea of like, oh, I'll just sit here until I fix it. Because sometimes you can't fix it and you have to wait.
You need some period of time, you need a different approach. You need to write a different, do a different project. I like having different writing projects going so I can work on something else, you know, when I'm stuck on this one. So I think there are like little tricks we can do, but I think thinking of the largest hugest thing, like, wow, I'll write a memoir is sometimes overwhelming, but wow, I might be able to write about what happened yesterday or when I was 10.
That's certain thing I wanna write about.
Kate Shepherd: Yeah. For You where is it. coming from? Like I, this is about for fiction, I've always been fascinated and very curious about where does it come from? where do you feel like it's coming from?
Like does it feel like it's coming from and your body when you're doing it?
Martha Anne Toll: Yeah, this is, the part that I'm probably least articulate about to the extent I'm articulate about anything. I always want to write fiction. I wanted to write fiction from the time I was five years old. through my twenties and thirties, I always had this, I have all these words in my disposal and I have no idea how to put them into a story.
and then this is the part that I don't really understand. My mother died very suddenly in 1999 and after her death, the floodgates opened. I'm still trying to understand this, but had ideas for novels. So I wrote a novel, absolutely terrible, but it just poured out of me. You know, it's never gonna see the light of day, but it was sort of I don't know where it was coming from. I really. I really can't say, that means I was in my early forties before I felt like I had anything of fiction that could get on the page. And I have tremendous concern about plot. Like there's some fiction writers who map up the whole thing.
I'm not that person. I'm working in chaos, very iteratively, with no plot for a long time. So, and I think either way is fine. cause again, I think plot sometimes rises outta the manuscript. You can explore the characters in writing exercises. Like if you're writing a memoir, I'd love that advice that the person writing a memoir is still a character and you can explore what that person wants to say.
But I have so little concrete advice about fiction 'cause I can't understand it. with three muses. I had written a bunch of novels before that that had not been published. I wanted a vehicle to tell a story and I, I found these three muses by accident, song, discipline and memory, and I was like, oh my God, that's, they were meant for me
you know, they're part of a Greek tradition that I didn't know about, but they spoke to me so loudly and they, that became an organizing principle for the, for the novel. So that was extremely helpful duet for one, which is coming out in 2025. I know what sparked that novel. I had a, , training in classical music.
I opened the newspaper one day and I saw an obituary of a woman pianist who had just died and she was part of a husband and wife two team, and they had performed as two pianists around the world. And I just thought to myself, what. Happens to that husband. He is bereaved of his spouse, but he also lost his professional career.
That was the starting point of that novel. It was, is literally a newspaper. Arbitrary, but, and so some of that means you have to be open to stuff. You have to be figure out what sings to you. But I'm, I'm kind of wandering around here
Kate Shepherd: Well,
Martha Anne Toll: have good
Kate Shepherd: an unfair question
because it's like asking what is creativity or what, you know. I mean, we wanna know, and if you, you know, if you ever study any of the sort of like ancient traditions and we're talking about reality or truth or love or any of these things, and all the great teachers say like, you can't.
Say it. Like if that's part of the definition of it is that it is, it is ineffable and but where there's a
yearning because it is us and we are it, and there is this beautiful union that's possible when between us and it,
you know, it's a formless meeting
the form, right. And it, it's the union itself, but it's an invisible thing.
So it's kind of an unfair question to to ask you how does it work ,
Track 1: I just wanted to quote this 'cause I thought it was so perfect for your podcast. a Portuguese novelist that I am still need to read his work. I haven't read it. His name is Fernando Pa poa.
I'm not sure how he pronounces it, but he's one of Portugal's greatest writers. there was an article that. quote, it said like, this PO's belief, like all feelings loneliness for him is nothing more than one of the sources of creation.
Kate Shepherd: I love that.
Track 1: And it's really interesting, you know, like, we like loneliness and yearning and longing.
Just what you were saying. Is a huge part
of creativity,
Kate Shepherd: I feel like we have evolved to be a people that have this aversion to discomfort of any kind, and we're constantly wanting to fill it with, well take a drug for that, or, you know, drink a bunch of alcohol for this, or, you know, whatever. All of the, all, look at all the ways that we numb ourselves to discomfort.
But actually, you know, when my, when my kids are bored, I get excited. 'cause I'm like, and I tell them like, you should be getting, like, something cool is about to happen. Boredom is always a precursor to creativity. it's creativity. Getting restless and saying,
The reason I started this podcast is looking around, I saw that and I said this a thousand times, I feel like humanity is glitching because we've become disconnected from creativity. And part of that is we, our unwillingness to feel the difficult, uncomfortable feelings.
I,
think so much of that can be on the other side of a practice.
And so it is really uncomfortable to sit down and write when you, when you don't know what's coming or you, you don't, you know, this is your 19th year of writing and still no one has said yes to you. And . Yeah, but there's magic,
right? In the, in the, okay, but what if I just keep going? What if I just keep giving myself to it?
Track 1: I agree with everything you just said. I might say that as I definitely believe in embracing pain and running, going toward it. And I, I think you, you basically said the same thing just now that there's an aversion to it.
I think it's, um, it's one of my kind of really why I write so much about death. I feel like it's, it's inevitable. we're gonna lose our loved ones. Many of us have lost loved ones and if we haven't, we will soon. I mean, it's just part of life and somehow I rather embrace it and go toward it.
'cause I just feel like pain and everyone has so much pain in their life. To be human is to experience pain And to acknowledge it, I think is so much part of . The path to our own humanity because if we can acknowledge it in ourselves, then I think it helps us understand the people around us. Every, everybody's suffering from something.
I mean, it's a sad truth, but it's true. it's the
Kate Shepherd: And it's by design. I think there's even, you know, I'm, I'm not being . Being Pollyanna about like, well, there's a gift in everything, but there really is, you know, I remember when I had my, both of my children and I was like, at the precipice of like, planning their births right? And, you know, do you wanna schedule a c-section?
Do you wanna have drugs or not? Do you wanna, and I wasn't trying to be like a warrior or anything, but I had this very deep knowing that the pain in childbirth was a, I mean, a very important part of that path for me. That I didn't want to numb it if I at all, possibly. And I was lucky enough to manage to deliver them both without having any interventions at all.
I didn't do any drugs or anything like that. And many people can't. And there's, I, there's no judgment. Like if my births had gone on for one more hour, there would've been medical interventions, , like, I just wanna say that. But the idea that we go into things with an, with open arms to feeling pain. I mean, even if, right.
However, that ends up. I think makes the thing less painful and also opens you to a deeper understanding of what's happening and deeper connection. And you can really have a moment with reality. You can really have a moment with life, and it is all fleeting. Like you say, like it's not just our loved ones that are, we're gonna go to , like, and we don't know how to, we don't, we
don't know how to face that.
But I think once we start to, and we can do that through the, I mean, creativity offers us a daily way of, you know,
breaking us, you know, the rejections and the, the dry spells and the bad novels and the terrible paintings and the, I mean, there's a part of, there's an invitation to die and suffer in all of it.
And it's also beautiful.
Track 1: I love what you just said, and I find that a lot of my fictional characters start up being rather repressed. They don't know what they really think
people who need to figure out what they're feeling. And I think that is our journey as humans
Kate Shepherd: So you're in the, I want, I want people to have this sort of image of you where you are right now. You're in this like wood paneled, quaint New Hampshire cabin by the beach, revising your, your novel
Track 1: Yes, we're just on a short vacation in New Hampshire, which is a beautiful state. It has lots of rolling hills. I live in Washington, DC or just, just right outside it. And, uh, we're on a lake and I love swimming, so I'm totally enjoying that part of it. But, um, in, in the basement of this rental cabinet, trying to revise my second novel
So it's actually really lovely.
Kate Shepherd: what's it like now after, after those 20 years of being choiceless or choiceless, making the choice to keep writing and, um,
and, and, persevering, whether, you know, it was happening in quotes happening or not.
To have the success, to have the book published and now to have another one coming and to be, you know, on this vacation and revising it and what's, where are you with all that? What does that feel like for you?
Track 1: I mean, it feels like a miracle. I, you know, , I just felt struck by lightning. Um, three Muses won a publisher's prize, it's been well reviewed and welcomed really beautifully into the world.
And I think the thing that has made me most kind of overwhelmed is going to book groups. I love going to book groups. I will tell your audience that anybody can get in touch with me. going to book groups has been amazing where you can have these one-on-one conversations with readers and it's just a miracle, wait.
They're talking about my characters or I went to one book or where somebody, they got into a huge argument about, you know, something in the novel and I was like, oh my God, they're arguing about my characters. It's amazing. . So I love it. I've had a great time. Um, I think that . Authors in general. I, I, I include myself in this.
The, the promotion side of it can be, daunting and challenging I just cannot believe that I was lucky enough to get a second novel except it for publication.
It's just unbelievable. I'm still pinching myself. There's really no other way to say it. It feels like a miracle. .
I, I do wanna say that that part of what I'm also thinking a lot about this year, is a lot of, you know, how do we pay it forward? So I'm doing a lot of speaking with younger authors. I've always done a lot of mentoring in my life, but, you know, people whose books are, are getting published behind mine or who are seeking publication, you know, I do, I've done a lot, a lot of, um, support to the extent that I can have time and then I can be helpful.
I do a lot of that 'cause I think that's part of appreciating
the fact that I finally got
a book out.
Kate Shepherd: I know from my own teaching I teach art a lot and I learned so much from . People who, you know, say that they've never painted
anything or never done. I mean, I, they teach me, sometimes I'm on my knees, I'm just like, oh my God, I can't believe that. Like, you know, we, we do learn from that
exchange too, right?
Track 1: I think we are lifelong learners and I just
feel that that's so true.
I
Kate Shepherd: I
wanted to go back to something that we touched on a little bit before, which is your past with music. I had read a little bit about your mentor Max, who, taught you three lessons that I really, really loved. , and I wondered if you would tell us a little bit about those.
Track 1: Max Aronoff was my, beloved, beloved music viola teacher in Philadelphia where I grew up on the east coast of the United States. he taught me pretty much everything that you need to know in the world. The first is that the music is in the rests . This is a profound concept and duet for one, is hugely about the music is in the rests.
If you think about it, any piece of music, you are, the pauses in the music is an absolute necessity. If you didn't, it's like it's where you breathe. If you didn't have those spaces, you wouldn't be able to hear the music, you wouldn't be able to control the time in the music. It's just a really, really important concept, and it's so powerful that I'm still trying to figure out what it means.
But I think we've actually been talking about it, you know, where we must pause from our work. We have to, pace ourselves. There's a lot of different ways to interpret the music as in the rest. And rhythm is everything to a musician. if the rhythm is off, it's sort of like a, it's sort of like dusting, you know, it, you dust, nobody notices, but if you don't dust.
but, it's that way if the rhythm is off, the piece doesn't work. , his second piece of advice was, break things apart into component parts and work on each part incrementally. And that is like one of the most important things I think, for writing.
So what that meant in his studio was rather than playing a piece at your lesson, every lesson was about how to practice.
I went to law school after that and I just felt like, okay.
This isn't gonna be a problem for me. I mean, law school's a lot of work, but it was all about, you know, taking one step at a time and not, not waiting till the end to do everything 'cause you can't. And, it's still how I do anything. You know, we talked about how do to write a novel and I said start in the middle, which I agree with.
You know, you only do it piece by piece basically. That's the only, that's the way we have to do things. nothing comes out whole, And then the third is practice, practice, practice. Which is definitely what I feel. I feel that you use the word muscle, I also use that word.
Writing is a muscle and it needs to be strengthened. repetition is hugely a part of how humans learn. practice, practice, practice is really a discipline element. So all of those
Kate Shepherd: Mm-hmm.
Track 1: to me.
Kate Shepherd: ,I think, a lot of people, myself included, have experienced, for the practice, practice, practice part, real kind of, um, disappointment and even maybe some paralyzed stuff going on when what you're practicing sucks.
Like the first things that, you know, that novel that you wrote that sucked, or the painting I just did the other day where I was like, oh, that's, it looked so different in my, in my heart, , you know, or whatever. The, my, I remember my son
who's 11 now, and he was learning trumpet and it was, he was terrible.
He was so frustrated and he wanted to, he actually would cry himself to sleep. He's like, I'm quitting, I'm quitting, I'm quitting. And he got through it, and now he's amazing. , we, there's an aversion to going through the hard part of the practice, like, and when you're writing, it's right there looking at you, right?
Like, it's like a, somehow it's like permanent or it's like you meant it, or look, we can't just let ourselves
do it and
throw it away, or, because I think there was great value in the novel
that you wrote that you say, I don't know if it was good or bad, I didn't read it, but you're saying it wasn't good, so we'll take you at your word.
But I think there was great value in that because just energetically, I could almost see . If you were like a pipe and creativity was trying to come through or a channel and creativity was trying to come through and it was blocked, you know, let's get it out, and that was the sludge. And then now it has, it has
room to let like
the brighter stuff come through.
Like there is value even in the crappy stuff. What would you say to somebody who's listening to this going, yeah, but I just can't get, get over myself, or I can't get, I can't let myself make crappy stuff. It's just too uncomfortable.
Track 1: I usually quote the Malcolm Gladwell theory of 10,000 hours. We don't ask our brain surgeons to, or our doctors, they're not born being a doctor. They have to go to school and they have to go to med school.
Then they have to do clinical practice. They have to be trained. So why should it be that anything else isn't that way? You, you can't, it, you just have to go from A to B to C to D. It's just, so, it's pretty obvious now that I'm kind of on this end of it, and I think I still have, you know, I'm maybe a B at most, you know, I still feel like a beginning writer.
I think, you know, it's just anything that is. It ha any sort of expertise that you wanna develop is gonna take a long time. I mean, think about great chefs. I mean, they all talk about some of the greatest chefs talk about, well, I spent my time in my grandmother's kitchen and she'd let me, you know, or I think my kids are both great bakers.
My younger daughter like to like, stand over the stove and like put egg yolks in our hands and like goo them around and drop 'em on the floor. I'm like, oh my God. But you know what? She's a great
baker .And because I think she went that phase, you know, so I I just feel like it's, uh, the arts are no different.
That's why I'm so maniacal about discipline. There's no reason you should be born knowing how to do this. You have to learn it.
Kate Shepherd: a hundred percent. I totally think so. I wanted to ask you for the person who's listening to this, who, and maybe I'm asking for me, I don't know, but has a writer living them, in them, uh, who wants to write a book, but they really don't know where to start. And I You did say start in the middle, but maybe just in terms of like,
like actually just getting it going, what would you say?
Like, should they like, come up with an idea? What's a, what's just a good, should they be practicing something? What are some practical things that somebody could do to just get that going?
Track 1: are co a few practical things. I have a wonderful mentor in Washington. I take prompt classes with her. In a prompt is basically a word that makes you wanna do something. So you can always invite your own prompts. You can get up every morning or afternoon whenever you do this and write about something that's in your house of work or a lamp or a, just write a thing about it.
Don't edit yourself. Just let it go. So those are, those are exercises that writers use. Prompts are readily available online. you can also, there are really a gazillion what are called generative writing workshops. Generative means you're in there to . Figure out how to get started and do something rather than get something edited.
And every community and every, there's a million online communities, you know, allow for some simple, low stress, low barrier, no barrier classes. Like I, we have the writer center in Washington, dc I, I'm sure there's several of these in Vancouver. I mean, they're, they're all over. But also with internet, you can do this remotely where you're just in a classroom and a teacher will say, write about a table, or Here's a poem.
How does that inspire you? No, no editing. Just get it on the paper. Just do it. Don't, don't think, just do it. other prompts, you know, particularly for you, 'cause you, you're a painter, is, you know, go to the website of some museum and look at a painting and just write about it. describe. You know, a character that you just wanna make up or then I, you know, I've seen people pick random words, like, and just put them in one place and say, you have to do something with these words.
So it's a lot about getting the juices going?
and it, it's, it's really the athlete warming up. It's the same idea, doing your stretches or whatever you would do if you're gonna go for a run,
Kate Shepherd: I love it. I'm gonna try some of those things. I've really enjoyed this conversation with you like so, so much. Really.
Track 1: Me.
Kate Shepherd: Where can people go to find your work? Where's the best place to go? And if they're, if we're listening to this today and we're like, okay, I wanna read her book and then I wanna invite her to my book club, where can they go to do that? What's the best place
Track 1: my website is the same as my name, Martha an toll.com, and there's a link by the book. My book, three Muses is available. any online book seller, meaning Amazon, I like bookshop.org because it's a competitor to Amazon, any bookstore can order it. And i, think that's true in Canada as well. so if your bookstore doesn't have it or your library doesn't have it, they, they shouldn't have any problem ordering and that information is all on my website.
, the second thing is there's a book club. discussion guide on my website under the book tab. And third of all, I think that my, my website has my email on it, how to contact me to come to your book group. And, I really, really mean this. I cannot mean it more sincerely, like I would really appreciate this, in the United States.
I don't know the Canadian system, but you can go to any public library and ask your public library and to buy the book for the library. A fair number of libraries have my book. that's another suggestion. I always like to make a little plug for independent bookstores because we want our local bookstores to stay in
Kate Shepherd: Absolutely. That was great. And I'm gonna put a summary of that all in the show notes so people can, don't worry about writing that down. As you're listening, you can just go and I'll, I'll summarize all that for you. 'cause I'm gonna go to my librarian and see and then I'll, if not, I'll ask them to do that
Thank= you. I wanted to ask you what the next, do you have, like as you're writing, you've got first book is out and then second book is percolating and almost done, and is there a third thing that's kind of waiting in the wings that you're feeding as well?
I have a third project that I've been working on for a couple of years that's taking up a lot of Headspace and not quite ready to talk about it, but I have a first draft that I'm sharing with some readers. And for me the challenge is, um, making the brain space to think about two novels at once.
I'm not great at that, so I have to do that sequentially.
Yeah, I can imagine that would be part of the. Uh, breaking it down into the component parts. And because it is compartmentalizing like you belong here. And, and another idea comes Okay, we'll park you over here for now. It's like, almost like kittens . Yeah.
I have one final question for you today, which is the billboard question. So, at the end of every episode, I ask my guest to think about if they had a billboard that they could put anything on that they knew had some sort of magical power to really reach all of the people out there in the world who long to have this connection with creativity, with creative intelligence, with flow states and inspiration and, you know, letting things that, what, what's trying to come out of them, come out of them.
But for whatever reason, I know there's a lot of them. We have all these limiting beliefs around who, what creativity is, who it's for, how it has to look, how it has to sound, how it has to feel, you know, and we, we get, we make ourselves really small with it. But if your billboard message was gonna inspire people to feel safe to, to just begin to dip their toe into that water, what would you, what would you put on that billboard?
Well, I guess I have two messages. One is to be human, is to be creative. I deeply believe that. And so we all possess that. And the second thing is I
do feel
it's all about love and put some love out in the world. And I think creativity will return to you.
You are an absolutely delightful human being. I'm so, I have no idea. I, I feel like somebody out to me from your team to have you on the show and Yeah,
and I just, like, I and I'm a gut feeling like I don't use this anymore. Like my brain, I'm pointing to my brain. I don't use that like hardly at all for these things.
It's all gut. And my gut was just like, yes. And I had no idea what to expect. But you're delightful and I would love to stay in touch with you. Yeah. I loved
Thank you
so much.
Thank you.
I don't know about you, but I feel like Martha. Shared so many things that can only be known. After going through what she went through in those 20 years of rejection after rejection.
One of my big takeaways from this episode was of course, how music is in the rests. That is something that is so easy to forget. You know, we need to breathe. We need to pause. We need to, there need to be seasons in our creative output. The rests are just as beautiful. As the productive times. We just have to look at them that way.
I love that she'll. Come to your book club. If you read her book and you invite her to your book club, I want to hear about it. So please make sure you drop me a line. And let me know if you do that.
I love her focus on gratitude and paying forward. What she's learned. Mentoring. Uh, others who are behind her on the path. That really is a a critically important part of our success in anything, not just in creative endeavors.
As I mentioned at the top of the show, I'm doing these activating intuition and creativity workshops. The feedback I've been getting on them. Isn't just like what a great workshop, thumbs up. It's like paragraphs from participants about what their experience being in the workshop was like, they really are transformative. Powerful. And it's my honor to pay forward what I know in that way. So again, I invite you to sign up either as a one-off on Kate shepherd, creative.com or sign up for the colorful community tier on the creative genius patron. And join us.
Finally from me today.
Martha shared. I don't hear a lot of people talking about. I
. Was how sometimes the best place to start is in the middle. When we sit down to begin a painting or a chapter or a song or anything that we're creating or doing. The possibilities of where we can go or endless and wanting to create the perfect start. We can get kind of caught up in our heads, believing that if we don't create the perfect start. It won't go where we want it to go. Or it won't go in a good direction or it won't be good. . You know that everything rests on this, on the start. And I love the freedom of. Starting in the middle and just going from there and seeing where it takes you and moving all over the place. I want to leave you with this thought today.
What if you were to allow yourself To do the thing that you love to do the most that you yearn to do the most that's been calling you. . To start that thing right in the middle. Wherever you are right now. And just keep. Going.
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